Shorter Runs or More Rest Days?: Triathlon Forum: Slowtwitch Forums

Shorter Runs or More Rest Days?

Sep 22, 23 11:25

Would you run more often, but shorter distance?
OR
Run longer distance, but take more rest days?

I have a fixed monthly volume goal(streak goal -- same minimums January cold/now vs. October beautiful). If I do my average run I can accomplish that in 20 days taking 10-ish days of rest OR I can do a shorter run and run every day of the month OR somewhere in between.

Does it change your thoughts if you feel guilty on days with no run?

Other sports/activities will happen(or not) regardless of the off days and are insignificant to this question.

Background: Experienced(50+ marys/ultras) but not very fast and 50-ish yo. Not injury prone, although had a foot stress fracture 5 years in the past. No speed goals and I just plan 1-3 marys/50ks per year until I die. No planned tris. Swim 1-2x week, Bike infrequently now, Yoga 1x week, Pickleball 2x week. No weight training.
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Summary of General Consensus Responses

Run more often, but of shorter distance
More than 1 rest day a week isn't needed for non-injury prone runners
Follow BarryP's running plan

Swim - Bike - Run the rest is just clothing changes.

Last edited by: linhardt: Sep 24, 23 11:01

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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theyellowcarguy

Sep 22, 23 11:37

Post #2 of 14 (1585 views)

According to studies and advice I've received, it's better to run more often for shorter distances for both injury prevention and performance gains. You still have to have some distance though, 1/2 mile every day won't get you very far. There's a reason the BarryP plan is popular and recommended.

My Strava | My Instagram | Summerville, SC | 35-39 AG | 4:41 (70.3), 10:05 (140.6) | 3x70.3, 1x140.6 | Cat 2 Cyclist

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [ In reply to ]

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Lurker4

Sep 22, 23 11:57

Post #3 of 14 (1561 views)

I've come across studies that show training 2x a day with a rest day vs every day is preferrable.

So this is kind of both of your scenarios if you think about it. Shorter, twice a day, and skip a day.

I've also seen that spacing two shorter runs 6-8hrs a part increases bone strength, and reduces injury potential.
The longer sessions will build endurance. But it's not like you need to do those all the time.

So you can play with some of that.

I don't think you need to do one or the other but all of the above. Rest days, long days, 2x a day shorter sessions, etc. They'll all improve different dimensions of your athletic performance, as your overall performance is the sum of your bone strength, muscle gylcogen stores, heart/lung capability, etc. etc. So the variable workouts across the weeks would target improvement in each of these dimensions.

Last edited by: Lurker4: Sep 22, 23 11:58

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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twcronin

Sep 22, 23 12:09

Post #4 of 14 (1545 views)

Probably mostly shorter runs are better -- possibly including doubles (2 a day runs) as mentioned by another commenter. This will be less injury risk and will improve your running more.

The barryp plan is also a really good way to get a variety of distances that is pretty injury-safe. Divide your weekly running goal (say in minutes) by 10, and call this X. Then run 3 days of the week at X minutes, 2 days of the week at 2X minutes, and 1 day of the week at 3X minutes. E.g., if your goal was to run 4 hours a week (=240 minutes), you'd run 3 runs of 24 minutes, 2 runs of 48 minutes, and 1 long run of 72 minutes. (and you'd take a day off, too)

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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samtridad

Sep 22, 23 12:13

Post #5 of 14 (1538 views)

linhardt wrote:

Would you run more often, but shorter distance?
OR
Run longer distance, but take more rest days?

I've tried both approaches and running longer but less frequently works best for me in that I get fewer injuries and can put together more run volume over the course of a month. I only run three or four days a week max. I never run 3 days in a row. For me, there is no such thing as a "recovery" run or an "easy" run. All running affects my ankles/knees and actually I have found I'm often less sore after a faster run (like a race) than I am after a supposedly "easier" run. The flip side is if I go too long without running (3 days) then that first run back feels really shitty.

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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Tom_hampton

Sep 22, 23 12:18

Post #6 of 14 (1528 views)

The BarryP plan: https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/?post=1612485

10 days of rest a month, seems like a lot. I generally follow the principles of the BarryP plan, which is: run-often and easy -> run more.

I like two-a-days, particularly where the first workout is harder/longer, and the second is short-and-easy. Eg, I might do 10 miles with 6x1mi repeats at lunch. And follow that with a 4mile easy run after dinner. The following day, again would be 6-ish very easy. I generally run 6-days (per BarryP), and might get in 1-2 doubles for 8-ish separate runs per week. So, I'm definitely a vote for frequency first.

Following this sort of approach I run distances between 4 and 20 miles, every week, with varying intensity (mostly easy). I think variety is good, both in distance/time, and intensities (though limited to 1-2 runs nd about 10% of weekly volume).

