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Re: Punching a woman during a race? [bhobbs] [ In reply to ]
 
This was why I asked, if this happened in the swim would we care? Hell if this happened without a camera would the RD essentially do what now amounts to a "PR" move.

I almost feel like the RD was seemingly caught where he had to do something, especially with the video evidence (my iPhone won't play it so I can't look at fault of each person). But from what people say about the video, sounds like a bit over zealous in ruling and "interpertation" of what he saw, which can be in bad form if done unjustly.

Sounds like the runner ran/shoved the woman and was total dbag move, but did he deserve a DQ while she never received anything even with evidence of all the rule(s) she seemed to break as well. It seems likes the RD definitely took sides and by doing so created even more of a sticky situation.

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [Richard Izzo] [ In reply to ]
 
Richard Izzo wrote:
Again just so that we all understand when you see the video, she is in the correct lane of outgoing traffic while he is across the double yellow line (running in the wrong direction).
If he stayed on the correct side of the run course there would never have been a collision. The finish line was about 20-30yrds further down the rd- so he was not IN the finishline, nor even close to finishing. He chose to take a line that was closest to the rt turn he was eventually going to make.

The bruise on her face (which I saw post race), the account of numerous witness', the photo, the video and the opinion of the head USAT official led to his DQ which we stand by.

I know that we have all grown to accept the "folklore" of a triathlon swim and the rough housing that goes on. But civility and sportsmanship are the things that we as RDs want our grass roots events to inspire.
Both Dev and I as well a lot of you have raced for >24 yrs and can remember when this never occurred or was tolerated.
And because it was not tolerated it did not happen.

Our focus is to provide that grass roots feel, family oriented experience but to make sure that all racers are safe and get the same challenge and accomplishment as the pros do. I thank Dev for recognizing the amount of work that goes on behind the scenes to make sure any race can go on, especially a long course one.

We do not do it for money but for the love of the sport.
So we will not tolerate unsportsmanlike behavior when it goes against the very foundation of what we stand for.

Every racer counts.

See all of you in IN, NY and our newest race in AZ!!! soon to be announced :)

Rich


Dear Mr. Izzo,

How the hell did this incident bruise her face?? Your credibility is gone.
Last edited by: bhobbs: Sep 23, 13 20:49
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [cjacobson] [ In reply to ]
 
cjacobson wrote:
I've been withholding judgment until seeing the video. After watching it, and reading the several related blogs and whatnot, I'm going to have to say the woman in question is mostly at fault here. Perhaps Blair should have stopped and checked, but the woman clearly was the impetus for contact. To call the contact a punch in the face, or to insinuate that she was thrown to the ground crying as even the RD had stated is such a gross misstatement of facts it borders on the absurd.

Now, admittedly I can be a bit of a heartless jerk, so I showed my wife the video (who barely has a competitive bone in her body and only enjoys the occasional stroller 5k and family jog). I simply asked who she thought was at fault. Her response was "why is that woman walking backwards on the road?" I then explained the fantastic thread to her, and she's since taken to reading all the linked blogs. She's convinced me that the woman in the video is a far worse person than Mr. DQ. She's smarter (and far more compassionate) than me, so I'll go with her opinion.

Interesting, the conversation with my wife went nearly the same as yours. My wife was a race director for about 5 years and can't believe the guy was DQ'd and see wasn't.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [bhobbs] [ In reply to ]
 
Thank you. Now hopefully we'll get an answer.

Mike Sparks


I have competed well, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith.
Last edited by: Sparks: Sep 23, 13 21:18
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [Richard Izzo] [ In reply to ]
 
Richard Izzo wrote:
Paul,

After several spectators reported the incident post race and corroboration from a picture and video, we brought this to the head USAT official Russ Gold for his opinion. He looked at the picture and referred this matter to USAT who came back to us with a referral to DQ the competitor for Unsportsmanlike Conduct.
Ultimately it was my decision that the athlete be DQ'd because even though she MIGHT have been in his way this is NEVER an excuse to punch someone else. To his credit he sent back his award and medal without a major complaint because he knew that what he had done was not called for and done in a moment of emotion (rushing to the finish of a race).

It is also not apparent from the photo but he was running far to right when they collided when the run course was marked for incoming runners to stay left before making a rt turn into the finishline chute (about 20 yrds further down from the spot of their collision) and outgoing runners to stay to their left coming out of T2 (so as not to have any collisions).

From the spectators who came forward to report this, to the woman herself that did not want to make an issue of it, to the USAT Officials, to our staff, I think this was the right decision.

As both a racer and organizer for over 25 yrs I can honestly say that I was appalled by this.

