He has also one at least one prologue TT too.

http://www.bikeradar.com/...wins-prologue-16047/

Thor started the festivities by attacking at 47km to go. See the cyclingnew.com live report.

At 39km to go Cancellara surges again to get it down to him, Thor and Ballan.

At about 32km to go Cancellara sits up in in frustration.

At 25km to go, the gap is up to 1:10 and Garmin is now leading the chase.

At somewhere less than 18km to go Van Summeren goes it alone.

So it seems obvious to me that between 39 and 32 km to go, Garmin had not decided on Van Summeren as their man (evidence by Garmin CHASING at 25km to go). If Thor was hurting that bad, it would not make sense for Garmin to be chasing with Cancellara in the group. It seems obvious that they still wanted Thor to be up with the leaders. The only thing that makes sense is that they were purely working against Calcellara. I think it is weak to see the World Champion using those kind of tactics. You can't say he was protecting JVS because Garmin was chasing a few km later. You can't say that he was hurting because the team was still trying to get him up to the lead group a few km later. What other reason could it be than working against Cancellara?

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That Garmin domestique (Sep Vanmarcke) was clearly stronger than Hushovd himself.

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I agree. As you poinit out, and what I said in another post, seem to be lost on most posters. What they are saying makes sense ntil you look at the distance and times of splits when this was going on. Alan Shearer makes good points also. If JVS did not win, you combine Garmins placings with the amount of teamates at under 40k, plus their attitude at Flanders till and even aftet BMC pulled, well yes..............I do not have much admiration for Vaughters. We will ot even get into all his cycling clean stuff, compared to known comments and such while he was riding

You can't say he was protecting JVS because Garmin was chasing a few km later.

I agree.

You can't say that he was hurting because the team was still trying to get him up to the lead group a few km later.

I disagree. That Thor may have been on the rivit when holding Cancellara's wheel doesn't mean that he still wasn't Garmin's best bet. Being on the edge doesn't mean that he's hurting, that he cannot recover, or that he doesn't have a chance.

Taking a pull would have played into Cancellara's game, it would likely have wiped Thor out nad freed up Cancellara for a successful attack a few kilos up the road.

If you're going to criticize Thor's tactics, you'll have to explain how taking a pull would have been to his advantage? How would it have increased his or Garmin's chances of winning the race?

Since they obviously did not at that point think that JVS was "the guy", they had a much better chance with Thor working than sitting behind Cancellera as Cancellera sat up. If Thor works, then possibly/probably they get their main guy, you know the World Road Champion up into the front group. If he doesn't work, then the guy that they don't believe in (yet at least) is left to fend for himself against a bunch of other riders.

How about this scenario? Garmin let's Thor work and tells JVS to sit on telling the others "my team leader is coming". When Thor arrives, JVS attacks and puts Fabian into chase mode again while Thor gets the arm chair ride to the finish.

And Thor doesn't have to match Fabian pull for pull to keep Fabian happy, he just has to help some so it's not so obvious that he's towing a parasite to the line.

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Kevin

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"Taking a pull would have played into Cancellara's game, it would likely have wiped Thor out nad freed up Cancellara for a successful attack a few kilos up the road."

Exactly. I do not understand how Thor can be accused of "weak" racing by avoiding riding into Cancellara's strength and riding off the front with FC in a two-up break. The moment Cancellara would have had Thor alone on his wheel riding to the front, Thor would have been a dead man. Cancellara would have succeeded in soloing away to victory at that point.

Interesting choice of words, considering they are a sponsor of Garmin-Cervelo.

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This whole scenario reminds me of a passage from Tim Krabbe's 'The Rider' describing the outcome of the '77 TDF:

Tour de France, 1977. During the decisive stage, Van Impe made his escape, and at a given point, had such a huge lead that it seemed the Tour was in his Pocket.

Behind him, three riders had come together: Thevenet (in the yellow jersey), Kuiper and Zoetemelk, the only other riders who still had a chance. Thevenet was riding lead; the two Dutchmen were refusing to help. Kuiper planned to lick Thevenet's plate clean before starting on his own. If at that point Thevenet had done what his team manager advised him to do, namely allow the two Ductchmen to hang themselves with their own rope, he would have hanged with them and all three would have lost the Tour.

But Thevenet shouldered the blackmailing of the yellow jersey and of his ambition, and pulled the lead for the others. As was to be expected, Kuiper and Zoetemelk profited from this by escaping from Thevenet's wake on the last mountain. Zoetemelk cracked, but Kuiper passed Van Impe, who was badly cracked as well, and won the stage. But not the yellow jersey; in a fantastic comeback, during which he forced things harder than he had ever forced them in his career, Thevenet was able to keep the damage precisely within bounds and kep the yellow jersey all the way to Paris

His scheme had failed , but what Kuiper did was coolly calculating, tactically perfect and constituted his best shot at winning the Tour de France. But it also sprang from a less generous heart than he's usually given credit for. Because, at the level of a Kuiper or a Thevenet, the sport is exclusively about honor. And no matter how Kuiper had advanced his chances of winning the Tour by hanging on Thevenet's wheel, he had destroyed every chance of winning the Tour grandly.

Thevenet won it grandly.

A lot has changed in the past week-your racing tactics can be questioned even when you win, and Fabian Cancellara is a bit of a whiny bitch.