Last edited by: Tom_hampton: Sep 22, 23 12:27

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]

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linhardt

Sep 22, 23 12:29

Post #7 of 14 (1508 views)

Tom_hampton wrote:

10 days of rest a month, seems like a lot separate runs per week.

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I would have to go to confession from all the guilt from taking so many rest days. I just used it as the extreme example of what I could do and still hit my goal.

I am not injury prone, although frequency at an extreme is an issue for me as I only made it 72 days straight before injury in the 100 runs in 100 days challenge.

Swim - Bike - Run the rest is just clothing changes.

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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lightheir

Sep 22, 23 14:08

Post #8 of 14 (1425 views)

Shorter runs more frequently for sure. The more injury-prone you are, the shorter and more frequent your training runs should be

Of note, you still have to do SOMElong runs appropriate for your distance race, preferably on a regular basis.

But for the injury-prone, lots of shorter runs is the way to get better as well as build toward safely doing these long runs.

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [lightheir] [ In reply to ]

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linhardt

Sep 22, 23 15:03

Post #9 of 14 (1385 views)

lightheir wrote:

you still have to do SOMElong runs appropriate for your distance race

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I dislike long runs and rarely run anything over 10 miles yet I run multiple(3-5) marys/50ks per year using races as the long runs for the next race.

Swim - Bike - Run the rest is just clothing changes.

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [linhardt] [ In reply to ]

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desert dude

Sep 22, 23 15:25

Post #10 of 14 (1365 views)

linhardt wrote:

Would you run more often, but shorter distance?
OR
Run longer distance, but take more rest days?

yes

linhardt wrote:

I have a fixed monthly volume goal.

Why? Just go through the process. You may find out your goal is undershooting it

linhardt wrote:

Does it change your thoughts if you feel guilty on days with no run?

No.

Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [lightheir] [ In reply to ]

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devashish_paul

Sep 22, 23 17:48

Post #11 of 14 (1308 views)

I just did a season where I only did no "real runs". All my runs during the week were running 2.5km to pool and running 2.5-5km back. I was doing that Mon-Fri. This gave me 30-35km running during weekdays. On weekends, I would do one day 10-15 km on alterante weekend and the other alternate weekend I raced Olympic tri or half IM (I ended up doing 3 half IM's, and 2 Olympics over the season). Literally I did 5 "real runs" in training. Weekend I would do "real rides" both days and swim both days. My racing to T2 was pretty excellent for my age group, my running relatively sucked, but I went from barely being able to walk at the start of season (aggravated an old disc injury), to top 5 in my age group in all the races (one Mdot race, three local) and waaay back at 70.3 Worlds (166th), but at the first week of June I was thinking about retiring from tri and selling all my stuff, so just sharing the lots of "short commute run" semi success path.

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ohanapecosh

Sep 23, 23 13:26

Post #12 of 14 (1070 views)

Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [ohanapecosh] [ In reply to ]

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ohanapecosh

Sep 24, 23 18:17

Post #13 of 14 (883 views)

I want to challenge the consensus here a little here.

Without knowing your mileage, it's hard to respond. But if your goal is to achieve maximum performance I'd say:

For 10Ks, if your training is 25-35 mpw, run 4 days per week. If it's 35+ mpw, then 5 days.
For half marathons, if your training is 25-40 mpw, run 4 days per week, If it's 40+ mpw, then 5 days.
For marathons, if your training is 30-55 mpw, then run 4 days per week in your lowest mileage and recovery weeks, and five days in your higher mileage and peak weeks. For consistent 50+ mpw, then run 5 days per week.

Not sure who Barry P is, but my running philosophy is to ask, WWPD? where P is Pfitzinger. And his plans in his two books more or less recommend the above for someone who's trying to get faster.

If you're running for happiness and health, then I'd do whatever brings you joy and is more convenient.

Last edited by: ohanapecosh: Sep 24, 23 22:25

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Re: Shorter Runs or More Rest Days? [ohanapecosh] [ In reply to ]

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RandMart

Sep 24, 23 19:07

Post #14 of 14 (851 views)

ohanapecosh wrote:

Not sure who BarryP is ...

Fucking newbies LOL

You probably don't know what pink text is, either?

Quote:

As mentioned above, the BarryP plan. Basically run 6 times per week. 3 short runs, 2 medium runs, 1 long run. Medium runs = 2x the distance of the short run. Long run = 3x the distance of the short run. Most runs should be at an easy/relaxed pace. Limit increases in mileage to 10% a week.

Parts 1
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...um.cgi?post=2545826;

Part 2
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...um.cgi?post=2548469;

Part 3
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...um.cgi?post=2554998;

All joking aside, welcome!!!

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

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