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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
That really sucks. He's done a fantastic job the past 7-8 years. :(


Oh that really sucks about Dom resigning. He has done an amazing job building sport in this region. In the case of this marathon, I can't comment on response time and what is acceptable, but 8 minutes for first responders to get to the site after the first call, at the surface seems reasonable. It seems like it took 17 minutes for the call to happen.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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He’s not going anywhere. They refused his resignation
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
SBRcanuck wrote:
That really sucks. He's done a fantastic job the past 7-8 years. :(



Oh that really sucks about Dom resigning. He has done an amazing job building sport in this region. In the case of this marathon, I can't comment on response time and what is acceptable, but 8 minutes for first responders to get to the site after the first call, at the surface seems reasonable. It seems like it took 17 minutes for the call to happen.

The coroner's report will clear it up, but there is a lot of chatter of police being on their radios but no calls getting to 911.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [nockon] [ In reply to ]
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nockon wrote:
He’s not going anywhere. They refused his resignation

I think his resignation as race director was accepted but he will continue to work for Tremblant (city, resort.....I don't know which)
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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marcag wrote:
nockon wrote:
He’s not going anywhere. They refused his resignation


I think his resignation as race director was accepted but he will continue to work for Tremblant (city, resort.....I don't know which)

Yeah the article in tri canada magazine isn't super clear, but sounds something like that. Hopefully he agrees to stay on board in some fashion. Amazing race director, and always appeared to me as genuinely caring about the athletes, both in his actions and in his race instructions at the pre-race meetings.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
marcag wrote:
nockon wrote:
He’s not going anywhere. They refused his resignation


I think his resignation as race director was accepted but he will continue to work for Tremblant (city, resort.....I don't know which)


Yeah the article in tri canada magazine isn't super clear, but sounds something like that. Hopefully he agrees to stay on board in some fashion. Amazing race director, and always appeared to me as genuinely caring about the athletes, both in his actions and in his race instructions at the pre-race meetings.

He is an amazing guy. People in the IM world know him as the guy who make made IMMT a world class event

People in Tremblant know him as the guy that took a ski resort that was seriously struggling in the summer months and turned into a destination for training and racing year round.

I have friends who know nothing about tri but know the value of their real estate has gone up significantly since Dominique led the charge to bring IM to Tremblant.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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I've noticed the real estate too as we looked at condos in the pedestrian village the last several years, and prices have def gone way up.
In 2016 when we raced in the downpour at IMMT, I remember him standing in the middle of the road out towards lac superior waving everyone to slow down. And more recently at the race briefings, talking about safety, and saying "On race day, you are all my children". :)
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
IRONMAN should have waited until AFTER all of the athletes were off the bike course before driving the automobile on the bike course (to pick up cones). If that IRONMAN van is not on the bike course, the accident never happens. It's really that simple.

The fact that there are other risks in bike riding is irrelevant. IRONMAN took a wholly unnecessary risk, which resulted in killing an athlete.



If you are directly affected by this tragedy, I am sorry for your pain and loss. If not, then you just sound like an attorney attempting to construct a cause of action against Ironman.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [monty] [ In reply to ]
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The vehicle was obviously not on the "finished" part of the course when the vehicle ran over the athlete on the bike course. IRONMAN should wait until all athletes are off the course prior to driving a cleanup vehicle on the course. No excuse for such unsafe policies.



monty wrote:
I've never seen a truck picking up cones during the race and when athletes are still on the course when I volunteer as well. Am I missing something? I think Amateur has a good point.

I have been in races where they are still putting out cones after the race is started. And just because you dont see in your super limited viewpoint of a course cones being picked up, does not mean it isnt happening. I have put on ver 60 races, been in another 700 or so, and quite often see the race vehicles going after the last rider and pulling up the course. Sounds like this is exactly what was happening here, they were on the already finished part of the course, picking up cones. It is unfortunate, but I dont see any blame at all if this is how it all went down. I know it is hard for some of you, and you feel there must be blame somewhere. By that logic, it goes all the way back to when she got up out of bed and actually went to the race. Had she not done that, no accident either, see how silly that is??
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Races would be dramatically less safe if no official vehicles whatsoever were allowed on course before all athletes were off the course.

Tragedy can leave grieving people not thinking rationally, which is understandable. I'm afraid that is the case here. No one can be blamed for this.

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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [RowToTri] [ In reply to ]
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The vehicle was cleaning up cones. Could have and should have waited until after all athletes were off the bike course. The greedy Chinese corporation obviously isn't thinking about athlete safety.

