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Question about new wheel rim vs tire size
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Hi! I registered here about a year ago when I was buying my first road bike but haven't posted anything before now.

I have a 2019 Specialized Tarmac SL6 Disc Sport and love it. I recently decided to upgrade my wheels for races and bought a set of Shimano WH-RS770 Ultegra wheels. They haven't been delivered yet.

I also purchased some Conti GP5000 TL 28mm tires. Here is where I think I messed up. I figured because the roads here in Hawaii are awful and I'm reasonably heavy (200lb) I could use the extra cushion on a high-speed descent. But with my relative inexperience I hadn't thought about frame clearance, aero (I'm probably not a fast enough rider to really need aero, but it's still a factor), etc.

The tires arrived before the wheels and I can return them for some 25s. I'd really rather not open the package at $70/tire and then find out they are useless.

I know "tire width" questions are about as welcome as a political debate, but I could really use some experienced insight. Will these tires fit on my bike at all with this wheelset? If so, ho bad is the profile going to be and will that be a detriment in an olympic triathlon? I'll never do an ironman or even a century ride most likely, but I did buy this bike and tire set to do as much damage as I can and would like to make it count.

Thanks to all for helping. Also, I tried to find where to post this and chose as best I can. No hurt feelings if a moderator needs to move it.

Edit: it may help to know that the stock rims are 20mm internal, but the Shimano wheels are 17mm internal. I know that makes a difference but not sure how. Also, I've read that Specialized says that the Tarmac has 30mm clearance based on actual inflated tire dimensions.
Last edited by: PedalingHertz: Aug 10, 19 2:33
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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Why did you pay $70 per tire?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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The wheels you've selected, other that being tubeless, are unlikely to show any noticeable improvement over the stock wheels. You save less than 40 grams, get a 1mm deeper front and 5mm deeper rear, but drop from a 20 to a 17 mm internal width. I don't know if either has been wind tunnel tested, but there are better and cheaper shallow rims available. If you want something deeper and weight isn't an issue for you, save your money a little longer and get Hed Jet+ 4s or 6s when they go one sale.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [FatandSlow] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you. I supposed that is the answer to the question I should have asked: what kind of wheels should I get?

I'm amazed to hear that they wouldn't be a significant improvement at $600 for a set. Not that price is everything, but the reviews were very good and considered a solid "upgrade wheel." Which is obviously a very general and subjective statement.

So, is that a consensus that the wheels are not worth the cost paid? Again, I can return them.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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HED Jet Plus 4 or 6.

Have you ever installed tubeless tires?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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I've never installed them but figured my LBS could. I was going to have them do it because I don't see myself getting sealant right without a huge mess. I wanted tubeless to avoid pinch flats in a race. I can change a tire, but the race will be over and all the food gone by the time I'm done. I know that comes with practice and I've only changed a few.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't - I misstated the price by accident. I think they had been listed for more on other sites before I purchased where I did. Just looked it up and they were $57/tire. Still more than I care to waste, although from the looks of things that may be the least of my worries now.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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How much does your bike shop charge to install tubeless tires?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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My shameless plug is that I have a brand new set of DT Swiss P1800 wheels if you want em. I bought them and found I couldn’t use them. Long story.

Anywho- everybody is riding 28’s these days if they can. Wider rims are the thing as well as larger tires. I found I couldn’t run continental gp4000 tires on my 2016 tarmac. The tires were just way bigger than other brand 28’s. I now run Vittoria Corsa G+ tires in 28. They appear to be good. I don’t know if the GP5000 is more true to size than the GP4000.

Also, probikekit.com and other online stores have pretty aggressive tire prices that are hard to ignore.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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It depends on what needs to be done but for a new tubeless ready wheel/tire that doesn't need a bunch of sealant cleaned out etc they estimated $100 total.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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Do you feel that $100 to install two tires is a reasonable amount?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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If I can't figure it out it would be lol.

I used to have a little diesel tractor that I loved tinkering on. Rewired it and did all the normal maintenance myself. I was a hundred times more capable working on it than I am these little precise bicycle parts. And I still paid someone else to put new tires on it. :)

I do hate paying for what I could do myself of course.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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How many flat tires do you think you might get each year?

