All I was gonna say was stick to a traditional stem, but you've got that covered. P4's are so hot right now!

P4 just concerns me because Im unsure if you can run wide wheels/tires.

Amazing to watch this come full circle. The P4 seemed like a flop when it was first introduced. Do you like traditional stems simply for ease of fitting adjustment?

I'm long and low build myself (though I'm short in height, I'm proportionally long in the torso)... I ride and love a Felt DA. It's a 2012... and someone can try prying it from my cold dead hands.

I'm actually looking at some new / Old Stock from 2011 through 2013

Gorgeous... edit: looks like you've already found yourself some options in that vintage, would love to see pics once you pick one out. For what it's worth, if you search the forums you'll probably find a bunch of folks who have complaints about the rear brake. I've personally never had an issue (on Zipp 404s... so carbon brake track), and have regularly skidded the back tire coming to a stop on loose surface.

QR CD0.1 or Illicito?

Without knowing his numbers, old school long and low is often not achievable on proprietary front ends. So just to be safe.

If I could hit my numbers on an integrated set up, I would prefer that.

What cockpit are you running. I would love to find a Bayonet 3 devox.

Profile Aeria with a flat stem.

I have a 2011 P4 I just built up, brand new frameset...let me know if you are interested...I might let it go as work might get in the way of any racing for a while...size 56

I haven't looked at the numbers, but I think you can get pretty long and low on the Speed Concept with the low-far stem. It takes a wider rim better than the P4 and the second generation SC is probably as aero at low yaw and way faster past 7-10 degrees. Shiv TT is an option. Just size up until it is long enough.

The P4 is cool and I almost bought one, but I looked at the brake and ... you know the story.

How long?
How low?

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Developing aero, fit and other fun stuff at Red is Faster

Not sure about the p4, but I ride a p3c and popped in fulcrum racing quattro LG wheels (lg have a wider profile) with 25mm conti's.
The frame itself is wide enough, the only narrow point is the front fork, but it still runs fine. But that's still the old Wolf fork, not sure if those p4's have wider ones.

Merida Warp TT. Not that you can get them in the USA, but it is the bike for Aliens

Stack 610
Reach 555.

Those are my bikes current numbers. I need about another centimeter or two of reach and I can't get the vuka any lower .

Good numbers for me would be at least 570 and 600 at least. I'm currently on a 56 but a 58 DA with the right cockpit will work. Also a 58 in a P4 or P3C.

Shiv TT I love but the bars arnt super adjustable.

People complain about the rear brake, but who really uses the rear brake?????

I think one of the complaints is that it rubs and constantly goes out of adjustment causing said rub. Now, people knock the DA for the same thing, but I've never had issues with my rear brake and I run a pretty wide wheel back there.

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I have extremely worn out rear brakes on all of my bikes. Spread way wide. They will slow you down in a pinch but I never ever use them

yeah, I am slightly different but mostly the same. I run brand new blocks, spread them way wide, and rarely use them as well. I think what I am getting at is there are ways to set the brakes up so they don't rub and if you don't need to stop then the less than optimal brakes on a P4, or DA for that matter, shouldn't be a determining factor in choosing a bike frame. Also, levers matter a whole lot. running something like 3T's knife deals is so suboptimal. I had much, much better braking with SRAMs S990 running all the same brakes. My bike actually stopped with the SRAM levers.....more like speed scrubbing now. ;)

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Fishbum wrote:

Shiv TT I love but the bars arnt super adjustable.

I am not sure what you are looking for, but I assume you want some angle. You might try these armrests paired with the EVO extentions.

https://www.shopforwatts.co.uk/...?variant=47727397002


Those crazy-ass Brits have a solution to all the aero stuff.

Those are quite nice looking.

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Yep, once the rear brake housing starts to loosen up, the rear rubbing was a major problem. And the rear disc wheel choices are very limited. Loved my P4 but my P5 is an overall improvement.