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Anne Haug's bike
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Regarding the front page article (https://www.slowtwitch.com/...Cervelo_P5_8821.html).
Did anyone talk to Anne or her team? I'm wondering about two aspects:

1. Tires: the article says "There's no marking on it anywhere denoting size or pressure. We do know it's meant to be run tubeless though!"
I squint and see non-tubeless valves. Triathlete.com claims 25mm front, 28mm rear (87psi).
https://www.triathlete.com/gallery/2023-hawaii-ironman-world-championship-bike-anne-haugs-cervelo-p5/


2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?

https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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jcbesse wrote:
Regarding the front page article (https://www.slowtwitch.com/...Cervelo_P5_8821.html).
Did anyone talk to Anne or her team? I'm wondering about two aspects:

1. Tires: the article says "There's no marking on it anywhere denoting size or pressure. We do know it's meant to be run tubeless though!"
I squint and see non-tubeless valves. Triathlete.com claims 25mm front, 28mm rear (87psi).
https://www.triathlete.com/gallery/2023-hawaii-ironman-world-championship-bike-anne-haugs-cervelo-p5/


2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?

87psi for her size and weight? Seems tad bit too high.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [s13tx] [ In reply to ]
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s13tx wrote:
jcbesse wrote:
Regarding the front page article (https://www.slowtwitch.com/...Cervelo_P5_8821.html).
Did anyone talk to Anne or her team? I'm wondering about two aspects:

1. Tires: the article says "There's no marking on it anywhere denoting size or pressure. We do know it's meant to be run tubeless though!"
I squint and see non-tubeless valves. Triathlete.com claims 25mm front, 28mm rear (87psi).
https://www.triathlete.com/gallery/2023-hawaii-ironman-world-championship-bike-anne-haugs-cervelo-p5/


2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?


87psi for her size and weight? Seems tad bit too high.



EDIT:

Below I said I out mine at 90 but actually it is 80.

Agreed

I’m 225 with bike and rider and run 90psi

BTW 87? Really not 85 or 90. How accurate are bike pumps and pressure gauges when taking into account air leakage when placing onto the nipple and taking it off ?
Last edited by: MrTri123: Oct 13, 23 14:23
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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MrTri123 wrote:
s13tx wrote:
jcbesse wrote:
Triathlete.com claims 25mm front, 28mm rear (87psi).
https://www.triathlete.com/gallery/2023-hawaii-ironman-world-championship-bike-anne-haugs-cervelo-p5/

87psi for her size and weight? Seems tad bit too high.

Agreed
BTW 87? Really not 85 or 90. How accurate are bike pumps and pressure gauges when taking into account air leakage when placing onto the nipple and taking it off ?
87psi even for a 25 seems very high given she's (PTO profile) 52kg. Certainly for a 28 that's 'remarkeable'.
Btw, when you take the pump head off a presta valve there is no "air leakage". You hear the air escaping from the hose. There's no need for a '5' or '0' fetish with a digital pressure gauge. Gauges' accuracy differ. Calibration is as important.
I hope Haug finds a way to store her spare tube successfully. Can't believe an athlete with her deep experience allowed the debacle in Singapore.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [s13tx] [ In reply to ]
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I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Ajax Bay] [ In reply to ]
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Ajax Bay wrote:
MrTri123 wrote:
s13tx wrote:
jcbesse wrote:
Triathlete.com claims 25mm front, 28mm rear (87psi).
https://www.triathlete.com/gallery/2023-hawaii-ironman-world-championship-bike-anne-haugs-cervelo-p5/

87psi for her size and weight? Seems tad bit too high.

Agreed
BTW 87? Really not 85 or 90. How accurate are bike pumps and pressure gauges when taking into account air leakage when placing onto the nipple and taking it off ?
87psi even for a 25 seems very high given she's (PTO profile) 52kg. Certainly for a 28 that's 'remarkeable'.
Btw, when you take the pump head off a presta valve there is no "air leakage". You hear the air escaping from the hose. There's no need for a '5' or '0' fetish with a digital pressure gauge. Gauges' accuracy differ. Calibration is as important.
I hope Haug finds a way to store her spare tube successfully. Can't believe an athlete with her deep experience allowed the debacle in Singapore.


Awesome. Much appreciated

Thank you very much for adding that about the lack of air leakage

Is there an easy way to calibrate say a Joe Blow floor pump?
Last edited by: MrTri123: Oct 13, 23 5:38
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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jcbesse wrote:

2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?

