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How did power change how you race IMs?
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I have been debating for awhile whether to get a power meter. Two weeks ago I had a breakthrough performance at IM Cozumel. I raced a 10:13 and came within 21 minutes of a KQ. So my goal for next year is to KQ. That sort of changes the game a bit - as a friend of mine who KQ'd put it, you still have to race smart, but you also can't afford to leave any time on the table in any of the three events.

For the past four years I have trained off of HR. At Cozumel I averaged 130bpm for the bike and tried to keep my HR under 135. My Z2, according to a VO2 max test, is 115-125bpm, so, accounting for race day cardiac drift, I most likely raced right at my upper Z2. If you follow the guideline of racing at 70-85% of your anaerobic threshhold, (mine is 157bpm), I raced at 82.8%, so according to HR, my effort was right on the money. But I can't help but wonder whether I left time on the table on the bike
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A lot of people say getting a power meter changes the way they race and train - you don't have to worry about cardiac drift and it allows you to more precisely monitor your effort and prevents you from leaving time on the table on the bike.

I am curious what the converts have to say - if you trained with HR for years and were able to put together strong long-course race performances using it, how did using power change the way you train and race? In addition to the supposed training benefits, did it help your race-day execution in terms of not leaving time on the table?

****Please, please, please keep your responses limited to the question I have asked. There are also about 27 million other things I would like to improve about the way I train and race. If I were interested in discussing them here, I would have asked about them. But I didn't. I asked about power meters. We can discuss how I need to quit skim milk and replace it with almonds and bacon some other time. Thank you :)*******
Last edited by: UrsusAdiposimus: Dec 11, 11 6:35
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
(race report in my log if you are curious).*

I'm not spotting your log. Link?

Hugh

Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [sciguy] [ In reply to ]
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Ah sorry, cut and paste from another forum. No log on ST - sorry :)
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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For me, the biggest advantage is on really windy or really hilly courses. There is going by feel or HR and then there is watching a competitor go up the road. Let's say we are in half IM and we're on a 6% grade and I am holding at 220W and some guy who weighs more than me by 50 lbs blows by like I am standing still. It is like a secret weapon knowing that 220W feels easy, but this guy is probably doing 330W or more and knowing that pretty well no one in the world in my age group can hold that effort and still run well. It's easier mentally to let these guys go and stick to my plan knowing they will probably come back to me before T2 and will be in the rearview mirror after 1 mile of running. Having the powermeter is like being able to watch your competition empty their gas tank without them even knowing it. You can guage exactly what they are doing, while staying on your plan....best of both worlds. Sometimes I feel that it is almost like cheating knowing something about the competition that they themselves don't know.

It's much harder to "not get sucked into their pace" when going by feel or heart rate.

Dev
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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For me it changed my season schedule.... Instead of racing an IM a year the PM made me race two... A mid summer one and then Kona

Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
Ah sorry, cut and paste from another forum. No log on ST - sorry :)

What other forum?

Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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Four big things that it showed me:

How to tactically do hills w/o racing to the top.

How to tactically race down the hills w/o coasting

Minimized/eliminated coasting in general. Especially so w/ a tailwind.

Stopped watching mph in general but especially so into headwinds.


Jamie
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [ericM35-39] [ In reply to ]
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ericM35-39 wrote:
For me it changed my season schedule.... Instead of racing an IM a year the PM made me race two... A mid summer one and then Kona

cute.

that much difference- huh?
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [morey000] [ In reply to ]
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For me yes, but that's only because I was close and doing it all wrong before, so had room to grow.

The OP is close, so I see some similarities. Optimization is what it's all about, and if he doesn't have a PM that's one area to get closer to his competitors.

Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [JamieJ] [ In reply to ]
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x2 on this...before using power I was surprised when power-users said they never monitored speed on the course. Once I went with power, it totally made sense - you experiment in workouts to find the power level you can sustain for a race, then in the race you race that power, and the speed takes care of itself.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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The precision with which you can ride is a major change from my perspective. Before IMAZ this year I did 8-9 rides in the 5-7 hour range and had all of my power data from those rides. I also did a number of FTP tests and knew that fairly well. There are a number of guideposts out there that recommend certain % of FTP that you should target in a LC ride. Because I knew what various levels of effort felt like and how i ran (albeit just a transition run) I had a pretty good sense of what my target power should be for the race. It turned out to be on the lower end of the recommended range but that struck me as correct (were talking 10 watts here).