What are you going to do if you get a flat when out on a training ride?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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Not sure how many per year. I had one not long after getting the bike when I hit a Texas pothole. Called my wife for pickup and changed the tire at home myself. Not a problem but it did take a long time.

Hawaii roads are terrible compared to where we lived in Texas. The patched potholes are somehow worse than the actual potholes. There are few bike lanes and they are littered with debris. Flats, especially pinch flats, seem inevitable.

I also figured tubeless at a bit lower pressure might save my back from the vibration of the rough roads.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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jimatbeyond wrote:
Do you feel that $100 to install two tires is a reasonable amount?

At that rate of pay I'm going to pack in my engineering job and move into the tyre replacement industry.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [BobAjobb] [ In reply to ]
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I know it seems steep, but we're talking about Honolulu. Everything here is absurdly expensive. We're paying nearly 4k/mo for rent on a 1700 square foot house and it doesn't even have air conditioning. And that was a pretty good deal for the area we got.

While I do try to limit my spending by buying everyday things on base, etc. I truly don't mind spending my money one of my few chosen hobbies when it's appropriate. And supporting the local bike scene, which is struggling here.

Back to the original post: I have obtained return shipping labels for a whopping $7. I will return them and find something more advantageous. I had previously had a Hunt 30mm/50mm front/rear combo planned but went with this based on price.

I'm concerned about crosswinds with too deep a front wheel. It can get VERY windy here (except on Saturdays when I want to go kiteboarding, apparently). I don't want to get pushed around too hard. Is that a legitimate concern for a rider my weight?

Again, I really appreciate everyone's help. I welcome random shout outs to wheels you think would be good. I looked up the HEDs mentioned and like them so far!
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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I would highly recommend Continental GP5000 clincher tires with latex tubes and sealant.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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Tubes AND sealant? In a non-tubeless version? Mind *blown*

I'm assuming the idea is the tubes still work but if they fail there's a good chance the tire will hold pressure? Or is it just to stop small punctures?

What about these wheels? This is what I first had my sights set on before wrongly assuming the Shimano wheels would be just as good at 3/5 the price...

https://www.huntbikewheels.cc/...n-aero-disc-wheelset
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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Those Hunt wheels are nowhere close to being as fast as HED.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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Good to know! Can you help me understand why? What specs am I looking for to help me tell which wheel will be faster?
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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PedalingHertz wrote:
Good to know! Can you help me understand why? What specs am I looking for to help me tell which wheel will be faster?
Wind tunnel testing, mostly.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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Rim shape.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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That sounds like *not* the sort of thing I would be able to tell from a spec sheet. :/

Is there an equivalent metric to a ballistic coefficient that wheel makers post somewhere? When I was handloading rifle rounds (i.e. when I lived on a land mass large enough to easily practice long-range marksmanship), every bullet had this type of info listed (usually on the box, but certainly on the manufacturer's website). It makes "this vs this" comparisons much easier (until you get into comparisons at different velocities, at least).

Right now, I'm leaning towards the HED Jet 4 plus on the front, and 9 on the back. Is that too excessive? Some people run full disc wheels so it can't be too crazy, right?
Last edited by: PedalingHertz: Aug 10, 19 22:19
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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As mentioned by HTupolev, wind tunnel testing don't lie.

Certain rim shapes are significantly faster.
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Re: Question about new wheel rim vs tire size [PedalingHertz] [ In reply to ]
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PedalingHertz wrote:
That sounds like *not* the sort of thing I would be able to tell from a spec sheet. :/

Is there an equivalent metric to a ballistic coefficient that wheel makers post somewhere? When I was handloading rifle rounds (i.e. when I lived on a land mass large enough to easily practice long-range marksmanship), every bullet had this type of info listed (usually on the box, but certainly on the manufacturer's website). It makes "this vs this" comparisons much easier (until you get into comparisons at different velocities, at least).

Right now, I'm leaning towards the HED Jet 4 plus on the front, and 9 on the back. Is that too excessive? Some people run full disc wheels so it can't be too crazy, right?
There's not much disadvantage to running high depth or even discs out back, since it doesn't really affect steering. It does tend to be heavier (a tension-spoked wheel with a shallow rim is a design of absolutely ridiculous structural efficiency), but that's about it.
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