I'm a fan of doing a 90min ride before a fit so that anything that causes discomfort/fatigue is quickly apparent. I did fits when fresh (5-10min. warmup before starting the fit) and found the same issue you have.

---

ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

That's a great point

I think my issue is we lengthened the cockpit to flatten the back but now lower back discomfort starts in about 1:30 into a ride. I don't want to be those folks I see hands on pads last 40-50kof an IM

I don't know what is worse.....the fit or the man-bun.

Either way, both need to go.

/pink

---

Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

^
You might be missing an important detail.

Wow

---

blog

that made me laugh

---

---------------------------------------
Fruit snacks are for winners

Oh Fook me.......my sincere apologies. I was only viewing the posts from my phone and made the misogynist assumption that SLOgoing was a guy (like most posters here).

Again, my apologies.

---

Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

5 minutes is better than 0 minutes!

1. Yes, new saddle. I mean, 1000x yes. Adamo, Cobb JOF, etc. That Terry is probably ok for road riding, but not for tri riding. Adamo PR2.0 isn't too expensive and Cobb offers a money back guarantee. SItero, Hilo, etc. also worth looking at. This will enable all further fitting adjustments.
2. your bars need to come way back. Probably 5 cm, or until you're just clear of your knee. Good news is that your arm rest clamps are ahead of the bar clamp, so you have loads of room to adjust. If you move the pads behind the clamps, you can pull the whole bar back a ways and your arms will support your trunk better.
3. Consider tilting your bars up. You might find a little relief doing that.

I think you'll be able to find *one* position that works with this setup. Once the seat is fixed, you'll find that there are other (better?) positions (removing spacers and pushing out the aerobars again) that work too. But you can't access them yet b/c your seat is limiting you.

Funny, this is what my basement floor looks like right now too. -J

---

----------------------------------------------------------------
Life is tough. But it's tougher when you're stupid. -John Wayne

Fix #1 as prescribed here and you won't need to do as much as is prescribed in #2.

That Terry forces the rider probably as much as 4 cm aft of where they would sit were they on a Cobb JOF or ISM.

---

Trent Nix
Owned and operated Tri Shop
F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter (back when those were things)

That's a good start.
One of my recent clients provides an example that should resonate for you (same bike, same position). They were no faster on Tri bike than road bike as well as being uncomfortable and, unsurprisingly, not happy with the situation.
Already had an Adamo saddle, which helped a lot. But it was in the rearward setting.
Came forward nearly 50mm, changed the bars to let them relax into the position better.
And lowered the bars - which was actually more comfortable.

If you were fixated on keeping the current saddle you would need a shorter stem (or to bring pads back). But as I mentioned earlier and the other fitters have just reinforced - getting an Adamo or JoF will move your sitting position further forward (which would be best). Then you would lower the bars to help drop into the position better (should be more comfortable and faster). And I still advocate changing the bars to ski bends and more curved pads. The bike below ended up with Profile J4 clamps and T1 extensions.

It's always fun when someone finds something counter-intuitive (longer, lower) to be more comfortable, once they're using the appropriate saddle appropriately.

Step 1 though is new saddle, for sure. Sit on the front half, "roll" your hips forward (think perching your butt) to find that sweet spot on your seat bones...probably the more "forward" portion of your seat bones, but still behind your pubic bone, relax your upper back/shoulders (this can be helped by doing what other posters have said, either changing the aero bars themselves, rolling extensions upward, etc), and feel like you're "sinking" into the arm pads.

There's a whole new world waiting for you out there OP...just gotta get to it!

This is interesting. I'm also planning on changing my front end/fit this off season on a 2011 transition pro. Really want to drop the front end and thinking of playing with different bend extensions (currently on T2) to something like the zipp vuka (not sure which mm bend yet). You seem to have set this person up on the front end way closer to what I wish I had. I just know so little about this stuff and I'm nervous to change a fit that's comfortable for me now

You won't know if another position could be more comfortable and faster unless you try...

