there are no epic workouts, only epic seasons.

Define what it means to you?

Are you talking truly epic or an iron man "run through" (like 5-6 hour bike + 5-6 mi run one day & 12-20 mile run another; plus 1-2 hours of OW swimming)?
One example: The obvious weekend for Iron Man CDA (June 26 this year) is Memorial day weekend, so four full weeks before. Traditionally, this is the big 3-day weekend to do the last big workouts, then taper. (which may or may not include racing a half IM 2-3 weeks before, depending ...)

I am talking about 15-20 hours of cycling in 4 days; Fri to Mon. Running would be minimal; probably a 5 mile run before 2 rides. Swim the other 2 days; before or after cycling. (Also when I say 15-20 hours i have a PM so can tailor those hours.)

Have you done something like this? So a 4 week minimum??

Thanks for responding.

BB

I think a lot of plans have you do a long ride followed by a one hour or so run Saturday with a long run on Sunday. I also do a one hour ows before my long run on Sunday. I did this 5 weeks before my IM last year, and I think that's what my coach has me doing this year too. Matt Fitzgerald recently blogged on Training Peaks about doing a metric ironman 5 weeks before. http://home.trainingpeaks.com/...ronman-marathon.aspx

If its just cycling (not epic running), maybe 4 weeks would work well. My biggest cycling week (16-18 hours) was 2 full weeks before a half (which went well, not awesome).
FWIW: I'm a 1-time IM finisher (sub11) and done just 7 halfs, so hardly an expert. I also crack the 200 barrier only 3 or 4 weeks a summer & not a strong cyclist.

I'm planning a July 4th week (8 days I think) worth of rides on the Imoo course and surrounding roads....so what 8 weeks out? I plan on 50-100 miles a day on the bike....maybe a little running but not much. I want to absorb the training/recover and then get back into the final prep for Imoo

What would the point of this type of training be?

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Ride Scoozy Electric Bicycles
http://www.RideScoozy.com

To put the body under stress and then have it adapt with the goal of getting fitter/stronger/faster etc. That is the goal of most of my training.

Thanks for responding!

BB

Ok cool. I am doing IMMOO this year as well.

You are lucky you get to ride the course!

Good luck at the race!

BB

I think that's the real question here. How long does it take for a single training session to affect the body in a positive way? I assume the answer would depend on the duration and severity of the workout. This question was asked on another site I frequent, and I believe the answer was about 8 days for any normal workout -- although that was just for running.

Ok thanks for the information. These wouldn't be abnormal workouts in that they would be any longer or more intense than anything I have done. The abnormal thing would be that I would be doing them back to back. So maybe 3 weeks wouldn't be too close?

As I have also said I have a PM and can monitor the work and if notice anything out of the ordinary then I could just dial it back or cut the workout short.

In any case, thanks for your reply!

BB

If throwing in an intense 4 day session 1week/10 days/whatever before a race was beneficial, then you would see it in training plans. But you don't...

Some coaches have said if you have an extra long weekend, make your long ride a little longer and focus on recovery so your subsequent workouts will be even better. Also get everything done that you can so the week leading into the race can be focused on recovery/preparation and not medial tasks that will inhibit your recovery/prep.

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Ride Scoozy Electric Bicycles
http://www.RideScoozy.com

I think I have seen it in some plans.

I am talking about at a minimum 21 days before the race so i think that fits your 'whatever'. so you see no benefit ever of doing this kind or weekend?

BB

Actually you do. Just not in any of the canned plans you get online.

Right and that is what I am trying to determine. What is the optimal time to do this? By optimal I mean from my time point of view, as in when I can get this work done and also from a get fitter/faster/stronger point of view.

So if there is a window of time say between 4-8 weeks out from the race where it could be done and provide benefits and week 6 makes the most sense for me, that is when I would do it.

I know my schedule, so I'm just trying to determine the other window...

Thanks for your reply!

BB

Definitely in July. This July has 5 Fridays, 5 Saturdays and 5 Sundays. This happens once every 823 years. In other words, you'll never have this kind of opportunity to execute epic workouts again in your life.