You're forgetting about the other guys in the race. Guesdon was up front in the break and attacked, taking Rast, Bak and VanSummeren with him. Those four got a nice gap to the remaining break and were going away. VanSummeren clearly had to mark that move, since Guesdon is a former PR winner and was a threat to ride away for the win. When Guesdon flatted, it left Rast, Bak and Vansummeren clear of the break at about 15k, and about a minute up on the Cancellara group. I am willing to bet that is the point that the decision was made for VanSummeren to play for the win. It IS about when he took off, leaving Rast and Bak, who have stronger sprints. It is not until Cancellara regathered himself after this and took off that Hushovd finally did not make his wheel...
The race was more than Garmin and FC. One thing is for sure, Thor's tactics were greatly simplified when Boonen and Chavenel had their issues and dropped out of contention. Ride on FC's wheel to the front and sprint for the win. Only when FC sat up for a moment did Thor falter in hanging right where he ought to have...and likely by design...given the timing and gap at that point...but perhaps not.

Or maybe Thor really is a pussy and doesn't deserve the WC stripes.

That is what I suggested earlier. That tactic shows logic and reason though :)

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+1


Liggett and Sherwen talk way too much about far too few riders.


In the U.S., the commentators on Universal Sports are not more knowledgeable than Liggett and Sherwen, but they are aware of that and don't ramble on and on about the same few riders and who "unbelievable" every attack is. I greatly prefer coverage on that channel.

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But don't take my word for it.

Here's Cancellara: " I wasn’t getting much help. It’s hard to win all by yourself in those conditions,” Cancellara said. “It was full-gas all day. There was no rest. My team did what they could, but Garmin was the strongest team today. We don’t have to search for excuses. They played it smart today. Now they get that victory they were searching for for a long, long time. I gave the maximum today"

So here's my analogy: you say it's chickenshit to purely work against cancellara. Do you think it's dumb to play box and 1 against michael jordan--would it be more macho to play him man on man? How about playing quarters coverage against peyton manning? When there's a clearly clearly dominant racer in the bunch it's not chickenshit to work against him. It's adaptation. If you let michael jordan tear you apart because you're playing man defense against him that strikes me as stupid.

Perhaps I'm wrong and Fabian isn't so strong so as to necessitate these tactics, but looking at the number of teams who are employing them I don't think that's the case.

Since they obviously did not at that point think that JVS was "the guy", they had a much better chance with Thor working than sitting behind Cancellera as Cancellera sat up. If Thor works, then possibly/probably they get their main guy, you know the World Road Champion up into the front group. If he doesn't work, then the guy that they don't believe in (yet at least) is left to fend for himself against a bunch of other riders.

Or perhaps they thought that the break had no chance, that it would have been caught regardless of whether Thor worked with Cancellara. Thor sits, and Cancellara either pulls him up to the front group, or Cancellara sits up, with Thor, Ballan and Cancellara getting caught by the chase group that was only a few seconds back and everyone then catches the break, at which point Thor has two teammates to work for him.

And Thor doesn't have to match Fabian pull for pull to keep Fabian happy, he just has to help some so it's not so obvious that he's towing a parasite to the line.

But maybe just a few pulls would have been enough to do him in.

Watch this and tell me anyone doing this race is a pussy. People here complain when their arm hair isn't aero enough. Sheesh.

http://www.youtube.com/...ture=player_embedded

Why no griping about Ballan not taking a pull? He had more to gain than Thor and nothing to lose

what a dumb video - big deal a few cobbles

Of course they were working AGAINST Cancellera? Why should they have worked WITH him? They had the situational advantage. Rider up the road, team leader with the heavy race favorite. "You wanna win Fabian? You gotta chase our guy down and tow the WC with you." Thor either gets an armchair ride up, or JVS wins.

This is about as basic as it gets when it comes to racing tactics.

Yes, they were chasing with 30K+ to go, but that was also because there was a break of 4 riders, and Thor was still the guy they wanted to work for. By the time they got to 17K, and the break had not been brough back, JVS felt good and the team gave him the green light to go on his own. At that point, Garmin (correctly) shut everything down.

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He had strong quotes last week from Flanders, but I'm pretty sure he was just pissed about losing and got caught in a bad moment. Pretty sure he knows how the sport works. And I'd be pissed immediately after I lost a race too, really.

The only thing that makes sense is that they were purely working against Calcellara. I think it is weak to see the World Champion using those kind of tactics. You can't say he was protecting JVS because Garmin was chasing a few km later. You can't say that he was hurting because the team was still trying to get him up to the lead group a few km later. What other reason could it be than working against Cancellara?

It's like a giant chess match. The situation on the road is always fluid. You never know exactly what is going to happen. Sometimes there is a bit more certainty, but often there is not up until the very end( particularly so at a race like PR). The results of the biggest races so far this year have definitely been the latter - Goss, Nuyens, Van Summren, - great riders, but typically more in support/domestique roles. However, sometimes, on occasion these guys get to shine, and it's nice to see.

Garmin-Cervelo played it very well. Cancellara clearly may have been the strongest and fittest on the day, but often in road racing that is not enough. Trek-Leopard was offering little help and support and Cancellara had to do most of what he did on his own - not unexpected, he has the horse-power to do that. Garmin-Cervelo had options - at least two very good ones, deep into the race, that gave them a great shot at the podium and/or the overall win.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Yep, no big deal. The violent shaking that makes your arms quiver like jello really wouldn't be hard at all. Just another day at work.

THIS.

or

6 guys riding away from Craig Alexander at Kona, knowing if they didn't he'd run them down.