If you have your saddle set a long way back, as we're discussing in this thread, you can likely move it forward, bars down and change to the ski bends.
If your position doesn't have those problems you may just be exchanging the extensions for improved wrist comfort.
If you're not confident about making position changes - find someone who is (as a bike fitter, I'd suggest a bike fitter ;-))

I say nervous because I've already paid for the professional fit and, yes, it's relatively conservative as has been discussed here in multiple threads. I just don't want to get into a situation where I can't get it sorted myself and then need to pay for a fit again. Guess I can just always start my own thread like this to get the advice

Indeed--and why not go for your own thread?
For anything you're about to move, you just measure relative to something fixed on the bike (e.g. a joint) and write it down. Take lots of measures (x,y,z) until you know exactly what you need. I know that the first time is a bit daunting, but it's really not the end of the world. Also, bring a roll of masking tape and anytime you're moving something clamped, just wrap a little tape around and/or mark with a pencil before moving to let you know where it was. Works for seat height, extension position, etc. That way you have redundancy.

---

----------------------------------------------------------------
Life is tough. But it's tougher when you're stupid. -John Wayne

I have been experimenting with my position constantly to improve to my very own liking, and I'd suggest you give it a try. Also no shame in going back to the fitter and asked to be reevaluated, i have several times until i found a confy position and didn't start changing things on my own until i moved 800 from my fitter lol

And as said before, definitely a tri saddle ISM helped me out a lot and a foward seat post will take you to promised land! I understand about the money spent in a fitter, i paid quite a bit for my area for my fit and now that i moved to FL, fittings are no less than $350 and no retul!

---

Speed kills unless you have speed skills!!!

Those are good points, thanks!

You need to go see Phil at Hypercat in Ventura. Awesome guy and fairly close to you.
Did Arts do that fitting???

I agree. That fit is crap. Ask for your money back.

I must point out that Dan has diligently put together a massive database and heatmap of FIST Fitters right here on ST, and there is another search engine to 'find a Fitter'. BTI (Before the Internet) it may have been 'hard to find a really good fitter', but we have a great community here to spread the word.

---

Anne Barnes
ABBikefit, Ltd
FIST/SICI/FIST DOWN DEEP
X/Y Coordinator
abbikefit@gmail.com

Agreed! I found my fitter using the database ABarnes mentioned, and have been very happy with my roadbike fit. Turns out my fitter had even traveled to Dan's house when he was doing bike fit seminars a few winters ago. It's nice to know that I'm seeing a fitter that was trained by Dan personally, and wouldn't have found them if it weren't for the database here.

Woohoo! I got fit - for real - and I'm diggin it!

So.... long story short, got a ton of PMs from lots of you ST'ers out there - thank you! And finally had my travel schedule align with a trip to Ian Murray for a fitting. It was a great experience, loads of fun, and I ended up very happy with my new fit.





Took it out for a quick spin today, was pretty darn comfortable. The best part... I did an out and back ride today and turned around at around 30 minutes and head back to the office. Unbeknownst to me was that my husband was also out on a ride and saw me ahead and couldn't catch up to me (I was pulling away, actually) until I got stopped at the "forever light" and he came rolling up. We laughed that we were both out there and we rode the last 3 miles together. He said I looked like "one of those pros" and then realized it was me. Happy!

I am going to move from 172.5 cranks to 165s. And the zero offset seat post - the saddle is as far forward as possible. So, now my drop is 11.5 (did I say that right) instead of a rise of stupid. And a new saddle is happy too. Fun stuff, Ian undermount the aerobars and put the pads on top of the bars. I'm not sure how to describe it, but it is kind of upside down in order to get that drop. In the video you can see how much of the fork tube thingy is sticking up - he whacked it off so I don't look dorky or impale myself on it.

Thanks to everybody for all the comments, suggestions, references, and support! You all saved a triathlete!

---

Hillary Trout
San Luis Obispo, CA

Your trip is short. Make the most of it.
https://www.slogoing.net/

Congrats. Looks great. Saw Ian's post on FB and thought hey I know who that is!

now you see what a F.I.S.T. fitter can do when he's a good fitter, on good equipment, and with the right protocol and training. of course ian doesn't get the training, he gives it. he's one of two F.I.S.T. instructors who teaches with me at our workshops.

as we move into Road Show season this spring, i'll be doing this kind of fitting at around 10 of our shows and ian will be doing the fitting at 5 or 6 of our shows.

---

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

"my husband was also out on a ride and saw me ahead and couldn't catch up to me (I was pulling away, actually)"
I'm of two minds on this: 1) Right on! Sounds like we nailed it. and 2) Uh oh, hope this new position and the speed that's coming with it doesn't cause any domestic problems :)

So glad you came in to see me,

Ian

---

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan