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How do you know when it's time to find a new coach?
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I've had the same coach since late 2019, in which time I've seen a lot of improvements. He's the only coach I've ever had, and is also the head coach/founder at my local tri club (which I'm heavily involved in). Lately though, I've been feeling dissatisfied with my training plan and I don't know whether it's time to move on.

My main issues are that frequently there doesn't seem to have been a lot of thought go into the plan, and I get the sessions a lot later than I'd like. In the past I'd get around 3 weeks at a time and then if needed he'd adjust the sessions based on my feedback - that worked great. More recently though, it's very piecemeal, a few days at a time and I'll often get to Wednesday or Thursday not know what training I have coming up at the weekend, and on several occasions I've had to message him to prompt him to put sessions in for the upcoming days. It makes it hard to plan other life stuff around it.

When I do get my plan it often feels a bit thrown together - for example a typical week will include club track and swim sessions - which is fine to an extent, I like running and swimming with others, but I just turn up and do whatever the club is doing. For other sessions, the description of the session won't make sense or the power numbers are wrong, and it looks like it's been C&P from someone else's plan. This hasn't always been the case but I've definitely noticed a drop in the quality over the past few months.

All this has lead to me feeling frustrated and considering moving on, either to another coach or more likely just coaching myself at least for now. But - as I said at the top, I'm still seeing improvements so it's obviously working to a certain extent, and I don't know if it's a case of the grass not always being greener. Having never had or left a coach before, I feel like I'm second guessing the best thing to do so would be interested in knowing what caused others to move on, and how it worked out.

If I was with a random online coach and it wasn't working I'd just move on without thinking about it, but because it's someone I've known for years and will continue to see through the tri club, it feels a bit trickier to handle.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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Ask Lionel or Sam :)

E-DUB
Chief Janitor @Slowtwitch
Life is short. Dont be mad all the time.

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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [Ewynn] [ In reply to ]
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Ewynn wrote:
Ask Lionel or Sam :)

Ha! I was going to make a reference to definitely not asking them ;)
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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I mean.. Sam seems to be doing pretty well with it. I do believe that once Lionel gets things under a bit more control ( in his personal life ) he will figure it out too. I think everyone underestimates the changes that happened when you add things like a "NEW BABY" to the mix. I just hope he can stay the course and let things come around.

E-DUB
Chief Janitor @Slowtwitch
Life is short. Dont be mad all the time.

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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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First thing is have a conversation with him. Explain the issues you have and see what he has to say. It may be the case he can rectify what you are currently not happy with.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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Coaching is or should be a two way process with discussion/feedback on what’s working and what’s not working.
If you haven’t had these conversations maybe you should!
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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There have been multiple threads just like this over the decades here on ST.

I'll summarize in a few sentences.

Just because you're still improving doesn't mean it's still the right situation for you going forward. On the flip side of that every coach has a bad day/days when they are writing schedules and messes up/C&P a workout (now if they are C&P entire schedules and doing it chronically...yikes....), gets power targets wrong.

If it becomes a chronic thing then there may be other things happening in the coach's life that they may be keeping from general knowledge. When my Mom was given a terminal diagnoses with a glioblastoma I basically told all my athletes my focus was on spending the last weeks of her life with her. When I got divorced I'm sure I had a few rough weeks/months of schedule writing, it was a very rough 8-10 months and that bled over into everything.

All this is to say if you like your situation and it's worked well for you for a few years, it's probably best to have a talk with them about why things have changed and if that will be the new norm moving forward. You don't have to say you're thinking of switching coaches. Sometimes people aren't aware that they've made changes, other times it might be a conscious choice.

If you do decide to switch coaches, talk with several coaches and make sure they area willing to incorporate your favorite club workouts into your schedule.

Good luck and hope this helps

Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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As others have said, communication is paramount to a good relationship. I like to put bigger workouts and things like travel or training camps that will have a big effect onto the calendar in advance for athletes. I rarely put in more than two weeks of training in advance, as things are always in flux and adjustments need to be made pretty frequently. Workouts should be based around what happens on a daily basis and then tweaked to match for the future. If it's generic, cookie-cutter stuff, you probably want to have a conversation about it.

Blog: http://262toboylstonstreet.blogspot.com/
https://twitter.com/NateThomasTri
Coaching: https://bybtricoaching.com/ - accepting athletes for 2023
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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you got some good advice in this thread. sit down with your current coach and have a talk with him and lay down everything you put in this post. I m pretty sure something is happening in his own life that might keep him from been at the best of is capacity.

It s a 2 way relationship and it s very important that both side put time and energy into this.

and if you want to hire a new coach..then talk to many, it will be a very educational process and you will be able to make a clear decision down the road.

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]
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Replying to everyone - thank you, there is some really good advice here, I appreciate it.

I can see it isn't fair of me to whinge on a forum rather than speaking to my coach directly to discuss and give feedback on what's working and what's not. I'll do that and see if things improve.

Thanks!
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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How many people is your coach coaching?

"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [James2020] [ In reply to ]
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James2020 wrote:
First thing is have a conversation with him. Explain the issues you have and see what he has to say. It may be the case he can rectify what you are currently not happy with.

All of the advice in this thread is about discussing openly with the coach. I think that‘s good but it can be embarrassing if the OP is right and I can understand the hesitation of the OP.
I had two coaches, either for about two years but they rather caused stagnation instead of improvement and in the end I knew why. I did never discuss my opinion with them. I would have felt a bit embarrassed when I would have had to tell them but also felt a bit upset having lost so much precious time. My advantage was I was not very close with them, and saw them afterwards only very occasionally.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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cherry_bomb wrote:
I've had the same coach since late 2019, in which time I've seen a lot of improvements. He's the only coach I've ever had, and is also the head coach/founder at my local tri club (which I'm heavily involved in). Lately though, I've been feeling dissatisfied with my training plan and I don't know whether it's time to move on.

My main issues are that frequently there doesn't seem to have been a lot of thought go into the plan, and I get the sessions a lot later than I'd like. In the past I'd get around 3 weeks at a time and then if needed he'd adjust the sessions based on my feedback - that worked great. More recently though, it's very piecemeal, a few days at a time and I'll often get to Wednesday or Thursday not know what training I have coming up at the weekend, and on several occasions I've had to message him to prompt him to put sessions in for the upcoming days. It makes it hard to plan other life stuff around it.

When I do get my plan it often feels a bit thrown together - for example a typical week will include club track and swim sessions - which is fine to an extent, I like running and swimming with others, but I just turn up and do whatever the club is doing. For other sessions, the description of the session won't make sense or the power numbers are wrong, and it looks like it's been C&P from someone else's plan. This hasn't always been the case but I've definitely noticed a drop in the quality over the past few months.

All this has lead to me feeling frustrated and considering moving on, either to another coach or more likely just coaching myself at least for now. But - as I said at the top, I'm still seeing improvements so it's obviously working to a certain extent, and I don't know if it's a case of the grass not always being greener. Having never had or left a coach before, I feel like I'm second guessing the best thing to do so would be interested in knowing what caused others to move on, and how it worked out.

If I was with a random online coach and it wasn't working I'd just move on without thinking about it, but because it's someone I've known for years and will continue to see through the tri club, it feels a bit trickier to handle.

For a trainer Communication is KEY.

Talk with your trainer, share with him your thoughts, how much you dislike that you feels like the training is not your training but someone else, and that you would like to have it planned with more time in advance.

For me, it is more important the communication and the follow up than any other thing.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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When ever I chat to a potential client I tend to do this under three headings, What are your: Goals, Needs and Expectations. The vast majority of time when anyone is dissatisfied with a service of any kind, is because ones expectations are violated. And again mostly they are violated because they have never been discussed and agree upon for both parties. So if you feel the relationship is salvageable then may I suggest you chat to your current coach and dig deep into expectations for both parties. Hope this helps

Graham Wilson
USAT Level III Elite Coach
http://www.thewilsongroup.biz
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [kajet] [ In reply to ]
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kajet wrote:
How many people is your coach coaching?

I don't really know. I would guess between 10 and 15 - his main job is as a S&C coach (I see him regularly for S&C in person and he is great, no complaints there). I think most typically he coaches beginner triathletes or people wanting a plan for a specific event, people who will get a plan for 6 months, tick the box and then move on. I'm pretty sure I'm his longest term client. Probably because I dislike change and having awkward conversations :)
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [James2020] [ In reply to ]
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James2020 wrote:
First thing is have a conversation with him. Explain the issues you have and see what he has to say. It may be the case he can rectify what you are currently not happy with.

Yep -- it does sound like it might be time to part ways but something has clearly changed in the last little bit. Sit down with them, express what you liked before & what's not working for you now, & see where it goes.

It's totally fair for you to move on. Triathlon can be simple from a coaching perspective. A lot of athletes are undertrained when they come in & a lot of athletes should see a good amount of progression in the sport. Is that the coach/training or was that more/less going to happen? If you don't vibe, you don't vibe. Feel like a lot of folks are saying to have the conversation, which is right, but some athletes will stay in a bad situation for too long to avoid confrontation. You gotta do what's right for you but it does sound like giving the coach some feedback is the first place to start.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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The conversation might go much easier than you fear. It may be something as simple as your coach (who has mostly beginner and few triathletes) feels you have outgrown them. Since you are likely their longest termed athlete, they might not feel comfortable asking you to find someone else or embarrassed to tell you they think they've done all they can for you. Maybe when you came onboard they thought they wanted to change into more triathlete clients but found they were better at S&C.