(This wasn't an emergency vehicle addressing an emergency, nor is anyone arguing that under no circumstances whatsoever should a vehicle ever be on the course.)


RowToTri wrote:
Races would be dramatically less safe if no official vehicles whatsoever were allowed on course before all athletes were off the course.

Tragedy can leave grieving people not thinking rationally, which is understandable. I'm afraid that is the case here. No one can be blamed for this.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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I'm certain everyone knows your opinion about the vehicles by now. Don't worry.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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The vehicle was obviously not on the "finished" part of the course when the vehicle ran over the athlete on the bike course. //

How is that obvious? You do know courses use both side of the road sometimes? And from what I hear, she drifted across to the closed part of the course, for some unknown reason. Like someone else said, you just seem like some lawyer trying to litigate this case here on the forum, and underlying passages does not make them true, or any more relevant. Give it a rest.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
The vehicle was cleaning up cones. Could have and should have waited until after all athletes were off the bike course. The greedy Chinese corporation obviously isn't thinking about athlete safety.

(This wasn't an emergency vehicle addressing an emergency, nor is anyone arguing that under no circumstances whatsoever should a vehicle ever be on the course.)

You're really an idiot if you think that is why the vehicle was on the course. Since you're not a triathlete and just a troll, please move on.

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Riders had not "finished" riding thru that section of the road where the athlete was struck. That is why it is not a "finished" part of the course. What in the world could be more obvious?

Actually if you look at the 1st post in this thread, you will see that I am merely reiterating what the victim's husband said. Note the boldfaced sentence at the end:

"This is Ken Morris, husband of jill morris. There is so much nonsense that is being spewed onto this post, started by Ironman Tremblant a couple of days ago. The truth is at this point, the autopsy proved that Jill was killed by one of the Tremblant service vehicles as it drove over her chest and crushed it. She had no heart or related condition that caused her to die. Do not believe any of the articles being issued, they are either false or speculative. It does not matter if and how Jill "swerved"...No service vehicle should have been present anywhere on that bike course while participants where still riding."

It is so incredibly obvious that the IRONMAN automobile did not need to be on the course.


monty wrote:
The vehicle was obviously not on the "finished" part of the course when the vehicle ran over the athlete on the bike course. //
How is that obvious? You do know courses use both side of the road sometimes? And from what I hear, she drifted across to the closed part of the course, for some unknown reason. Like someone else said, you just seem like some lawyer trying to litigate this case here on the forum, and underlying passages does not make them true, or any more relevant. Give it a rest.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Actually if you look at the 1st post in this thread, you will see that I am merely reiterating what the victim's husband said//

I have a lot of sympathy for him and what happened to his wife, it is unimaginable to me. You are doing him no favors, quite the contrary..
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Really, why is that? I precisely agree with everything Ken said - especially the fact that the IM automobile should not have been on the bike course while athletes were still riding.


monty wrote:
Actually if you look at the 1st post in this thread, you will see that I am merely reiterating what the victim's husband said//

I have a lot of sympathy for him and what happened to his wife, it is unimaginable to me. You are doing him no favors, quite the contrary..
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
Really, why is that? I precisely agree with everything Ken said - especially the fact that the IM automobile should not have been on the bike course while athletes were still riding.


monty wrote:
Actually if you look at the 1st post in this thread, you will see that I am merely reiterating what the victim's husband said//

I have a lot of sympathy for him and what happened to his wife, it is unimaginable to me. You are doing him no favors, quite the contrary..

At SOME point you have to put the onus on the athlete to take care of themselves. Maybe we should do away with corners too, they can be pretty dangerous if the athlete loses control.

This is not a case of a vehicle being somewhere it shouldn't have been. It is a case of an athlete losing control of their bike on an uphill section, riding into the wrong lane and crashing themselves into an oncoming vehicle moving at something like 3mph.

You can spin it however you like, saying that the vehicle didn't -need- to be there, but it is in fact very normal for all sorts of race related vehicles to be on course. Many races around the world don't even have the roads closed to normal traffic.

While we all genuinely feel bad for the family, I also feel horrible for the person driving the vehicle, as well as an incredible race director being wrongfully shamed by a select few.

Maybe we should just say fuck it, and have all triathlons on Vasa swim ergs, indoor bikes, and treadmills......
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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Actually, it is. Feel free to explain why the IRONMAN automobile could not have waited until all athletes were off the bike course.



