That's a silly question. It never comes down to picking between a lottery spot and a spot that was earned. If that was the case, everyone would want to say they "earned their way" to Kona. No doubt.

But if the lottery is the only path to Kona, a good percentage of people would take the lottery. I don't know how many people sign up for the lottery each year (I've heard numbers around 2,000 or so) -- they have obviously found peace with the lottery issue.

You got that on the money Steve. I like many have that as my ultimate goal, however, being in 40-44 ag and in Europe the likelihood is that a lottery is just as likely a way for me to get there.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

When people ask which Ironman I have done I always state that I lotteried (word??) in 1999. I would never mislead people into thinking I qualified.

The world championships should be a championship with the only method to gain entry is through qualification.

I would feel out of place in Hawaii unless I qualified. Which, by the way, I have the same chances at becoming the president tomorrow.

I respect your thoughts - but as long as WTC offers lottery spots, there will be many triathletes who apply. Are you upset with the athletes who apply to the lottery or the WTC for offering the opportunity in the first place?

I have always felt that if I couldnt qualify, I simply just dont belong there and Im ok with that. I met a guy in the transition area at a race that had a Kona sticker on his bike. I asked him where he qualified at, and he looked away from me and mumbled... lottery. Seemed like he wasnt so proud of that.

I would definitely take the lottery b/c there is no way I could ever qualify. I am realistic about that. I did 15:03 at CDA this year. I am proud of my accomplishment, but after seeing some of the top qualifying AG'ers, I know I have neither the time nor talent to pull it off.

I would argue that the lottery really represents the true spirit of IM. The race began as a dare to overcome such a huge challenge, not to see who was the best. Average, amatuer athletes started it and most if not all of the original ones would never qualify today. It was the idea that you could even complete an insane event that made the race special. The "Championship" at IMH came later when a marketing guru figured a way to bring the race to the continental states and create this franchise. Today, the "spots" earned represent more of supply and demand economics than finding out who is the "champion". The lottery is the one quality of IMH that I admire.

As for the athletes who are blessed to qualify, I do not understand why it would bother you that less than 10% of the people there got in for the lottery. They take nothing away from the race; you will pass them easily within the first 5 minutes of the swim (if they even seed themselves ahead of you); and, lets face it, their 16:xx crawling finish is way more exciting than your boring 10:30 time.

Elites are amusing. They complain about us, but if were not for the MOP's and BOP's, you would not exist. Also, there is alot more of us than there are of you. If we did not finance the majority of the race entries, there would be no race.

Just enjoy the sport the way it was intended: completing the challenge in a fun and safe way (no matter what your time goals are).

Mike

Post: After all this lottery discussion.

I'm curious how many people would take a slot that was given to them vs. qualifying?

I like the challenge of earning my slot!


Reply:

Some of us find the challenge to come more from the race itself, then whether we won the lottery or qualified. As a lottery winner, I wasn't about to give anything less than 110%, even if it meant walking the bike in.

I agree with you in the absolute sense. I realize this is extreme, but it would be similar to the situation if the IOC/IAAF, left lane open in the Olympic Games 100m dash for someone to get into the final, or even the heats on a lottery!

But then again the WTC is not a sports governing body like the IAAF or the IOC, it's a private business, and they can do as they like and not answer to anyone other then their customers and sponsors.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Mike,

You raise some solid points, but I beg to differ on your characterization of the "elites". I think many of the elites understand fully the genesis of this sport and the spirit of Ironman. Many of these elites are very supportive of the average athletes; many still hang out at the IM finish, hours after they've raced, just to cheer on the late-nighters. Christian Sadowski, who posted above, did not qualify, yet everyone I know, qualifiers included, acknowledge that his finish was perhaps the best of all.

My sense is that most that complain about the alternative avenues to gain entry to Hawaii have not been there. While that's probably overly-generalized, the spirit of "we're all in this together" was quite evident to me at Hawaii. It's not an us and them mentality. I met many people this year, and invariably everyone will ask where you qualified, and not a single person gave me an odd look, made a comment or made me feel ashamed that I did not qualify when I responded in that fashion.

This is a rare sport in that fashion. Let's keep it that way.

