I don't really have a zone 2 running pace. Whenever I start running my HR goes to zone 3 immediately. Is it normal?

It took 35 years to change by 2 minutes per km, but it went the wrong way from 4 min per km to 6 min LOL

When I was in high school, I could run mid/high 17s for 5km and my "easy" pace was 7:15-7:30, sometimes into the high 6s. I ran maybe 30mpw. I bumped my mileage up to 45-60 and slowed my easy pace down to ~8min/mi, and got a lot faster.

Easy pace isn't a great indicator of fitness, IMO. I know plenty of people who run way too fast on their daily runs, insisting it's easy, and race at a pace barely faster than the easy days. These are 18:30-19:30 5k types who run 7:30/mi on easy days (5k pace + 60-90sec). I know plenty of fast runners (2:30-2:45 marathoners) who run easy days at 7:30-8min pace (marathon pace + 2min).

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"Don't you have to go be stupid somewhere else?"..."Not until 4!"

Ive taken about a minute off my zone 2 pace over the past year since i learned about it from reading maffetones book. I do almost all my running in z2, but i havent really focused seriously on running yet, so its more maintenance



You just have to run slower, eveyone has a zone 2 pace

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Strava

I used to do east runs too hard, about 4:45/km with a 4/km 5kk race pace. Since I've worked with my coach (just over a year) My steady runs at first slowed to around 5:30/km with a 5k race pace increased to about 3:50/km, and now a year later I do easy runs at 4:50-5:10/km depending on how I'm feeling and have a 5k race pace of just under 3:30/km. slowing down my easy runs, and making sure they stay zone 2 easy not only increased my zone 2 gradually over time, but also meant I was fresher for the key sessions and my faster running reaped the rewards. With just over a year of proper tri training I ran my first half marathon 'race' (unofficial with a couple of clubmates due to covid) offroad on a gently rolling track, going 1:21:47, with an average pace of 3:51/km, quicker than my 5k pace before I started working with my coach and slowing the easy runs down. In summary easy runs got slower relative to my race pace, and slower overall at first, before remaining slower relative to my race pace but pretty much has quick as it was before.

When HR, RPE and your rate of recovery agree, that is usually the best indicator. When I started running, I was too heavy to run all the time, so I walked to stay in Z2(4mph), then run/walked, now I just trot around 6.4mph. All at my target HR 135-140. This has occurred over the last 20 months.

Each year I go through long periods of exclusive Z2 along with two or three 6 week blocks of threshold, speed work and a little Z2(google F.I.R.S.T. to learn about it) seems to be what is the catalyst for moving the Z2 limit. Build a base, grow on it, rinse, repeat.

I've only been at this for a little while though, so no idea how long I will continue to improve or where you are in your journey. Maybe anything would have worked for me. But for sure the hardest part for most people is going slow enough. Was easy for me, I would have had stress fractures in my lower legs if I was running too hard. Now I just follow the plan and it is still working. I will only change once it stops as I have remained injury free which has allowed me to be consistent.

Good luck.

It has changed very little for me in my 50s from my 30s. Given the same level of training, my easy pace is perhaps 10 to 20 seconds per mile slower than it was 20 years ago.

(I completely discount my early twenties because I generally ran too hard all the time then. It's not a meaningful comparison.)

What has changed more significantly is my racing pace.

But my current easy pace doesn't feel any harder than than my slightly-faster easy pace of 20 years ago did back when I was racing much faster.

my 'easy' is at 8:00-8:30 and is naturally (now) where I seem to float more towards the 8:30 ends as rest during intervals or 8:00 if i'm out for a long steady run and not looking at the watch. I've been at about these paces since getting tri specific coach about seven years ago. Those times generally equate to marathon plus 1:30 which tracks as my open marathon time is 2:43 and IM is 3:05.

I deffinitely (in HS and college) pushed my easy well beyond where I should have been and while I've not trained for any 5k or 10k races recently I'm in far better fitness and injury free using the above.

I'd think adjusting your easy pace would only be warranted if your overall run volume, open race results and general ability to 'withstand' has dramatically changed (and even then being very careful about doing that). There is a lot to be said for just getting out there and getting that easy volume in and focusing on developing pace and mechanics during your specific speed sessions.

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Taylor Rogers

2024: IM Hamburg

As i've gotten faster over the past 4 years (1:31 HM PR to 1:23), my easy pace has gotten slower simply because I've been running more. I thought my easy pace was 7:45-8 but it really should be 8:30+ and after more and more discipline, I can keep it around 9 now.

