Those hit the hardest were the idiots who invested 100% of their retirement assets into their company's stock.

My grandmother (in-law) was one of those idiots that invested a lot of retirement money into the stock market ... not 100%, but a significant chunk (she sold lots and lots of farmland once her husband died, and "invested about half" the money, banked the rest). Luckily she had quite a bit "banked", but she still quite a big hit.

So, while people "should have known" or "should have seen" (certainly not the investors that let companies handle their investments) than everything was not right with Enron, that hardly replaces or diminshes the magnitude of deciet they enacted over a lot of people that did not deserve to have their money "taken" from them, and IMO, that's essentially what Enron (including Lay) did.

I can't say I have hatred for the guy, but I say he's a lowlife douchebag ... the same way I say Barry Bonds is a lowlife cheat ... although in truth what Lay and friends did was much more severe namely due to the amount of lives it impacted.

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My grandmother (in-law) was one of those idiots that invested a lot of retirement money into the stock market

That's different. The stock market encompasses all public companies. Enron was just one of those. The Enron debacle was a drag on the market as a whole, but the stock market did not become worthless only Enron did.

If I were to invest 100% of my retirement assets in the stock of one singular company that is stupid. If I were to invest 100% of my retirement assets in the broad stock market that's just isn't proper diversification, but it is NOT stupid. I probably have 90% of my retirement assets invested in equities (stock) in both domestic and foreign markets.

certainly not the investors that let companies handle their investments

As I said, the analysts failed miserably. They focus more on creating business for their firms then for doing the job they were supposed to do. I wasn't saying Joe Schmoe on the street should've known what was going on. I am saying that someone should have and the people most likely to know are the analysts.

although in truth what Lay and friends did was much more severe namely due to the amount of lives it impacted.


That's definately true. In the grand scheme of things Bonds' steroid use is nothing.

I still dont know what he did wrong. People are jelous of power - period. My dad used to fire folks 20,000 at a time...life is a bitch eh? How come when a small company goes under the owner isnt arrested? Trust me when I say that a small business owner will close the doors long before they have a loss of their own personal wealth...if they are smart.


I would love to see Bill Gates cash out off of his stock in Microsoft, fire the board, announce he made enough and close the company outright. Then, he could move to Europe and chill for decades to come...oh, but he wont - Bill Gates made a shit ton of millionares so he is a good guy.

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

A perfect example of why America is perceived as being all market, no morals.

I still dont know what he did wrong.

How can you not know of the wrong doings? They faked profit sheets to create the illusion that there company was both making money and growing, in order to drive the company's value up, which upon being invested in, drove their profits/income up. Then, when it was revealed that the company was lying for profit, clients left, investors split, and many people lost their job ... meanwhile, the "heads" of Enron, still made of like bandits.

Lay, was the head ... it's very doubtful that all this took place without his knowledge.

People are jelous of power - period.

Do you really believe that's the case with Enron? It's just jealousy?

How come when a small company goes under the owner isnt arrested?

If he fakes the books, and steals the investors/company's money, as he is closing down ... he will be arrested.

Enron isn't a case of a "failed business" closing its doors.

Bill Gates made a shit ton of millionares so he is a good guy.

Two completely different scenarios.

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Ken didnt make the books...period. I think that one could easily compare him to Saddam, that is not a strech either. The US is running around saying WMD blah blah...Saddam is claiming he has WMD and all these other horrors...we beleived him. Turns out he may not have had them but thought he did cause his Generals were telling them that he did...he took the best information he had (but was false) - and it was what he wanted to hear. The then makes threats to the world about his power, that he honestly thought he had as his Generals claimed he had (but knew he didnt)...and alas the CIA beleives what he said as Saddam wont let the UN inspect sites that he thinks has banned weapons in them (but dont)...bombs away...



Now, Ken is Saddam, his board is the Generals and the stock holders are the US...bombs away...we all heard what we wanted to hear, till we heard it was untrue.

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

Ken didnt make the books

I don't think he has ever been accussed of "making the books".

I think if our government was engaged in deliberate, corrupt activity, that continued to lead to the President's income growing and growing, while never noticing the obvious (going by what's said in this thread) inconsistencies in the books, would lead to widespread suspicion that the "President was in on it".

It shouldn't be too difficult to figure out, "What was Ken lay arrested for?"

I find it incredibly unlikely (i.e., as close to 'impossible' as one could get without actually being impossible) that the person (Lay) that got the most out of the situation, had no knowledge or involvement in the deal.

CNNMoney.com has some articles I'll be going over later in their "Enron on Trial" section. 'The Guiltiest Guys in the Room' is one of those articles.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
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The jury believed that Lay knew exactly what was going on. He would have been a fool not to know, and the jury decided that Lay was not a fool. The CEO is ultimately responsible for the financial statements of the company.

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Those hit the hardest were the idiots who invested 100% of their retirement assets into their company's stock.


The employees had no choice at one point but to invest in Enron stock (401k's) and near the end as he stock spiraled out of control, the funds were frozen by the company and they could not move it. "The Smartest Guys in the Room" was a great documentary that explains what they did and how they did it.