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**All of these words finding themselves together were greatly astonished and delighted for assuredly, they had never met before**

How well do you recover since that's what it is all about. You can hammer yourself into the ground all you want but if it takes you a long time to recover from it, you may not get the desired results. Take a look at what Gordo has written here:
http://www.coachgordo.com/...g_week_training.html

I am 5.5 weeks out from IMFrance. My last two weeks have been 20 and 22 hours. This week will be close to 18-20 hours. Next week will be 20 hours and then I will take an easy week before Mooseman. Mooseman is three weeks out, so after Mooseman I will start my three week taper. My last long ride will be next weekend and last long run will be mid-week next week (4.5 weeks out). With this schedule, I am confident I will be rested for my IM. I have done the same taper for the past 6 Ironmans and it seems to work for me (relatively speaking). If it were me I would not be worried about a big bike week as long as the week ended three weeks out, last big running week should be 4-5 weeks out. Good luck.

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Barry Dmitruk
2017: Florida 70.3 (done); Mont Tremblant 70.3 & Ironman

Thanks for that article. Yeah I really don't think it is a magic bullet, but rather I just wanted to try it and not do any "real damage" before my race.

BB

Thanks for your info!

Good luck at your races as well, although it seems like you don't need any luck! :)

BB

3 weekends. 6, 4, and 2 weeks out.

my epic weekend is a huge ride saturday and a half IM Sunday.

Edit to add: Long run Thursday or Friday. Drill swim and bike on half IM. Run pace for half IM race is executed conservatively, at IM pace. Purpose of half IM is not to win, PB, or crush half IM, especially on the run.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

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I did one 6 weeks ago. My "A" race is coming up in 2 weeks, Kona 70.3. Here is what I did:

WORKOUTS
Mon (pm) - 2000 yard easy pool swim.
Tue (am) - 30 minute easy run
Tue (am) - 3:53 bike 2x (2x10'@ Olympic Pace + 2' cruise) 2500+ ft elevation gained
Tue (pm) - 1500 yard easy pool swim
Wed (am) - 45 minute run (easy first half and progressive build on the way back)
Wed (am) - 1:07 bike 1600+ feet gained. This was supposed to an easy spin.
Wed (pm) - 3700 yard swim with main set of 15x100 on 1:20
Thu (am) - 4:37 bike with 4600+ feet elevation gained.
Thu (am) - 15 minute off the bike run.
Thu (pm) - 1000 yard swim
Fri (am) - 2400 meter swim
Sat (am) - 6:07 bike with 5000+ feet elevation gained. I paced this day well. My power numbers increased as the ride progressed.
Sun (am) - 1:20 cruise run
Sun (am) - 2400 meter swim


TOTALS
SWIM - 8200 yards & 4800 meters
BIKE - 15:41 (287 miles with 13,800+ feet elevation gained)

As for the cycling, I tried to keep the watts at Ironman to half-ironman. This was the most I ever cycled in a week, so I was somewhat conservative to make sure I got through the week. After the week was over, I had 4 days of easy workouts.
RUN - 2:50 (22 miles with 650+ feet elevation gained)

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Bruce
ALBOPADS XTERRAWETSUITS NEWTON OAKLEY FIZIK GARMIN ROTOR COMPUTRAINER QUARQ HONEYSTINGER

I am surprised how many people taper 3+ wks.. Makes sense if you race a half 3 wks out but most people dont train close to 30 hrs a week which would merit such a long taper.

You do see these in training plans and this is why they do training camps ALL over.. But in pre built training plans would make no sense to add them in..since they would more need to be specific to the athlete, too much or too hard can be big trouble.

Chuckie make some solid points on said topic:

http://chuckiev.blogspot.com/...g-is-art-part-5.html


I would say 5-6 wks out is a great time to do a big weekend, then a few active recovery days and back into it, so you can absorb it and have a few more weeks of solid training than a taper. Be careful with intensity with a BIG increase as such. I was already beat tot he Gordo post but it has some valid points.