Our race is a family oriented event that focuses on the athletes experience as well as safety.
There is no room for behavior such as this and this will never be tolerated.

Richard Izzo Race Director Toughman Half, Toughkids Triathlon Series.

I don't want to say that you don't know your own run course, but you don't know your own run course.

In the video, you can clearly see 2 runners on the right hand side of the road, running away from the camera. They are running the same direction as the older gentleman that enters the screen at the end of the video. This is the same side of the road the "victim" should have been on. Clearly he was supposed to be running on his right side of the road and he in fact veered to his left in order to avoid the eventual contact.

If I am wrong and you are right about the course, then every single person in this video is running on the wrong side of the road except your girlfriend.

Sir, your credibility and competence are now both in the toilet.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [Sparks] [ In reply to ]
 
He's a race director, not the pope. But since you asked, I'll take out my f-bomb.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [Sparks] [ In reply to ]
 
Will you please now edit your post where you quoted me using the word fuck.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [cjacobson] [ In reply to ]
 
cjacobson wrote:
I've been withholding judgment until seeing the video. After watching it, and reading the several related blogs and whatnot, I'm going to have to say the woman in question is mostly at fault here. Perhaps Blair should have stopped and checked, but the woman clearly was the impetus for contact. To call the contact a punch in the face, or to insinuate that she was thrown to the ground crying as even the RD had stated is such a gross misstatement of facts it borders on the absurd.

Last Clear Chance doctrine. Yes, she may have been an inattentive, self-absorbed and inconsiderate racer, but he CLEARLY could have avoided the contact all together. And yes, there was no punch, but it looks like he put a little oomph in that shove.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [tballco] [ In reply to ]
 
tballco wrote:
Burnt Toast wrote:
needmoreair wrote:
tballco wrote:

She's an idiot... but just because someone is being an idiot doesn't mean you can hurt them. If a pedestrian jaywalks that doesn't mean you can run them over. That's what he did. Ran her over knowingly.

Watch his steps leading up to the impact. He never changes course when he easily could have.

He also doesn't, god forbid, slow down. He saw her being an idiot from a long way coming. He should have slowed down when approaching her, just as you slow down approaching a dangerous situation on your bike or in your car.



Uh, no he didn't. He no more ran over her than punched her in the face.

Some of you have a piss poor ability to accurately describe something. And that's precisely what's caused such an overly excessive uproar in the first place.

And let's face it, the uproar and brutal condemnation from the peanut galleries seems way excessive in light of this video.


Exactly.


OK, he didn't run her over knowingly. He ran into her knowingly, so that makes it OK?

In light of this video, the brutal condemnation is warranted, IMO.

How about not stopping to check that she's OK. That's OK too?


Stopping to check on her was much more crucial to the case when it was alleged that she was knocked to the ground.

Not only was she NOT knocked down, but she even gave a WTF look and gesture.

People bump and jostle ALL the time in running and cycling. Absolutely no reason to have to turn around and check every time you come into contact with someone.

The more I look at this video and consider the scenario, the less serious I think this incident is. It's a complete farce how this woman and her blogger blew it up in the way they did. And a complete farce the guy was DQed.

The entire race is a complete farce from the look and description of the run course (honestly, how does no one know what side to run on?) and the actions of the competitors and RD.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [AJHull] [ In reply to ]
 
I agree. More punching please.

What has made me laugh is everyone yelling about how the blog post blew the incident out of proportion but here ST is, 580+ posts into the thread, and more has been said on this thread than any blog post.

People really need to spend more time training and less time on ST. (Sorry Dan)

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [JenSw] [ In reply to ]
 
JenSw wrote:
I agree. More punching please.

What has made me laugh is everyone yelling about how the blog post blew the incident out of proportion but here ST is, 580+ posts into the thread, and more has been said on this thread than any blog post.

People really need to spend more time training and less time on ST. (Sorry Dan)

Maybe you missed the original blog?

And the dozens of comments the blogger deleted that were detailing what REALLY happened?

And maybe you missed the sanctimonious b.s. that the woman fed anyone who'd listen to her?

Without the blog this never would have gotten a whiff of attention from anyone. And the antics of the blogger and then the woman and then the RACE DIRECTOR were just gasoline on the little spark of "conflict" that blew it all out of proportion.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [npage148] [ In reply to ]
 
npage148 wrote:
That video definitely doesn't do her any favors. She staggering around crossing the full lane. It's unclear where they belong (evidenced by the guy at the end running on the right) and he was getting squeezed between her and the other guy. Heck, when i'm racing I check intersections to make sure they are clear. I would never stagger around backwards like her

Exactly.

