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HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision??
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Hey,

So I just got my hands on a flashing Argon 18 e119+ frameset. My local bike shop had them at a discount as they are introducing the brand to Mexico City!!

It’ll take me some time to put it all together but the first purchase I’ll do is a new wheelset — which for the time being I can install in my road bike.

I do 70.3 IM and was looking at several brands. The Argon configuration in the US had HED Blacks 9/6 last year and they ship to Mexico which is great! However my local bike shop carries Fulcrum and Vision and was (obviously) talking wonders about them. Also, most “top wheels” lists online have the Zipps at the top (not to mention the Kona bike count).

Any suggestions? Are the HED Blacks solid enough to compete with the Zipp 606 configuration (404 front 808 back)? Are they worth the money? Are Fulcrum Soeed and Vision Metron even worth considering?

Thanks in advance!!
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Forgot to mention that I’m getting really competitive about this and had my first top 20 finish in my last race so thinking long term about the wheel set — probably even fight for a qualifying spot to the WC in 2021 / 2022!!
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Kevin from Vision here.

I would be happy to answer any questions on Vision wheels you have. The Metron wheels are always a great option if you are looking for a fast, durable, and tubeless compatible wheel set.

Look forward to helping you with any questions you may have.

Kevin
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Blacks aren't necessarily worth the extra, same aero performance from the jet+, blacks just have better braking. From an aero perspective, I'd put the heds ahead of vision and fulcrum, and tied with zipp, maybe faster. If I were you, I'd buy a hed jet 6+ front and rear for all around riding, and then either a disc cover or a jet+ disc if budget allows. Can probably get the jet 6+ and disc for about what the zipps cost, and you can be confident you have the fastest wheelset available
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Kevin@VisionUSA] [ In reply to ]
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Hey dude!

So What about the Vision bearings? I’ve read that ceramics are the best bearings out there, do the Metrons come with ceramic bearings?

Thanks!!
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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HED wheels are solid and thought by many here to be one of the best bang for your buck wheelsets. Assuming your bike is rim brake, keep an eye out here in the classified, you will get a great deal if you're patient.

Don't worry about ceramic bearings

the world's still turning? >>>>>>> the world's still turning
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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HED. Always HED. They are likely the fastest of the bunch. The Black version brakes are spectacular-- almost the same wet as dry. And, the look cooler.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [imswimmer328] [ In reply to ]
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imswimmer328 wrote:
Blacks aren't necessarily worth the extra, same aero performance from the jet+, blacks just have better braking. From an aero perspective, I'd put the heds ahead of vision and fulcrum, and tied with zipp, maybe faster. If I were you, I'd buy a hed jet 6+ front and rear for all around riding, and then either a disc cover or a jet+ disc if budget allows. Can probably get the jet 6+ and disc for about what the zipps cost, and you can be confident you have the fastest wheelset available

This right here is spot on advice. I transitioned from a high-end all carbon wheelset, 7/9 combo. Last season I got an amazing deal on HED jet black 5's with a jet black disc rear wheel as well. First thing I noticed is was the braking improvement with the machined brake track, but aside from that, I was quite literally AMAZED at how much faster the 5's were than what I was riding before. When racing with the disc on the back it almost felt like cheating; rolling right by people in my AG I used to battle with.

Seriously, HED is in a different league, and when they're that much cheaper than zipp or enve, it's a complete no-brainer.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Ceramic bearings are brittle and prone to cracking.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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Why would you buy $4k ZIPPs, if you can buy $1.5 HEDs with similar performance?


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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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HEDs Jets have consistently been some of the fastest wheels out there and they also tend to not as sensitive to tire choice as other wheels. You can spend twice as much or more on all carbon wheels and not be any faster.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Ksavostin] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for this graph dude!!

From reading all the answers I think I’ll grab the HEDs — maybe in the 6/9 combo as the US configuration for the Argon
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Ksavostin] [ In reply to ]
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Ksavostin wrote:
Why would you buy $4k ZIPPs, if you can buy $1.5 HEDs with similar performance?




I would never do that. $1,500 is way too much to pay for HED wheels. You can get them on sale.
Last edited by: jimatbeyond: Apr 1, 20 8:40
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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A rear disc wheel would be faster than a spoked wheel.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Alvahect wrote:
Thanks for this graph dude!!

From reading all the answers I think I’ll grab the HEDs — maybe in the 6/9 combo as the US configuration for the Argon
I'd go with 6/6 a wheel cover for the back when you want full aero; or I'd get 6/disc.
6/9 is less stable than 6/6 and slower than 6/disc. I use something similar to 6/9 myself and it works perfectly well, but I would do as above if I was making the decision again.

I concur with everyone else re HED/Zipp - HED is a more sensible choice and ceramic bearings should not be a priority. Really good ceramics would be good, but still a minor improvement for a huge outlay. Whereas good steel bearings will also perform very very well and cost a fraction as much. Average ceramics are a waste of money. It's amazing how the marketing around bikes has successfully convinced most people that if components are carbon or ceramic they're great and everything else is outdated. Simply not true. It's about how they're used. There are some very poorly conceived engineering solutions out there based on using these materials for fashion and marketing reasons, as opposed to using them because they are the best material for the puspose.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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I am also a fan of HED but Fulcrum and Vision aren't bad wheels.

Fulcrum is owned by Campagnolo and the wheels share a lot of parts. They offer some good very high end stuff and I am a fan of their entry level road wheels in terms of value for money. However in terms of offerings they jump from $500 training wheelsets straight to $2500 for a wheelset. You can get great wheels in between this range from other companies. Also Fulcrum has recently put a lot of energy in developing road disc wheels which isn't your market.

Vision is in a similar boat. They make a training line of wheels called 'TriMax' which are alloy wheels with an aesthetic coating of carbon. Then the Metron range then the much much more expensive range of race wheels but with the associated massive leap in price.

What HED does that others don't is produce a top quality race wheel that combines an allow rim with a carbon fairing. This allows them to sell a complete Jet wheelsets for less than Fulcrum or Vision sell there rear race wheels. There is a margin weight penalty for the design but a significant improvement in braking performance and aerodynamically it comes down to tire choice.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Alvahect wrote:
maybe in the 6/9 combo as the US configuration for the Argon
I started with a 60/90 set of wheels for my first upgrade. I quickly regretted the decision and wished I had gone deeper. I now have a 90/disc as my everyday wheels. I love them. I do not notice wind at all. The only time I could ever see riding on anything less than a disc in back would be at Kona.
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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Agreed; to above poster, I also wouldn’t pay $1.5k for HED wheels when sales or classified here offer far cheaper options.
Last edited by: DFW_Tri: Apr 1, 20 5:36
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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If your bike came with Hed blacks in 60/90 the only wheel I'd consider buying would be a rear disc.

You might, and I mean if you really, really, really wanted to spend your $, you might be able to buy 2w worth of speed. IMO, spending that sort of $ for 2w is a bad idea.

I'd bet you 25% of your money though that you could spend half of what you wanted to on helmet/kit/tubes/tires and be waaaaay faster than a new wheelset would make you. After paying me 25%, you still have 25% left over! #winning

In all seriousness keep the heds invest in other things that matter such as I listed above

Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
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Re: HED vs Zipp vs Fulcrum vs Vision?? [Alvahect] [ In reply to ]
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Hi,

We do not use ceramic bearings in the Metron wheels. The Metron wheels did come with a ceramic bearing for a period of time but we found if the wheels were not maintained properly a good quality steel bearing was more durable and would help extend the life of the wheelset and allow for more miles/time between service.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Kevin
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