When I did the race I had my Edge 800 set-up to give me instantaneous wattge, 5-mile lap averge wattage, and average wattage for the whole race. I had a target range for the race and ended up racing on the lower side of that range--felt right. The IMAZ course has a long, sustained false flat, which leads to radically different speeds depending on which direction you are going. Because you feel great early on in the ride, it's very easy to ride over your power limit going up the hill. It frankly was very difficult to hold back--especially with so many folks blasting past me. The other thing that happened at IMAZ was that the wind direction changed radically and was different for ech of the three laps. I rode a very constant power output for each of the three laps and my 2nd lap was about 5 minutes slower than my first and my third lap was faster than the second. I looked over the data and there was less than 5% of the field that had a third lap faster than the second--which if you were truly riding average power, you would have gone faster in the 3rd lap than the 2nd. Relative to my competition, I made little progress in the first lap (despite it being my fastest), put some hurt on folks in my 2nd and won my Kona slot with my 3rd lap. (while I didn't run the run I wanted because I screwed up my hydration and this led to some cramping, I generally felt great on the run and felt like I could have easily set a PR--at 54 years of age--absent the cramping).

I can't even remember what it was like riding without a PM. It has taken all of the mystery and guess work out of the bike leg for me.

One last thing. The newer Garmin software now allows to track Normalized Power and in reality, what you should be doing is dialing in your right NP target and hitting that during the race. So, if you're really smooth you can average a higher avg watts but if you're spikey--jumping up when you exit turns, or coasting every now and then, then you'll have your avg NP cause you to ride with a lower average watts. The difference between NP/AP from one rider to the next is enough to blow-up your race plan if you are real spikey. My advice, irrespective of your power system is to get the new Garmin computers so you can watch that....

One more last thing--get coglin's (prob spelling this wrong) book on racing/training with a PM--it really helps

Good Luck on the KQ--it's worth it getting there--best race in the world in my view...

Randy Christofferson(http://www.rcmioga.blogspot.com

Insert Doubt. Erase Hope. Crush Dreams.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [rcmioga] [ In reply to ]
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Many thanks for the useful responses guys - very much appreciated. I will use your posts as ammo when my GF tells me I already spend enough money on this sport :)
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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I would not worry about what a girlfriend things about you spending money on the sport. Wife yes, girlfriend, not so much. My 2 cents :-)
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
For me, the biggest advantage is on really windy or really hilly courses. There is going by feel or HR and then there is watching a competitor go up the road. Let's say we are in half IM and we're on a 6% grade and I am holding at 220W and some guy who weighs more than me by 50 lbs blows by like I am standing still. It is like a secret weapon knowing that 220W feels easy, but this guy is probably doing 330W or more

~snip~

Dev

Agree. In NZ this year, after 10kms (6 miles), I was averaging just around my goal of 165W, which felt really really easy. This included a reasonably long climb & a slight headwind, and meant an average speed of 24kph (15mph) - I was thinking that my race was going to custard. First IM nerves, too..! By the time I finished, 167W meant 31.4kph (19.5mph). Without a power meter, I am sure that I would have overcooked the bike.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [NAB777] [ In reply to ]
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Same deal for me at IMFrance 2010. I was riding at 210 W on the first long climb which I already knew was way hard and I had to keep rolling back to get it under 200W, and EVERYONE was pulling away. By 4 hours into the ride, they were all coming back. Some of those guys I lapped on the run (4x10.5K loops). I'd probably have thought I was totally lame without the powermeter as the pace genuinely felt like a ride to the corner store...well it did for the first hour of climbing, but suddenly in the 4th hour it became "more than easy" to mentally throttle back to around 190W and by then everyone (around me) was moving backwards. In the end, with the long downhills (coasting) I ended up riding 185W (ave).
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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out of curiosity, devashish_paul and nab777,

how do those average power figures translate as W/Kg?



I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Adam Savage
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [slidecontrol] [ In reply to ]
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When I was racing IM France at 62 kilos, 185W was 2.98W per kilo. FTP that spring was 255W or 4.11W per kilo. I'm a loooooooong way from that (kilos up by 4, watts down by 50 or more). IMFrance is definitely a watts per kilo course. It's about the best course for watts per kilo on the entire Ironman circuit. Aside from the final 20K, watts per Cda does not even come into play.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [UrsusAdiposimus] [ In reply to ]
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For a long course athlete it lets you race the first hour at an appropriate effort not worrying if your HR is elevated from the swim, etc. You should know what you can do beforehand and then you do it.

From a training point of view, I ride a lot harder now than I used to pre power, and when I don't ride harder, I know how much easier I should ride and I do it. No guessing

Jason
Dig It Triathlon and Multisport
http://www.digittri.com
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [slidecontrol] [ In reply to ]
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slidecontrol wrote:
out of curiosity, devashish_paul and nab777,

how do those average power figures translate as W/Kg?

FTP at the time was approx 258, at a hair under 72kgs, so basically 3.6w/kg
In the Ironman, my average power was 167 (2.3w/kg).
Normalized was 180 (2.5w/kg) - 70% of FTP.
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Re: How did power change how you race IMs? [NAB777] [ In reply to ]
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cheers guys,

that info gives me a frame of reference to compare with.



I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Adam Savage
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