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Overcoming same-side breathing?
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Though my overall stroke ain't bad (13-15 strokes per 25yd length) I just can't figure out alternate-side breathing. Does anyone have any suggestions (beyond the TI basics)?
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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Try turning your head early and look a little bit back and up. Most people who are just starting bilateral breathing, that I have seen, turn very late and look forward, so they drown. Start your head turn as your hand passes under your body, not after you start your recovery. That way your max head turn coincides with your hand coming out of the water.
Start out by always breathing toward the rope (if you're splitting the lane). Try to keep you stroke symmetrical.

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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, don't do it. Do what's comfortable.

Not all swimmers use alternate breathing, in fact even many of the great ones don't.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [eganski] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, don't do it. Do what's comfortable.

That's a bad idea, especially for a triathlete, who's presumably going to be swimming in open water.

docfuel's suggestion about always looking at the lane line is a good one. Mostly it just takes time to get comfortable breathing to either side.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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I did it by taking off 3 months from swimming. I relearned swimming as B/L and now it's natural to breathe on both sides.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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It's true that many of the best single-side breathe. But, bilateral breathing is one of the best ways to even out an uneven stroke. I also find that it's a good skill to have when swimming with the wind continually coming from one side or swimming parallel to a beach. In the end, race the way that you are the fastest.

The best way to learn to breathe to your non-dominant side is to just force yourself to breathe the other way. Alternate 25s...one breathing right and one breathing left. Breathe early and just get your mouth out of the water...not your whole head.


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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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Toughest thing i found when starting tris. You have to learn to roll to both sides. The Total Immersion tapes/DVD's give some good drills for this.

I've practiced this for a long time and am now OK in the pool but in the heat of battle in open water on tri day often find myself reverting back to one sided breathing.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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[reply][b]Yeah, don't do it. Do what's comfortable.[/b]

That's a bad idea, especially for a triathlete, who's presumably going to be swimming in open water. [/reply]

why?

I swim in open water, I only breathe to one side. Why is this wrong?
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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i've forced myself to do it since january and now it's almost natural. i'm still not as smooth breathing left as i am right, but it ain't bad. it's also helped that i've done most of my swimming in that time with pull buoy and paddles (as per ironguide). but even without them, i can still do it competently. practice.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [eganski] [ In reply to ]
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For the naysayers wondering why I would want to breath alternate sides, here are three good reasons:

1) To develop a more balanced stroke
2) Because it would better suit my breathing (now, breathing every other stroke is too little, breather each stroke it too much for me)
3) To help keep me on course.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [eganski] [ In reply to ]
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Why is this wrong?

Well, if it's working for you, don't let me stop you.

But . . . If you can only breath to one side, how do you deal with waves? Or wind? Or that idiot on your breathing side who's swimming dang near on top of you and who's elbow is millimeters away from your face every time you take a breath? Or what if you're swimming parallel to shore, but it's on your non-breathing side?

I guess you can work around these things, but the simple solution is just to be able to breath on both sides.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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"3) To help keep me on course. "

I'll give fourth good reason. At one tri the wind/waves were coming to the side that I normally breath on. Had to turn to the opposite side to avoid getting mouthfuls of water.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not a naysayer, I just think that Triathletes who are learning to swim tend to fall victim to 'paralysis by analysis.' If you are comfortable breathing to one side, do it. Your stroke will be balanced by your technique, not your breathing. You will not 'stay on course' better by changing your breathing.

You will do all of the above by doing what's comfortable for you and finding your own rhythm.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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One of my goals last winter was to break my reliance on same-side breathing. I'm 41, and I've been swimming same-side for my entire life, so I new it wouldn't be easy.

When I first started in January, I could not swim 25 meters bilaterally. I simply could not get enough oxygen when I breathed to my left side. Now I am a fully-functional bilateral breather. I don't have to think about it at all.

I'm no coach, so I'm don't have any technical advice for you, but I will try to explain what worked for me:

1) Take is slow. In the beginning, use it only in slow drills. Do 25m right side breathing, 25m left side breathing. Focus on mirroring your 'good side' technique. When you can consistently do 25m comfortably on both sides during a slow drill, move to step 2.

2) Start doing 25 left, 25 right during a small portion (2-400 meters) of your main workout. Again, focus on mirroring your good side technique.

3) Increase your workout percentage using 25 left, 25 right, until you can do your whole workout.

4) Now move to three-stroke bilateral breathing. It should be easy at this point.

The improvements I've made since mastering bilateral breathing have been significant, and my chronic shoulder problems (on my weak side) have disappeared.

Again, I'm no coach, but this worked for me.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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[reply][b]Why is this wrong?[/b]

Well, if it's working for you, don't let me stop you.

But . . . If you can only breath to one side, how do you deal with waves? Or wind? Or that idiot on your breathing side who's swimming dang near on top of you and who's elbow is millimeters away from your face every time you take a breath? Or what if you're swimming parallel to shore, but it's on your non-breathing side?

I guess you can work around these things, but the simple solution is just to be able to breath on both sides.[/reply]

I swim faster ;)

Actually, I don't adjust to conditions, I just breathe to one side all the time.