Robert

Robert,

I agree with you 100%. The sheer number of athletes cheering me on and others behind me was amazing. Most of the elites who waited at the finish were there longer than it took me to complete the marathon! That is something to be applauded. My comments are really directed at this website. It seems that what people say on this forum and what the do at the races are two different things. Its kind of like the road rage mentality: if you cannot see your neighbor in person, you are more likely to bad mouth them. As for the finish line at IM races, the distinction between the top finishers and the rest of us does melt away. I just wish that attitude could be reflected more in this forum.

And, thanks for cheering us on.

Mike

The whole thing is hypocritical....but so it life.



Personally, I'd never go to Kona in a lottery spot. To me..it's supposed to be the Ironman World Championships.

However, since the WTC has a lottery...I understand why people would want to participate and can respect that.

Dude, you rock. How to put on a gutsy show for all those pros that couldn't bother to finish. Everybody saw you out there and got pumped up!

A friend of mine was there through the lottery. He finished in 16 and change despite throwing up 12 times and burning the inside of his mouth. He's an Ironman. You betcha!

"Are you upset with the athletes who apply to the lottery or the WTC for offering the opportunity in the first place? "

Not at all. I perfectly understand why someone would want to race on that course. The history alone is enough to make it a great experience. I would simply feel out of place at the world championships without qualifying. But, that doesn't mean someone else wouldn't be fine with it. I would like to see the sport have a true world championship though.

Read Iron Will by Mike Plant

Cmdr. Collins insisted on the lottery in order to preserve some of the original spirit of the IM--not really WTC's call.

Personally I would rather go do other iron-distance races--don't plan on qualifying--but I think that the fact that anyone can get in is part of what makes the race unique.

Having foolishly turned down "earned slots" twice and then coming within 8 seconds once and sub 10 min a number of times, there is no way I would go to Hawaii unless I qualified. For me there is no real attraction in doing Hawaii other than achieved the goal of having qualified. I may have to slug it out for another 30 years until I am 69 to make it happen, but if I am the last man standing, that may be the way for me to "qualify" :-).

Good luck to all in pursuing their dreams. The lottery is certainly a legit way of getting in, as many are not genetically blessed enough to actually post the crazy fast times required to earn a slot through qualification, regardless of how many hours of training they do :-)

How are you guys on the age-group thing? If it truly is the "World Championships", then they ought to eliminate age groups too - don't you think? There are no age groups in the Olympics!

Just a random observation-

I wonder how many people who qualified for Kona didn't make the 13-hour Slowtwitch cutoff this year. And how many lottery winners DID break 13?? Which gets more respect in the land of Slowtwitch??

Even if they did not allow age groups, it would not be a true world championship. INA uses the term "world championship", but it is simply a name used by a private business to attract paying customers. You could organize a 10 km race tomorrow and call it the "Yada Yada Yada World Championship".

In a true world championship (swimming, ice hockey, track & field, etc) participants do NOT pay $500/person to participate. In fact, often they get paid just for showing up. Also entrants do not qualify by participating in events sanctioned by a private business, but by competing in an event sanctioned by the world governing body for that sport.

The NBA is somewhat different, they call the NBA champion "NBA world champion" however competition is limited to the USA and Toronto. Everybody else is excluded from participating. The true world champion in basketball is the team that wins the FIBA world championship.

I'm always suprised when I hear or read people slamming the lottery. In a sense, I understand their sentiment but I don't think this equates to reserving a lane in the pool or on the track in the olympics. There are very very few people who have a shot at medaling at Kona, whether overall or in their AG. The lottery system in no way impacts these contenders. Nobody with a shot is left out because of the lottery.

I think it's awesome that Kona is attainable to the average age grouper via the lottery. This sport is all about the age groupers and MOPers.

Of course I'd much prefer going to Kona by qualifying rather than through the lottery. I haven't put my name in for the lottery yet, but I'm sure at some point that I will.

Well, I'm not that genetically gifted, and I don't think i'll ever have the chance to qualify for Kona. However, I will never apply for the lottery. That race is not for me. I love the Tour de France, but I also know that i will never be able to race along side Lance and company. That's ok too, that race is not for me. But what i can do is race in my races, and set goals for myself and challange myself. I was in Kona schlepping for my g/f this year and it was amazing. She has been there 2 times and that is her race. I'm ok with that.

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-Erik

"I don't half-ass anything. For me its either whole-ass or nothing." -elake