I had a Chiro tell me that a couple of my disks are something like 3 out of 4 as far as degenerative disease goes. I know I have some back problems, but nothing that has been bothering me seriously for a couple year. I did have an MRI about 3 years ago that revealed two bulging disks and I went to rehab. Rehab did the trick and i have had any serious back problems sense.

I guess where I'm going with this is that the Chiro determined this from X-rays and then said I immediately needed to sign up for 40-60 sessions to get my back fixed up. I'm only 34 years old too. I'm sure everyone has degenerative disks these days.

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TheBikeRacer.com

Thanks Bud, I am in the fortunate position of being good friends with my Chiro prior to using him in his professional capacity so I know he will not be fleecing me. I guess what I am looking for is the likelihood of him supporting the sports injury guys suggestions so that I can prepare myself.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

Bump.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

Total BS. Get another doc.

I'm a radiologist who looks at LS films and MRI's all day for a living. What they describe is nothing severe and would probably be seen in the vast majority of 41yo males. Hell I've got 2 bad discs worst than what you have and I did 9:57 in an IM last year. My neck is shakey too, 5 hours in the aero position and it's killing me. Worse thing I could do to myself is sit around getting fat and feeling sorry for myself. Keep moving.

Triathlon training won't make a difference on the rate of wear of your discs. Biking and swimming do not stress the L spine at all. Running MAYBE a little but not likely anything of significance. More important is genetics and major injuries or repetitive heavy lifting.

I see little old ladies who have lead sedentary lives who have horrible backs. Bad genes.

I also see older guys with terrible looking backs and all they complain of is a little stiffness and decreased range of motion.

What time do you Docs take lunch/go home? Polite Bump.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

They don't take lunch. Eat and read 'em at the same time. Constant work flow. I'm guessing Slick gets in at 7:00, leaves at maybe 5:30 or 6:00. Probably works one and sometimes two weekends a month (that's 24 hours, around the clock). He may have 8 to 12 weeks off a year, but probably still averages 50 hours a week. Work hard, Play hard I guess.

My Brother-in-law is a radiologist. These guys earn every penny they make and work very, very hard. Having said that, if I would've gotten an MD, I think Radiology or Pathology is the way to go. But it is a very long road. 4 years college, 4 years med school, 4 years residency, study very hard for the boards, a few years to achieve partnership status, ...

And don't ever, ever let some Doc that is not a radiologist, play radiologist for you - Right Slick :)

So what time is it with you now,then?

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

It's 4:17 for me central time (GMT - 6), but I am not a doc - sorry if I gave you that impression.

Just have great admiration for them and I know just as there is lawyer bashing, to a lessor extent I see Dr bashing sometimes - not that this is the case here.

But one of the key take away points I ended my last msg with is to let the radiologist interpret the results of the MRI or whatever analysis was done. Don't rely on your doc as the radiologist is the expert in interpretation.

I hope Slick is right. I would hate to have to give up cycling or running (swimming I could do with out - heh heh)

I'm not a radiologist - I'm an orthopod, and I take care of backs all day, every day. Degenerative disk disease is extremely common, and should not keep you from being as active as possible. You may have some low back pain, but as long as you don't have pain or neurologic deficit (numbness, weakness, etc) in the legs, then you should go, go, go.

I would also be remiss were I not to mention that chiropractors typically don't have the training nor the experience to provide a complete care assessment for many back patients. There are some good ones out there, but you would be wise to seek an opinion from an MD with lots of spine experience - orthopod, neurosurgeon, or even a physiatrist.

Lastly, I will voluntarily refrain from comment regarding the weekly hours of our friends the radiologists. They nailed it - nice work. You radiologists know what I'm talking about.

Good luck with your back, jk.

Thanks for the info G, my Chiro is the Chiro of Southampton Football Club in England (a Premiership Soccer Team) so knows his Sports related stuff. I appreciate your comments although I am a little concerned as I have been experiencing pins and needles sensation in the upper right thigh around the hip joint, this is also the side that I have the impingement in.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

You got it brother!

Easy Guap. You're not exactly killing yourself.