There are a lot of positive reasons to have a conversation and very few negative.

Not a coach. Not a FOP Tri/swimmer/biker/runner. Barely a MOP AGer.
But I'm learning and making progress.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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cherry_bomb wrote:
I'm pretty sure I'm his longest term client. Probably because I dislike change and having awkward conversations :)

I'm sure i'm going to get flamed for this, but you don't owe your coach anything other than your agreed upon coaching fee. You - as a customer - shouldn't feel obligated to confront your coach and offer constructive feedback and bring your coach along through an awkward convo about them not meeting your expectations unless you see an upside in working through the relationship.

Go meet with other coaches and then move on if you feel like someone else is a better fit.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [MadTownTRI] [ In reply to ]
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MadTownTRI wrote:
cherry_bomb wrote:
I'm pretty sure I'm his longest term client. Probably because I dislike change and having awkward conversations :)


I'm sure i'm going to get flamed for this, but you don't owe your coach anything other than your agreed upon coaching fee. You - as a customer - shouldn't feel obligated to confront your coach and offer constructive feedback and bring your coach along through an awkward convo about them not meeting your expectations unless you see an upside in working through the relationship.

Go meet with other coaches and then move on if you feel like someone else is a better fit.

No flaming from me - but, although in theory you are right, it's not as straightforward in reality. I'm closely involved with the tri club that he is founder of, and would want to continue going to club training sessions, events etc without it being awkward. We've known each other for years and although I wouldn't exactly class us as friends, we see each other socially, know each other's families etc. So although I could just shop around for new coaches and move on without having a prior discussion, I wouldn't feel good about it.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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cherry_bomb wrote:
Replying to everyone - thank you, there is some really good advice here, I appreciate it.

I can see it isn't fair of me to whinge on a forum rather than speaking to my coach directly to discuss and give feedback on what's working and what's not. I'll do that and see if things improve.

Thanks!

I think it's fair to ask for feedback to other athletes coaches. There seems to be a general consensus about having a word with your coach before making any drastic decisions. It is fair for any athlete to know key weekend workouts a few day in advance to prepare.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [MadTownTRI] [ In reply to ]
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the word ''customer'' dosnt come in a coach/athlete relationship. it s so much more then that. Well worthy in life to take the high road and have a talk even if it s ackward or uncomfortable. It will make the future a lot better what ever come out of it.

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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Hi.

Sometimes, coaches get stuck on a "hamster wheel" and it takes one of their athletes to shake them off that wheel for them to reset, refresh and restart.

As a coach, I've been caught out like this myself.

Speak to your coach.

Sometimes it is just time to move on though - but your conversation with him will dictate this.

Pat.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [cherry_bomb] [ In reply to ]
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cherry_bomb wrote:
MadTownTRI wrote:
cherry_bomb wrote:
I'm pretty sure I'm his longest term client. Probably because I dislike change and having awkward conversations :)


I'm sure i'm going to get flamed for this, but you don't owe your coach anything other than your agreed upon coaching fee. You - as a customer - shouldn't feel obligated to confront your coach and offer constructive feedback and bring your coach along through an awkward convo about them not meeting your expectations unless you see an upside in working through the relationship.

Go meet with other coaches and then move on if you feel like someone else is a better fit.


No flaming from me - but, although in theory you are right, it's not as straightforward in reality. I'm closely involved with the tri club that he is founder of, and would want to continue going to club training sessions, events etc without it being awkward. We've known each other for years and although I wouldn't exactly class us as friends, we see each other socially, know each other's families etc. So although I could just shop around for new coaches and move on without having a prior discussion, I wouldn't feel good about it.

This is a good point. Last summer I hired this coach to work with and it just wasn't the right fit for me (training was old school, 20 hours per week, no taper, same plan for all athletes..I was burned out and injured after 8 weeks). This summer, his group of athletes that are still with him, are all giving me the cold shoulder no longer engaging me in any of their training long rides, etc. I usually train on my own, so this is not a big deal for me, but it could be different if you really enjoy the social aspect of the sport.
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Re: How do you know when it's time to find a new coach? [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Triathlon groups are often cliquey at times cult like. Your former group sounds like one of those. You are well shot of them. Coaching is a funny in thing, in one respect it absolutely is a business and you should be respected as a customer.

As stated above the relationship and coaching is personal, is a relationship and working together to shape and achieve goals. Athletes and coaches know when it isn't working and like any relationship would adjust to make it work.

A lot of coaches around here who are ex athletes form a cult around their legacy and make their caching all about them. They also like to live vicariously through their elites and unwittingly priortise the top 1 % over the bulk of their athletes.

People, coaches and athletes know when it is time to move on from each other and the good ones are fine with that as it is the right thing to do for both parties.
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