Dammit...you mean I've been missing out on taking roids for the last couple of years...I shouldn't have switched to SaltStick tabs!

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Wow. You'll have to excuse my lack of knowledge on this topic (first time I heard the story), but is she claiming that Hammer supposedly put this substance in to her product intentionally, or that somehow they accidentally ended up there....meaning they have poor QC?

Poor Quality control.

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My Homepage

Amazing. Maybe just an attempt to get Hammer to settle out of court and cover her other legal expenses?

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

She wants to take them to court - she doesn't want to settle and neither does her lawyer - this is going to run and run...

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My Homepage

wow. that is really sad.

This really could happen to any of us.

Dan
www.aiatriathlon.com

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http://www.aiatriathlon.com

Well I guess that means I might be a doper.
If this is really true, it's quite sad. Hammer was very nice trying to help me work out my IM nutrition.

Sad?? Whats sad is the 2 years Keat has been banned from earning a living for and the doubts and backchat from her competitors because of Hammer's negligence!

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My Homepage

I'm no expert in the supplement/nutrition field, but I'm skeptical of Keat's assertion Hammer's products were contaminated with norandrostenedione. I say this because all of the Hammer products I'm familiar with are made from things that do not contain appreciable amounts of steroids and would not make it into the final product regardless of quality control problems.

If anyone can point out an example of an ingredient(s) found in a Hammer product that COULD contain norandrostenedione and how that ingredient might possibly get contaminated then I will stand corrected. Otherwise, it sounds to me that Keats is trying to make Hammer a scapegoat for her positive test...any everything in that article is smoke and mirrors (her depression, her zeal to expose hammer, etc)

Another possibility is that Hammer is intentionally spiking their products with steroids and not including it on their ingredient listings. I doubt this is the case...this would be a huge liability for Hammer if they were caught...basically put them out of business and I can't see them taking that chance.

My 0.02

That was the (unconfirmed as far as I know) rumor about the earliest releases of Met-Rx. It worked just a little too well...

I'm skeptical that Hammer would add it to Enduralytes (sp?) anyway. Anything you'd use in varying quantity like that (some hot days a ton, some other days/weeks zero) wouldn't provide any benefit. If indeed it is true, then it may have been a manufacturing error or something. I'm sure they contract that out.

I have a couple year old bottle. Might just have to start popping those babies!

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Too f@ckin depressed from various injuries to care about having a signature line.

Sponsored by Blue Shield PPO.

Two other athletes (Canadian Mike Vine and American Amber Neben) tested positive for the same steroid pre-cursor while using the same products...odd coincidence. I believe Vine's case was ruled similarily to Keat's...contaminated supplement

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Shawn
TORRE Consulting Services, LLC
http://www.TORREcs.com

There is no scapegoat. She tested all the products she used in the race and the endurolytes contained the nandrolone derrivative. This is not a case based on guess but pure fact - thats why it has taken over 2 years to finally be filed.

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Does Hammer manufacture all their own supplements in their own facilities, or do they farm it out to some one else?

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

You would not believe how many supplements (especially the ones that seem to work) are contaminated with steroids, steroid precursors, or other stuff. In my clinical experience, this is more common in the supplements marketed to the strength and conditioning industry than the endurance sports industry. Every year, I see a number of athletes who turn up with crazy liver function tests or something and it turns out they have a contaminated supplement.

If the supplement seems to "work", and it doesn't seem to contain any of the usual suspects, you'd better be wondering what is in there that isn't on the label.

Phil

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Dr. Philip Skiba
Scientific Training for Endurance Athletes now available on Amazon!

I did not read their suit, but, usually the problem is with cross-contamination since their products would be made in factories amongst a wide variety of other products. I used to have a deal with Hammer and you sign a contract saying that you are taking that risk. They say they are doing the best they can to prevent it and to their knowledge, no banned substances are in their products. I assumed they were being very careful and not taking any risks. I guess we might find out in the near future.

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Scott McMillan, M.Sc
Twitter@Factor9Coaching | Factor9Coaching.com | Facebook

There won't be any winners in this case. Keat and Vine have lost already. Now Hammer is losing a lot. And the case is not even closed.

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Scott McMillan, M.Sc
Twitter@Factor9Coaching | Factor9Coaching.com | Facebook

I remember reading an article in a magazine in the past year (not sure which mag, possibly one of Men's Health, Men's Fitness, or Muscle and Fitness) which talked about the poor quality control in most supplement makers products, and how they (or at least the top ones) were working to clean all that up. They listed some of the different substances found in various products, and it was a huge list. I will see if I can track that article down.

This very situation was one of the dangers that they listed when they were talking about it, from what I remember.

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Starting from scratch...

Only a matter of time before people start looking everywhere and anywhere for something....I think we need more lawyers...

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

This mostly happens in the US because there is no law that says they must be prepared seperately. Here in NZ it is covered by law. So NZ based supplements have to do this. You will also find that most Protein Whey products come from a NZ firm regardless of the Branding on the outside.

I don't know, man. I'd usually agree with you, but I don't think it is out of line to expect some quality control from a company making products that you are going to put in your body. Especially one that holds itself out to be so "scientific".

Phil

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Dr. Philip Skiba
Scientific Training for Endurance Athletes now available on Amazon!

Go for her. I mean Hammer claims its products will basically maek you walk on water and now we see why. What the hell were they doing putting Andro into their stuff anyhow?

Bob

Interesting...hadn't thought of the cross contamination angle. I couldn't see Hammer intentionally spiking their salt pills with steroids (for the reason Aztec stated) nor could I see how an ingredient in Endurolytes could be contaminated (basically different salts).

You would think Hammer would have a zero tolerance policy since this might very well put them out of business.

What supplement does not claim to pretty outlandish things?


Not that what they say has anything to do with what is in the stuff....

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

Oh I completely agree 100%, but I still ask what the hell Andro was even doing in their production facility. I mean its only been banned for years!

Bob