Anne is known to be working very closely together with personalized nutrition provider NFT-sport, so I'd expect her to carry quite a bit of storage for her own nutrition. The bento box is interesting though, because afaik NFT-sports is big on liquid carbs so I would assume that is what she's carrying in the frame's aero bottle. Since the Cervelo isn't big on storage maybe the top tube bag is the most aero way for her to carry her flatkit?
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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MrTri123 wrote:
Is there an easy way to calibrate say a Joe Blow floor pump?
Annually(ish) I take my track pump to my local tyre place who (are required to) have a calibrated air hose. I use that (a tyre inflated to (say) 40psi) to check my pump (using a presta/schrader adaptor obv).
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Dembo] [ In reply to ]
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Dembo wrote:
jcbesse wrote:

2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?


Anne is known to be working very closely together with personalized nutrition provider NFT-sport, so I'd expect her to carry quite a bit of storage for her own nutrition. The bento box is interesting though, because afaik NFT-sports is big on liquid carbs so I would assume that is what she's carrying in the frame's aero bottle. Since the Cervelo isn't big on storage maybe the top tube bag is the most aero way for her to carry her flatkit?

I'm pretty sure it's hydration, you can see a straw in here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CyONL11oomQ/
I was more wondering what kind of setup this is (can one buy/build something like this easily with a camelback or is it custom-made 2D print), and whether she can refill on course or it's a one-off until empty.

https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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jcbesse wrote:
Dembo wrote:
jcbesse wrote:

2. Top frame bento: it seemed to hold custom hydration in latest races, is that a box with a camelback-style pouch inside? Refillable or not?


Anne is known to be working very closely together with personalized nutrition provider NFT-sport, so I'd expect her to carry quite a bit of storage for her own nutrition. The bento box is interesting though, because afaik NFT-sports is big on liquid carbs so I would assume that is what she's carrying in the frame's aero bottle. Since the Cervelo isn't big on storage maybe the top tube bag is the most aero way for her to carry her flatkit?


I'm pretty sure it's hydration, you can see a straw in here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CyONL11oomQ/
I was more wondering what kind of setup this is (can one buy/build something like this easily with a camelback or is it custom-made 2D print), and whether she can refill on course or it's a one-off until empty.

I wouldn't be surprised if that bento box with the straw holds a concentrated carb mix or a gel mix, considering she's also using the XLAB BTA bottle.

I'm more surprised she's using the stock aero Cervelo frame bottle and not something like the Aero Toolbox from Radsport Ibert, a company I think she's worked with in the past.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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MrTri123 wrote:
BTW 87? Really not 85 or 90. How accurate are bike pumps and pressure gauges when taking into account air leakage when placing onto the nipple and taking it off ?

Pressure in psi likely converted from bar (standard German/European pressure unit). 6 bar = 87 psi.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

I rode hours and hours on the same course changing air pressure to find the sweet spot. 60-70psi, very comfortable and smooth for sure but I felt sluggish. 90-100psi, it’s harsh, bumpy and felt sluggish. 80psi, it was perfect.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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jcbesse wrote:

I'm pretty sure it's hydration, you can see a straw in here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CyONL11oomQ/
I was more wondering what kind of setup this is (can one buy/build something like this easily with a camelback or is it custom-made 2D print), and whether she can refill on course or it's a one-off until empty.

Well spotted - wonder if she found a small bladder to hold everything or whether things are... messy .
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

Several years ago, I spent an entire afternoon testing different tire pressures on two different road surfaces. A few years later, Silca came out with their calculator, and their recommended pressures were an almost identical match for what I came up with. When I switched to wider tires, I repeated the testing. Once again, nearly identical matches to Silca's calculations...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Ajax Bay] [ In reply to ]
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Her XLAB Aero Pouch behind the saddle has a zipper that can store flat kits. It's mostly likely stored in there. I agree, it was shame to see the Singapore incident where her Aerothan TPU was wrapped under her saddle and eventually came loose and got caught in her rear wheel... New fear unlocked!

"Heart Rate, Watts, I have no idea, I race, I don't pace." Andrew Starykowicz
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Engner66] [ In reply to ]
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Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

Been out of the game for a long time, but can you show me a study where 90 psi for 50kg rider riding 28 or 25 with wide internal width is fast. It might be fast on a perfectly smooth surface, but any sort of rough surface (normal road surface) and I'm going to say no.


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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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Hard to tell for sure with the funky derailleur cowling, but I would say that chain is much too short.

My latest book: "Out of the Melting Pot, Into the Fire" is on sale on Amazon and at other online and local booksellers
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Thomas Gerlach] [ In reply to ]
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Thomas Gerlach wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

Been out of the game for a long time, but can you show me a study where 90 psi for 50kg rider riding 28 or 25 with wide internal width is fast. It might be fast on a perfectly smooth surface, but any sort of rough surface (normal road surface) and I'm going to say no.

Hard to know if those numbers are true or optimized for her weight, but swissside has done a lot of testing and often recommended more pressure than many others (maybe also because they test a lot in Germany and Switzerland with great roads conditions).
For example at Roth this year they suggested 7 bar (100psi) for a 25mm setup as best (https://www.instagram.com/reel/Ct1rL07I2Oh/)

https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [jcbesse] [ In reply to ]
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jcbesse wrote:
Thomas Gerlach wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.


