This could be interesting. Is my understanding correct, that if Ironman had to issue refunds to everyone they would be bankrupt?

I'm probably in the minority here.

I had the opportunity to buy insurance - I chose not to buy it.

When I look at the cost of registration, it's hardly worth any lawsuit. I have nothing against attorneys, my brother and daughter are attorneys, but class action suits tend to benefit the attorneys much more than the clients. Once the settlement is done, I get some portion (not all and normally a small percentage) of my money, the attorneys get a large number (a portion of everyone's settlement) and (in this case) the company goes bankrupt. I personally see no long-term value in hurting the IM organization. Do I think they're perfect? Nope. I don't hold IM responsible for the shut down or for me choosing not to buy insurance.

Likewise, even though I have a small investment in gear (ten year old bike I bought for $750, good running shoes that I also use for my half marathons and cheap clothes), I still don't think it's that much money to me. I'd hate to lose a wallet with $200 in cash in it, but I'd still eat that day. For those who have +10x my investment in the sport, the money is relatively small.

If there's no IM organization, there's a lot less opportunity to participate in 140.6 and 70.3 events. These all tend to be IM events because they are great at promoting events. Without the promotions, the number of participants is probably too low to host an event. I don't want to see those opportunities go away.

(flame suit on)

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Not a coach. Not a FOP Tri/swimmer/biker/runner. Barely a MOP AGer.
But I'm learning and making progress.

No Ironman could also mean that the independent races can make their way back and we can have some old loves come back like Silverman and Beach2Battleship.

Equating athletic persistence to persistence in pursuing a refund is a bit of stretch.

“ This is not acceptable. You’re giving me tomatoes – lots of different versions of tomatoes. Do you want tomato soup? In a salad? I don’t want tomatoes. That’s not acceptable.”

Huh???? This sounds like Adam Sandler’s speech in Billy Madison.

By the way, like everything Covid-related, I’m fairly sure there’s a thread on this already.

This has already been posted on the board like 15x.

And no, I'm not.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

 
No Ironman could also mean that the independent races can make their way back and we can have some old loves come back like Silverman and Beach2Battleship
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I hear what you're saying, I do. But I think this doesn't really represent the state of the sport. Take, for example, the Musselman as posted in the OP's article. That was a spectacular race. I've done it many times and had planned on keeping it on my schedule for the foreseeable future. They 'sold out' to the WTC simply because the numbers were dropping. The common folk just weren't signing up for the race in sustainable numbers. The options were to sell out or to fold. The WTC has saved a lot of races in this fashion. Quassy and Eagleman come to mind. Yes, I'm aware of some other examples where IM bullied some of the local events into submission. But I believe that they've done a lot more good to the racing scene than bad. The extinction of the WTC will not be good for sport.

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

Some people are so pathetic. We are in an extremely tough period, if we want any hope of things returning to normal we need to have a little patience and consideration. Pushing for refunds like this will just increase the likelihood of businesses going bankrupt and then we are left with nothing in the future to look forward to.

Just be patient and look forward to using the credit hopefully next year FFS...

I can’t imagine it will gain traction anyway... I mean, we all signed a waiver. I’m out 3 70.3s this year already. What’s next? They sue they work because they get furloughed?

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USAT Level II- Ironman U Certified Coach

IM will lose this suit. The lawyers will make millions and those who joined the class action suit will also be awarded...a coupon good for 10% off clearance merchandise at the IM store and a $3 credit on your next race entry.

Exactly. If successful, the lawyers will emerge enriched, while the athletes will get token settlements worth less than the change in their couch cushions, PLUS a diminished experience at future IM races because the host organization has been financially wounded further than they have already been by Covid-19.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

I am in agreement with you. And I hope that we are not in the minority. I am also a lawyer with a 32 year career span and agree that the only winners in a class action lawsuit will be the attorneys.

I think the people whining about the Ironman refund policy need to accept the fact that they knowingly signed up for a race and knew or should have known because they actually read the refund policy, what their options would be if the race was cancelled. And seriously, how can you blame Ironman for what has happened?

All of us who sign up for these events obviously are fortunate enough to to have discretionary income to spend on these pursuits. If you don’t, then please remember that it is your personal responsibility to actually read and understand the contract that you just signed by plunking down your hard earned cash for the entry fee.

Ms Blake- I am offering to refund the entry fee that you paid. That way, when your attorneys get to court, Ironman can argue that you did not mitigate your damages by accepting my offer.

Her name is Kellie Blake...pretty close to Karen....

Pretty sure that IM could just take everyone's money and offer no race if they wanted under the T&C's. So offering a deferral or change of race is as good as they can do under the circumstances.

Almost certainly


I’d like there to be an Ironman company after Covid so I’m fine just deferring the two races i’ve signed up for

One interesting thing is that Taiwan 70.3 had been moved to Sept 15. It looks like it may go, but you cannot fly to Taiwan so it will be just Taiwanese . I imagine I’ll get to pick another race but this will be interesting

However I won’t lose my shit over it. It’s hard times

Sure but it will almost certainly mean less races overall and less well run races. Ironman does a kick ass job at races, sure they make you pay for it, but that’s what I want. My ironman experiences have all been top notch

Vail resorts shut down and offered credit on their ski passes for next year. I got 90 percent credit because I hadn’t used my whistler pass yet. I was overjoyed. Pretty similar to Ironman giving me the option to move to another race next year. I am equally pleased

Yep, just to pile on, I think WTC has done a great job given the circumstances. I'm happy to let them keep my entry fees (one 70.3, one full) and defer to next year.
I love the WTC races, would have still been racing next ear anyway, and I want the company to survive.

I am not a lawyer, why would they lose the suit?

The contract would have to be invalid right?

I am actually curious as to why

You’re spot on. Ironman has “saved” loads of dying races in the US. For example, I did the Gulf Coast triathlon twice before it was 70.3 Gulf Coast. The race was dying a slow death before Ironman came along. I did it last year as 70.3 branded and loved it.

Similar in Maine I'd say. As a Rev3 event, it wasn't necessarily dying, but it only had 200-300 participants I believe. WTC took over an now, what, 2000+ participants? Pretty good bump in numbers!

Many believe that you sign your rights away whenever you sign a waiver, you don’t. While this suit will never ever see a trial (to determine win/lose), there’s probably enough ‘did they meet the obligations of the purchase agreement, etc.’ to warrant effort on the part of IM’s legal defense team. The purpose is to have the IM organization want to minimize costs and negative publicity and settle (money for the lawyers, token credit for participants). I haven’t seen the suit but I’d be surprised if there weren’t at least 10 items listed in it as reasons to justify the suit. That said, they don’t have to be good reasons, a judge will initially decide that.