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OD run time vs 70.3 run time
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I've got a 70.3 coming up in 6 weeks and I'm just curious to know how people's 10km OD run time compares to their 70.3 run time. I did a 70.3 in December and ran 1.37, but that was hot, 105 F and I struggled the last 8km with the heat. I did a OD last weekend and ran 41.20 (good conditions). I'd like to run low 1.30s or maybe even break 1.30. However some of the guys I race against are running well under 40mins for the OD and only running mid 1.30s for their 70.3 run time.... some of them aren't strong on the swim and/or bike so it's a bit hard to compare. I think sub 1.30 is unrealistic, maybe 1.32 - 1.34? Conditions will probably be mild, so good running weather. Thoughts?


BTW I don't have a recent half marathon/10km stand alone time. Haven't done one for 2 years. I did a 5km last August in 19.30, but am a bit fitter now.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I think it really depends on your training cause it's completely different for the two.

In saying that I think the biggest issue you have is 1.30 pace is pretty much your OD pace isn't it?
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [Brett runs] [ In reply to ]
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Brett runs wrote:
I think it really depends on your training cause it's completely different for the two.

In saying that I think the biggest issue you have is 1.30 pace is pretty much your OD pace isn't it?

I would say my run training is more HM focussed. I'm on about 70km a week and will be doing my first marathon in June, so slowly building towards that. OD 10km av = 4.08 sub 1.30 would be 4.16. I'd be happy with 1.32/33 though. I do seem to run better than at HM that some of the other guys in my AG who are quicker at 5/10km.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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zedzded wrote:
Brett runs wrote:
I think it really depends on your training cause it's completely different for the two.

In saying that I think the biggest issue you have is 1.30 pace is pretty much your OD pace isn't it?

I would say my run training is more HM focussed. I'm on about 70km a week and will be doing my first marathon in June, so slowly building towards that. OD 10km av = 4.08 sub 1.30 would be 4.16. I'd be happy with 1.32/33 though. I do seem to run better than at HM that some of the other guys in my AG who are quicker at 5/10km.

Yeah ok I know that feeling I am the same.

Have you done any runs off the bike lately?
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [Brett runs] [ In reply to ]
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Brett runs wrote:
zedzded wrote:
Brett runs wrote:
I think it really depends on your training cause it's completely different for the two.

In saying that I think the biggest issue you have is 1.30 pace is pretty much your OD pace isn't it?


I would say my run training is more HM focussed. I'm on about 70km a week and will be doing my first marathon in June, so slowly building towards that. OD 10km av = 4.08 sub 1.30 would be 4.16. I'd be happy with 1.32/33 though. I do seem to run better than at HM that some of the other guys in my AG who are quicker at 5/10km.


Yeah ok I know that feeling I am the same.

Have you done any runs off the bike lately?

I rarely do bricks, but did one 3 weeks ago, 90km ride and 5km run, which was 1km moderate, 3km hard 1km moderate, km splits ended up being:

4.35
4.10
4.14
4.04
4.45

Bit undulating hence funny splits. I normally run well off the bike and look forward to it. I reckon for a 70.3 I could run 10km sitting on 4.10 pace. And I can probably finish off the last 3kms OK. It seems to be the middle bit that falls apart a bit. I could ease off the first 10km, but I kind of like to bank a bit of time. Last time I tried to negatively split a half I found it stressful looking at the slow ave pace, knowing that as the race went on I had to keep on getting quicker.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [Brett runs] [ In reply to ]
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I'm curious too. I'm much slower than you but I too would like to know. I've been training for Oceanside since December 11, and I did SuperSeal 2 weeks ago where I ran 45:35 after riding @ 90% (243W) for a 1:13 (course was 42.6Km and windy AF, my time for the 40K was 1:07).

I did an open HM 1 week prior to SuperSeal where I ran 1:44, this was on top of a hard training week (12 hours prior to the race).

I am hoping I can run 1:45 @ Oceanside, but maybe I'm being too ambitious?
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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My best half I negative split the run. I do think it's the best way to do it. Go out at 4.15s and see what you have through 14 or 15k then go for it.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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My guess is you'll run 1:34 - 1:35. I'd go out at 1:33 pace, then the last 5 K either try your best to hang on or if you can lift the pace a little to finish
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [rock] [ In reply to ]
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Last season I did a OD with a 10k split of 37:20 and 7 days later a HIM with a run split of 1:25:46. Both were my peak races :)
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I just read your post in another thread talking about how run heavy your training is. Mine was like that years ago and I didn't start running real well till I found the right balance with bike training .
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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zedzded wrote:
I've got a 70.3 coming up in 6 weeks and I'm just curious to know how people's 10km OD run time compares to their 70.3 run time. I did a 70.3 in December and ran 1.37, but that was hot, 105 F and I struggled the last 8km with the heat. I did a OD last weekend and ran 41.20 (good conditions). I'd like to run low 1.30s or maybe even break 1.30. However some of the guys I race against are running well under 40mins for the OD and only running mid 1.30s for their 70.3 run time.... some of them aren't strong on the swim and/or bike so it's a bit hard to compare. I think sub 1.30 is unrealistic, maybe 1.32 - 1.34? Conditions will probably be mild, so good running weather. Thoughts?


BTW I don't have a recent half marathon/10km stand alone time. Haven't done one for 2 years. I did a 5km last August in 19.30, but am a bit fitter now.

It's hard to tell without knowing where your bike fitness is. You can get through an OD bike and still run well, but IMO for 70.3 it's different. If you overbike or your bike fitness is not as good as it should, you can go from being able to run a comfortable 1.30-1.33 to walk/jogging a 1.50.