Know any good 1 arm swimming drills?

Slick,

I've seen it first hand. You radiologists work hard (and play hard too!!!). I'll second the opinion on Chiropractors. I'm not against "alternative medicine", but please see the MD first. Sounds like nothing some good old fashined Physical Therapy can't cure.

I'm just teasing Guap. He's got a busted scapula and can't swim so he gets a little grouchy because he can't wup my ass in the water like he usually does.

I’m a surgical resident (that’s those crazy people whose work hours had to be restricted to 80 a week) – on a research “vacation”.

I second the opinions on chiros as well as on radiologists. Those people are the smartest in medicine (the radiologists) AND they deserve every single buck they make! Only not quite as much as the surgeons ... :-)

One more thing Julian. Almost every male MRI Lumbar spine I read over the age of 40 has at least some degenerative disc disease. It is rather rare to see a scan on a male your age that is completely normal. In a sense mild degenerative change of the discs is "normal" at your age.

Also remember that plain xrays can't show herniated discs, spinal stenosis, nerve root entrapment and a slew of other abnormalities which could be causing you problems. For that you need an MRI. Managed care companies don't want you to have an MRI because they are expensive but you ever notice that when a million dollar athlete gets hurt they have an MRI done before the next morning.

Also every triathlete I train with has been in my scanner (including el guapo several times). Why mess around with uncertainty?

Agreed. Surgical residents are hard core. When I was a resident I was working my ass off all night and yet STILL felt sorry for the surgery dudes.

My wife watched me try to swim my one-armed drills the other day and started laughing at me, saying I resembled an injured water-fowl. I'm getting a huge right shoulder.

jk, if you are having some neuro symptoms (as you described above) have an MD order you an MRI. You'll learn something from it. But the cardinal rule must be "Treat the patient, not the MRI." If you can get better on your own (and you probaly can) do that. Frankly, training is probably the best thing for it.

I personally think MRI machines are magic. Every time I get one, my problem is better in 4-6 weeks. Scapula included. Maybe Slick is a Magical Healer.

And, for the record, I pity surgical residents, too. All of the hours and none of the fun. At least I got to replace joints all day and then rod femurs and plate forearms all night. Dead gut looks the same 24 hours a day. Then, after 5 years of training and 1-3 years of research, what are you? A general surgeon. Ouch. No thank you.

Slick, I've had a sore throat for a couple days. Can I get a scan, please?

that's one of the reasons i'm much more attracted to cardiac surgery ... after a couple of years in the job, you don't even have to be awake during a routine cabg - means lot more recovery AND money to buy new p3s every year :-)

just daydreaming ...

CT Fellowship: smart move. Hicks did my dad's CABG while I was at U of R Med in '93. Plus the P3s would just be the tip of the iceberg.

The other avenue to consider from GS is Plastics. Very cool specialty. I did a lot of plastics stuff in the ER during residency, and I really enjoyed it.

The true tragedy about the MRI our training partner is getting tomorrow is that I can't say with 100% certainty which body part he wants to look at. He's got a few injury irons in the fire. Maybe he needs to have one of the brain.

Or you could take the long slow train to china like I did. 5 years of college (it was too much fun, so I hung around for an extra year), 4 years of med school, 2 years of general surgery, a 1 year MRI research fellowship, 4 years of diagnostic radiology and a musculoskeletal imaging fellowship to boot.

P.S. as I write this is is nearly 1 am and I am halfway into my week long call run. Radiology used to be a (relatively speaking) cushy job 20 years ago, but with the way ER's are now (we are one of two trauma hospitals in the state) 'call' is nothing but a 1 week 14 hour a night 'stat-fest'.

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That is just one more group of people that should be thrown screaming from a helicopter- George Carlin

Thanks Slick, I am seeing my Chiro Friday and will see what he says regarding an MRI and the cost (financial and otherwise).

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

Two words Doom:

Night Hawk

I finally cracked and signed on for coverage after midnight. Bad for the bottom line but good for triathlon training. At least I know I will get 6 hours sleep when on call. Radiology call is brutal nowadays and I'm at a small hospital.