SBRcanuck wrote:

This is not a case of a vehicle being somewhere it shouldn't have been..
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
Actually, it is. Feel free to explain why the IRONMAN automobile could not have waited until all athletes were off the bike course.



SBRcanuck wrote:


This is not a case of a vehicle being somewhere it shouldn't have been..


Because there shouldn't be a need to wait..

The vehicle was in its correct lane, a lane that oncoming cyclists have a responsibility to not be in.

What about one of the ironman races that are open to all traffic. If a racer rides his/her bike into oncoming traffic and dies, will you sue that race too?
Last edited by: SBRcanuck: Sep 29, 19 8:24
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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But why can't the IRONMAN automobile wait until all riders are off the course?

You are forgetting that IM's number one priority is athlete safety, supposedly. Accordingly, its policies should minimize risk, not pose additional, unnecessary risks to athletes.


SBRcanuck wrote:
Amateur wrote:
Actually, it is. Feel free to explain why the IRONMAN automobile could not have waited until all athletes were off the bike course.



SBRcanuck wrote:


This is not a case of a vehicle being somewhere it shouldn't have been..


Because there shouldn't be a need to wait..

The vehicle was in its correct lane, a lane that oncoming cyclists have a responsibility to not be in.

What about one of the ironman races that are open to all traffic. If a racer rides his/her bike into oncoming traffic and dies, will you sue that race too?
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
Really, why is that? I precisely agree with everything Ken said - especially the fact that the IM automobile should not have been on the bike course while athletes were still riding.


monty wrote:
Actually if you look at the 1st post in this thread, you will see that I am merely reiterating what the victim's husband said//

I have a lot of sympathy for him and what happened to his wife, it is unimaginable to me. You are doing him no favors, quite the contrary..

The IM vehicle was no longer on the bike course. The northbound side of the road was no longer part of the bike course by that time. The only part of the road that was still the Ironman bike course was the southbound side of the road.

You do realize that there are lots of courses around the world that only use half of the public roadway while the other part of the roadway is not part of the course. This can be temporal in nature to, which you're not getting. As the northbound was no longer part of the Ironman course, it was being prepared for public re opening as it should after a race has used it.

I know this sounds harsh, but riders are supposed to stay on the roadway allocated to them. We're supposed to stay on the right side of the course. Riding in the middle of the lane allocated to us is a penalty called blocking. Crossing the centerline of a road in an automatic DQ. All of these measures are part of the rules to keep us riding on the safe side of the road (and of course to limit drafting etc).
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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He's not a triathlete. He's in fact just a troll.

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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I don't know if you've ever done a race or not. It's very common for the organizers to clear the course as quickly as possible as the final participants complete it. That literally means they are following the last athletes. They have an obligation to the community to clear the course and release the roads to the public. Where do you draw the line? I'm sure it depends. You clearly can't wait until the last athlete finishes to start the process. The entire course can't be held up in sections where people are no longer even racing. So in this case they are following far behind, in the opposite lane. Assuming everyone stays in their lane, which is required for safety even if there are no vehicles, then everything is good. What if she had crossed the line and hit another competitor? Then who's fault is it? It seems like you are far too emotionally vested in this one and/or you are just plain clueless. Your point of view is unfair to the organizers of the race. This was a tragic accident, but not one that as far as I can tell can be blamed on the organizers or the driver of the truck. I did this race this year and I think it we very well run. I'm going back next year without a second thought.
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Re: Death on bike course at IMMT 70.3 [Amateur] [ In reply to ]
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Amateur wrote:
But why can't the IRONMAN automobile wait until all riders are off the course?

Because there is no reason to wait. The fact that this very freak accident occurred does not change that fact.

Anytime something bad happens (and in this case something very bad happened), you can always come up with a bunch of "if only" scenarios that would have prevented it. You keep saying that the van didn't *need* to be there. Remove that van and your wife is probably still alive. But the "freak" part of this is not that the van was picking up cones, but rather your wife was in such a poor state that she left the course, passed out and fell under it... right when it happened to be going by at 3mph. Most races are open to traffic and the chances of a horrible accident are far, far greater if a rider behaves in this manner. Not to mention riding outside anywhere on the roads.

I understand that you are looking for some place to lay blame for this, but I don't see anything wrong with what the race organization was doing. It was a tragedy, but that doesn't mean anyone was at fault. Things like this simply happen, thousands of times every...
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