FWIW, I'm a 41-42 OD runner and usually pace myself for a 1.34ish HIM run. It feels easy at the beggining and if I am really feeling good I push the last 7ks or so.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I'd go out your OD pace + 30s for 5-10km and then let it loose if you are able.

Dimond Bikes Superfan
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I've previously posted a 3:05 marathon and it took me a while before I could put up anything sub 1:38 run split in a 70.3. This is including a few overbikes that resulted in 1:45.

The rule of thumb that I've heard is that your 70.3 run should be the same as the back half of your marathon - but only if you've nailed the bike pacing.

I've since improved to a 3:00 marathon with a 1:30 70.3 run split but it's taken me a few tries at the 70.3 distance to really nail the bike. If anything it was both my pacing and my bike fitness that allowed me to run better.

Bottom line, if you want to run well in your 70.3, bike more. You won't run anywhere near your potential if you don't come off the bike reasonably fresh. Your run volume is fine and will stick around well - use these last weeks to focus on the bike.

And per your question - I haven't done an open 21.1k but I guess I'm now in the 1:25 range. I haven't done an open 10k either, but estimate in the low 37:00s
Last edited by: timbasile: Apr 1, 18 9:41
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I am just going to give you my data point. I do not do myself as n=1 in anything, we are all different, but you can glean into this a bit and start connecting dots.
Run performance during a triathlon race is a function of the following general factors:
Two unrelated factors to this discussion but relevant: pre race breakfast and fueling+ environmental conditions during race- assume you got both working in your favor.
1. Swim fitness/ swim pacing
2. Bike fitness/ bike pacing
3. Bike fueling
4. Run fitness/ run pacing and run fueling- run fueling matters in HIM

This above is just a reference for the frame of discussion. I have run multiple times 19:30-19:14 open 5Ks. I have also run 1:29 open half marathon. My fastest 70.3 run split ever was 1:37 on a hot day. I did lack bike fitness to bike 2:30ish, but I did it anyway and overcooked it on that given day.
Is it realistic for you to run low 1:30s? I think so. Specifically if you address yourself in that above order that I layed out. Key being bike fitness, bike pacing and bike fueling. In HIM that matters.
I think sub 1:30 is a bit unrealistic, right now, I do agree. Depending on where you are in development, sub 1:30 could very well be in the cards. I do not think you are that far. Rooting for you!
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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A good guess would be to take your PR at an open 13.1 and add 5 minutes to it - that will give you a good idea of what to expect for your run in Oceanside.

Based on the 41:20 10K time, I'd guess a 1:35-ish run next week.

Next races on the schedule: none at the moment
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [alex_korr] [ In reply to ]
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alex_korr wrote:
Based on the 41:20 10K time, I'd guess a 1:35-ish run next week.

I'd guess similarly.

Whenever I last ran sub 1:30 in a half I had done 39 in OD same year and was probably running 37 for standalone 10k, 18 for 5k.

The other thing of course with 70.3 is that it is very easy to bike a bit too hard and not quite get the bike/run pace balance just right.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [atasic] [ In reply to ]
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atasic wrote:
I am just going to give you my data point. I do not do myself as n=1 in anything, we are all different, but you can glean into this a bit and start connecting dots.
Run performance during a triathlon race is a function of the following general factors:
Two unrelated factors to this discussion but relevant: pre race breakfast and fueling+ environmental conditions during race- assume you got both working in your favor.
1. Swim fitness/ swim pacing
2. Bike fitness/ bike pacing
3. Bike fueling
4. Run fitness/ run pacing and run fueling- run fueling matters in HIM

This above is just a reference for the frame of discussion. I have run multiple times 19:30-19:14 open 5Ks. I have also run 1:29 open half marathon. My fastest 70.3 run split ever was 1:37 on a hot day. I did lack bike fitness to bike 2:30ish, but I did it anyway and overcooked it on that given day.
Is it realistic for you to run low 1:30s? I think so. Specifically if you address yourself in that above order that I layed out. Key being bike fitness, bike pacing and bike fueling. In HIM that matters.
I think sub 1:30 is a bit unrealistic, right now, I do agree. Depending on where you are in development, sub 1:30 could very well be in the cards. I do not think you are that far. Rooting for you!

Swim fitness and pacing is good, bike pacing is good, hard to say about bike fitness, but I did 2.25 fairly easily last time and should be able to manage 2.22/2.23 without burning too many candles. Fueling is also pretty good. I think you're right 1.30 is unrealistic. 1.32 if all the stars align, but most likely 1.34.
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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In my n=1, I regularly knock out 40min Oly splits (hoping to go under that this year) and my best-executed half-IM run to date was a 1:30 flat. I think a 1:30 is a bit ambitious in your case.

For reference, a clean HM I do in 1:24, so I guess Oly run pace = clean HM pace.

ZONE3 - We Last Longer
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Re: OD run time vs 70.3 run time [tessar] [ In reply to ]
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tessar wrote:
In my n=1, I regularly knock out 40min Oly splits (hoping to go under that this year) and my best-executed half-IM run to date was a 1:30 flat. I think a 1:30 is a bit ambitious in your case.

For reference, a clean HM I do in 1:24, so I guess Oly run pace = clean HM pace.

Yeah I was doing the maths in my head and got a bit overexcited, first 10km 4.10min/km pace, last 3 km 4.10min/km pace, leaving the middle 8km to be done at 4.30min/km pace - piece of cake! Although I think I can manage the first 10 and last 3 at 4.10 pace I think the middle bit I'd probably struggle to hold 4.30 even though it doesn't sound that quick to me. I'll probe aim to go a bit slower that first 10 and aim for 1.32 - 1.34.
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