All i'm saying is that if you are trying to be a better swimmer, bilateral breathing is like #8 on the list of 10 things you can do to be a better swimmer. In case you're wondering, number 10 is 'invent a time machine and start swimming as a 4 year-old.'

That was in the 'directors cut' of the Total Immersion DVD.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [eganski] [ In reply to ]
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In case you're wondering, number 10 is 'invent a time machine and start swimming as a 4 year-old.'

That was in the 'directors cut' of the Total Immersion DVD.


Proof positive that TI is total quackery. Obviously, that should be number one on the list.

Is bilateral breathing The Answer to getting faster in the water? No. Is it part of the answer? It might be. Is it a valuable skill that should be part of every swimmer's repetoire? Yes. Is it hard to learn, and does learning it detract from other training? No.

All things considered, I'd say one should learn it.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry Frank, I made the classic Slowtwitch mistake of ignoring the question and just going off on a counter-argument.

You need to put in the sets where you're working specifically on bilateral breathing. You can't just do a workout and say 'ok, i'm gonna breathe to both sides today.' It takes work, so here's a set:

6x150's w/30 sec. rest.
alternate breathing 3/5/7 per 50.

This means every 3 strokes for the first 50/every 5 strokes for the 2nd 50/and every 7 strokes for the 3rd 50.

This way you not only work your bilateral breathing, you get some hypox in, which helps you aerobically as well.

'Mimic' your good side breathing to your awkward side. Many people breath late, or drop their hand. Assuming you are struggling to your left, hold that reach with your right arm, and just work on it DURING those 150's. That way you can adjust as you get more and more comfortable-and swim bilaterally more and more.
Last edited by: eganski: Mar 23, 05 14:28
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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I found that as I work on my bilateral breathing my stroke is becoming more balanced. I still prefer to breath to one side but continue to practice the bilateral because my technique benefited overall.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [frank_grupt] [ In reply to ]
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I have a woman in one of my swim sessions who refuses to breathe except on her right, every 2 strokes. So I gave her a drill set, where she did a whole lot of left-arm 1-arm 25s. This was to force her to breathe to the left. The first few 25s were sheer pain to watch. But she started to adjust, compensate, figure it out. A few weeks of doing this in her drill workout sessions, and she tried bilateral breathing. It still looks very uneven, but she's doing it now.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [eganski] [ In reply to ]
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It would be a mistake to not learn to brethe from both sides. A big one. You do have to adjust to conditions. Waves. Wind. Early morning sun. Sighting. The guy flailling away next to you....
Why wouldn't anyone learn this most basic technique?

Frank
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [Frank13] [ In reply to ]
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[reply]
Why wouldn't anyone learn this most basic technique?
[/reply]

I was motivited to go to opposite-side breathing as a means to help my (non-breathing side) shoulder problems. Only after I became comfortable with opposite-side breathing did I realize the HUGE benefits to my stroke. My whole swimming "experience" changed when I went to three-stroke bilateral breathing. Everything "felt" different for me.

If I didn't have those shoulder problems, I would have remained happy with my same-side stroke. Ignorance is bliss.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [-Tex] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
It's true that many of the best single-side breathe. But, bilateral breathing is one of the best ways to even out an uneven stroke.






So why do people assume an uneven stroke is somehow worng? If you look at the elites, mild to moderate uneven strokes are very common. I've got a hard time believing that Grant Hackett (mildly asymmetric) and Yuri Prilukov (impressively extremely uneven) would find themselves picking up speed if they just swam with a bit more symmetry.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [FLA Jill] [ In reply to ]
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So why do people assume an uneven stroke is somehow worng? If you look at the elites, mild to moderate uneven strokes are very common.

Interesting point, but I think there's a difference between the uneven stroke of an elite swimmer, who's developed their own technique over thousand and thousands of yards, and that of a novice who's just learning to swim. All things being equal, I think an even stroke is a desirable thing. If, after lots of swimming, one finds themself to have a naturally occuring uneven stroke, so be it. (Likewise, if a new runner exhibited form similar to Paula Radcliffe's, I think it might be worthwhile to try to correct it. If, however, after the runner in question had some experience and time running, and found that their hideous from is what works for them, well, OK.)

Regardless, everyone should be able to breath to both sides.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [FLA Jill] [ In reply to ]
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So why do people assume an uneven stroke is somehow worng? If you look at the elites, mild to moderate uneven strokes are very common.

As a blanket rule applied blindly to all swimmers, bi-lateral breathing as a method of "improving" the freestyle stroke is not scientifically supported. Asymetrical strokes have won gold in the Olympics and I believe I read once that no elite swimmer ever tested had a fully symetrical stroke. It may work for you and it may not but don't for a minute believe that breathing bi laterally is the "only" correct way to swim freestyle. Anyone who tells you that is just repeating what someone else told them and does not know what they are talking about.

The only reason to breath bi laterally is to improve your vision so it does have some advantages and may be worth pursuing.
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Re: Overcoming same-side breathing? [Frank13] [ In reply to ]
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For days like that, another good skill to learn is the water polo stroke.

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