Been out of the game for a long time, but can you show me a study where 90 psi for 50kg rider riding 28 or 25 with wide internal width is fast. It might be fast on a perfectly smooth surface, but any sort of rough surface (normal road surface) and I'm going to say no.


Hard to know if those numbers are true or optimized for her weight, but swissside has done a lot of testing and often recommended more pressure than many others (maybe also because they test a lot in Germany and Switzerland with great roads conditions).
For example at Roth this year they suggested 7 bar (100psi) for a 25mm setup as best (https://www.instagram.com/reel/Ct1rL07I2Oh/)

I guess they didn't get the 'hookless rules the world' memo.
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Warbird wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

Several years ago, I spent an entire afternoon testing different tire pressures on two different road surfaces. A few years later, Silca came out with their calculator, and their recommended pressures were an almost identical match for what I came up with. When I switched to wider tires, I repeated the testing. Once again, nearly identical matches to Silca's calculations...

Tested for what?

Comfort, rolling resistance, aero
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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MrTri123 wrote:
Warbird wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.


Several years ago, I spent an entire afternoon testing different tire pressures on two different road surfaces. A few years later, Silca came out with their calculator, and their recommended pressures were an almost identical match for what I came up with. When I switched to wider tires, I repeated the testing. Once again, nearly identical matches to Silca's calculations...


Tested for what?

Comfort, rolling resistance, aero

Rolling resistance. I had been running lower pressures for a few years previous, after noticing that on days where I didn't get a chance to pump up my tires to the 120psi listed on the sidewall, I consistently hit higher speeds on descents. And the ride was more comfortable as well.

So when I finally got a power meter, I spent several hours riding back and forth on a flat section of road (average quality asphalt) and an adjacent bike path (very smooth asphalt) at pressures ranging from 70 to 120 psi, to see what required the least power to maintain a typical race pace. And the numbers I got were way below 120psi, and even a bit lower than I had been running. When Silca came out with their calculator, the results were almost identical to my test numbers...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Warbird wrote:
When Silca came out with their calculator, the results were almost identical to my test numbers...

x2
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [marcag] [ In reply to ]
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I have gone with 80 lbs which it seems HED recommends

Silca shows 100

Or maybe I did the calculations wrong?

25mm GP 5000 Latex tubes 225lbs bike with rider HED disc rear wheel 60 from clinchers
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [s13tx] [ In reply to ]
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s13tx wrote:
Engner66 wrote:
I really don't understand the whole low pressure fad. Al these silca calcs and stuff indicate very low pressures for light weight riders. However, when tires are tested, it is always the high pressures that have the lower rolling resistance.

For comfort I get it, but for sped, it totally makes sense to me that she will go for ~90 psi.

I rode hours and hours on the same course changing air pressure to find the sweet spot. 60-70psi, very comfortable and smooth for sure but I felt sluggish. 90-100psi, it’s harsh, bumpy and felt sluggish. 80psi, it was perfect.

*FELT* sluggish. But was it ACTUALLY sluggish ? Get in a 1000cc original Mini with a straight cut gearbox, and fook me does it *FEEL* fast. But actually it's not - its just noisy, has a shedload of vibration, and is tiring AF. My boring family Ford rep-mobile doesn't feel fast... because it's comfortable. But put it up against that mini, it is actually a world faster - all whilst I can still listen to the radio and talk to the Mrs.

(I can well believe the 90psi shook any fillings you have out).
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Re: Anne Haug's bike [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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MrTri123 wrote:
I have gone with 80 lbs which it seems HED recommends

Silca shows 100

Or maybe I did the calculations wrong?

25mm GP 5000 Latex tubes 225lbs bike with rider HED disc rear wheel 60 from clinchers

I'm also ~225lbs total weight. Is 25mm the actual width of your tires on those rims, or are you just going off the stated size?

Silca calculator wrote:
Measured width does not equate to the number printed on the sidewall; rather, it refers to the width of the tire when it is fully installed and inflated on the rim. Even dealing with this stuff every day, it can be hard keeping it straight as we continue to call the tires by their casing numbers. That said, we have seen 23mm GP4000SII on a 21.5mm inner bead measure at 28.9mm wide, so would be 29mm in this calculator.

On my tri bike, 23mm GP4Ks measured 26mm on FLO 60 rims. I testing was 5psi increments, my results were 95psi (bike path)/90psi (road) was the fastest, Silca said 95.5psi (new pavement) and 90.5psi (worn pavement/some cracks). 25mm GP4Ks on the same wheels measured 29mm, Silca says 80.5psi/76.5psi while my testing got 80/75psi. So I feel pretty comfortable going with Silca's results...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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