And this is probably the very reason why Mr. Blogsalot and the woman didn't post the video. Because it blows their b.s. allegations out of the water.

So instead they post ridiculous photos, make ridiculous assertions, and then blatantly delete and ignore any protests to the contrary.

Just scum.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [bhobbs] [ In reply to ]
 
Done.

Mike Sparks


I have competed well, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [needmoreair] [ In reply to ]
 
You have a big emotional investment in this for some reason. Do you know him or are you him?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [bhobbs] [ In reply to ]
 
"If I am wrong and you are right about the course, then every single person in this video is running on the wrong side of the road except your girlfriend."

No...after she get's whacked she starts running on the wrong side of the road as well.

 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [JenSw] [ In reply to ]
 
JenSw wrote:
You have a big emotional investment in this for some reason. Do you know him or are you him?


No emotional investment in the least. I've never heard of him, her, or the race itself. I couldn't care less if they were both DQed, sued, or shampooed. I just find it interesting and an entertaining way to spend a few hours of my working day.

And I like to debate. And I like to be right.

And it looks like I've been right all along.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [kdw] [ In reply to ]
 
kdw wrote:
"If I am wrong and you are right about the course, then every single person in this video is running on the wrong side of the road except your girlfriend."

No...after she get's whacked she starts running on the wrong side of the road as well.

And with another couple of steps would have backed into yet ANOTHER competitor.

You couldn't script it, honestly.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [needmoreair] [ In reply to ]
 
How did this non story ever get to this? There's no punch and barely a shove. What there is, is contact between a self absorbed woman not paying the slghtest bit of attention to her surroundings and a guy trying to finish his race. After seeing her finish line pictures with seven kids in tow, I was completely unsurprised by the actual video.

I'd love to hear from the race director again as to why three other people in the video are clearly running on the wrong side of the road if she was on the correct side.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [dgunthert] [ In reply to ]
 
Never has Ludacris been more appropriate. "Move bitc#, get out the way".
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [sharkbait_au] [ In reply to ]
 
There's an awful lot of hatred and anger in this thread. A whole bunch of you on both sides need anger management lessons. Seriously.


---------------------------------------------------------
The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits. -- A fake Albert Einstein "quote"
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [KonaCoffee] [ In reply to ]
 
KonaCoffee wrote:
There's an awful lot of hatred and anger in this thread. A whole bunch of you on both sides need anger management lessons. Seriously.

Quoted for extreme truthiness.

Here are the facts: competitive dude stiff arms a woman who was backing into his way. Whether he could have avoided her or not we can't actually know. He may not have seen her backing up until the last moment. Only he knows. Where he made a mistake was not immediately stopping and apologizing or at a minimum checking to see if she was all right.

Everything else is window dressing and over reactions.

Let it go people.

===============
Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [dgunthert] [ In reply to ]
 
dgunthert wrote:
How did this non story ever get to this? There's no punch and barely a shove. What there is, is contact between a self absorbed woman not paying the slghtest bit of attention to her surroundings and a guy trying to finish his race. After seeing her finish line pictures with seven kids in tow, I was completely unsurprised by the actual video.

I'd love to hear from the race director again as to why three other people in the video are clearly running on the wrong side of the road if she was on the correct side.

Deception and lies, deception and lies.

There's a lot I'd like to hear from the RD. Like why he felt compelled to lie and encourage this deceitful story and why that woman wasn't DQed while the guy was.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [KonaCoffee] [ In reply to ]
 
Other than kinda making a douchebag comment (we don't know if he checked to see if she was ok), he really didn't do anything wrong. Considering her size he did not put much force into the push at all. The funny thing is, the push did not correct her apathetic attitude towards safety, as the video cuts out she is about to cream a second runner.

The blogger cherry picked the perfect photo to make it look like a bigger incident than it actually was.
Last edited by: furiousferret: Sep 23, 13 22:40
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [needmoreair] [ In reply to ]
 
If for nothing else, I think the guy should have his DQ reversed simply because he didn't go all out with the b.s. like the blogger, woman, and RD did.

He stayed completely out of it and let us all have our say until the video came about and expressed what a ridiculous witchhunt this has been.

Kudos to him in that regard. Wonder if he's read through all of this stuff? Yikes.
 
Re: Punching a woman during a race? [furiousferret] [ In reply to ]
 
None of that matters in regards to this thread. The vitriol exhibited here is bad. Very bad. Even for Slowtwitch. The anger people seem to feel the need to express on the pages really needs taming.


---------------------------------------------------------
The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits. -- A fake Albert Einstein "quote"
 

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