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

From about 6:30 a mile in my prime losing maybe a minute a decade up to about 10:30 a mile entering my 60s and now I don't run at all. Swim-bike for the win!

This deserved more love, I LOL'ed.

A better metric of easy pace is ability to have a conversation with someone - rather than HR. when your sentences have long pauses between words you are going faster than easy pace.

Easy pace is completely subjective based off your fatigue state. Sometimes I run 7:30 per mile, sometimes I run 9 min per mile. I base my easy runs entirely off RPE, I'd really recommend doing the same. For that reason, if possible I'd also avoid the treadmill as much as possible, because that forces you to pay way too much attention to pace instead of how you actually feel. There's always a temptation to sneak the treadmill just a little faster because you think you feel fine.

have you tried running west?

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https://www.strava.com/...tes/zachary_mckinney

Haha....well I did a test the other day and I have been unable to break 4 min for a single km. I ran my PB marathon at that "jogging pace".

On a plus not my 200IM, 400IM and 200 fly at 55 at better than at 20, but it would have been awesome if I knew how to swim those strokes at 20. I'd love to have seen what I could do.

But hey this is life. You go as hard as you can with the chassis and engine at hand!

I have 2 zones for easy runs - 20-30 year old easy, then 30-50 year old easy. The 20-30 yo pace was too to fast, 30-50 has been fairly consistent with maybe 10-20 second slower the past few years, probably still too fast. I do use a treadmill to lock in some really easy runs, but outside I just hit autopilot on easy runs. My racing times have slowed some across the range, but not too bad I guess, but I am sure the slide will continue.

When I was younger and ran many more miles, sometimes fatigue made you run easy. Running less when older may make similar easy pace seem about the same, but the load is much less.

We’ve met?

:-)

Very similar here. Use to run too hard all the time for all the zones back when I was in my 20s & 30s. Anything nice and easy was useless and would get you out of shape. Wrong. Now, at 46, my warm-up/cruise speed is in the +5:00/km. I realised that if I can do my easy swims at 1:30/100m (LCM) and then clock 59" in 100m, 18:00 in 1500m, and low 50s:00 in 3800m, why wouldn't that work as well for running. And having a IM marathon PB of 3:11 almost 15 years ago, last year I went 3:17. That is much less than 1s slower/km/year. Pretty good, eh?

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STRAVA INSTAGRAM

LOL haha

At nearly 65, my easy running pace is now a walk.

+1

easy pace doesn't change much, until age hits..
started running seriously age 15, easy was 8min/mile. Ten years later it was 7:30-8.
5k pr went from 22min to 15min over that ten years..

Up to age 50 easy pace stayed about 8, increased steadily after that. Now at 60, it's 11-12 and I can't do 8min/mi for a 5k..

Kipchoge's easy pace is 4min/km about 6:25min/mi..
https://runningscience.co.za/...-log/eliud-kipchoge/

I run 100% by feel now. For the last 2 months 8:00 min/mile has been my very easy pace. But that's because I have not been on the bike in 2 months. Though I found that there is no direct correlation between say my marathon time and my easy pace. The "easiness" of pace is more directly correlated to my weekly mileage. If I go for 60 mpw, my easy pace will drop considerably. If I am doing 30 mpw, 7:45 min/mile feels about right. Just my 2 cents.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

No kidding. 930 per mile is easy pace now.

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They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

The best way to determine if your easy pace can change is to test. In typical years that would be do a running race of your choice then go to mcmillanrunning and use the calculator. It’s really straightforward and accurate. Without a race you can get on a track and simulate a race doing a no shorter than 20min time trial. Then use the McMillan.
You could also use the Daniels Vdot Calculator but I like McMillan better because he’s a friend.

For MAF folks that’s all different. Here you want to test often between every 3 weeks and 6 weeks. Get on the track again but this time you are running 3-4 miles at your MAF or Zone 2 heart rate. If you see your pace drop during a test if you’ve been consistent testing and of course training then you insert some tempo running. This is all available on the web or in books. Mark Allen famously used MAF to learn to run easy. It’s been said often he’d start the year running 7:30-8:00 at MAF and by his Kona block of training he’d be running 5:30 at the same HR.

Personally I use the McMillan calculator. I run a 20 minute time trial on the track about the same time I’d ride and FTP test. I base all my pacing off that 20 minute test. I then run by feel and measure it after the run to see how well I do it. Like many on this thread age is the limiter. I can run the paces of my youth but I need a great deal more recovery time. If I want to run more I simply don’t run the paces of my youth.

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Dave Jewell
Free Run Speed