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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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"Putting a gun to the democrats head" in Arizona.

She seems comfortable with this decision . At heart she is an independent doing what best serves Arizona. Best case for her is the gun trick works, she performs well in the next 2 years in support of centrist Biden efforts and the democrats then don't primary her. Less best case she performs well runs in a 3 man field and the race is a dead even 3 way split.

Joe Lieberman made it work. I still think this move was inevitable, but just made 6 years too soon.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
What was her strategy before? Same?//

Yes of course, it is to win. And she threaded the needle just perfectly in an unlikely scenario and culture, to get that win. Just think now after she has bucked the party, and her spanking afterwards, has show her that the route to the next victory may have to look a lot different. So presuming an independent candidate cannot actually with AZ with the polarization of both parties in full force(as oldandslow pointed out in his post)she must either be banking on no dem running, or somehow being the pub candidate. I agree that is probably not her desire, so probably banking that the dems will not shot themselves in the foot, again. So far from all the folks I have seen in the party sense, they have been playing this down and now trying not to piss her off anymore. Maybe they have learned their lesson after all, time will tell...


What exactly is the lesson that Dems learned?

I’m hearing from you and Dan that Dems’ dissatisfaction with Sinema was wrong. I don’t quite view it in the same way— to me it seems like Dems expressed honest feelings of frustration at Sinema’s behavior that they hadn’t anticipated.

If Dems have learned a lesson here it’s that they either need to choose their candidates more carefully or improve communication so that the candidate and party (both the organization and voters) know what to expect.

Having spent a tiny bit of time working on a campaign in my area this summer and fall, I have the opinion that votes are precious and must be treated with respect. My candidate drove me bananas by her attitude about endorsements and votes. She didn’t show them the proper respect— either through cluelessness or her communication style or a combo— I don’t know.

A candidate who asks for votes is entering into an agreement of sorts with voters. “Give me you vote, and I will do X.” It is an insult to voters to expect votes without listening and understanding voters’ concerns. People care about their votes— votes are precious currency. So candidates campaign by listening as much as speaking because once a candidate is in office, the candidate represents the people. It is an on-going negotiation— and without communication and an understanding about how the candidate with act, then there is a serious feeling of disrespect toward voters.
Last edited by: Barks&Purrs: Dec 10, 22 7:51
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [gofigure] [ In reply to ]
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gofigure wrote:
"Putting a gun to the democrats head" in Arizona.

She seems comfortable with this decision . At heart she is an independent doing what best serves Arizona. Best case for her is the gun trick works, she performs well in the next 2 years in support of centrist Biden efforts and the democrats then don't primary her. Less best case she performs well runs in a 3 man field and the race is a dead even 3 way split.

Joe Lieberman made it work. I still think this move was inevitable, but just made 6 years too soon.

Is it really what best serves Arizona? Because the people of Arizona, according to the polls I showed, really disagree with that.


You know who thought Joe Lieberman was "pathetic" for holding up the Democratic agenda to appease people that wouldn't vote for him? Someone that called Krysten Sinema.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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chaparral wrote:
gofigure wrote:
"Putting a gun to the democrats head" in Arizona.

She seems comfortable with this decision . At heart she is an independent doing what best serves Arizona. Best case for her is the gun trick works, she performs well in the next 2 years in support of centrist Biden efforts and the democrats then don't primary her. Less best case she performs well runs in a 3 man field and the race is a dead even 3 way split.

Joe Lieberman made it work. I still think this move was inevitable, but just made 6 years too soon.

Is it really what best serves Arizona? Because the people of Arizona, according to the polls I showed, really disagree with that.


You know who thought Joe Lieberman was "pathetic" for holding up the Democratic agenda to appease people that wouldn't vote for him? Someone that called Krysten Sinema.

I would argue the tried and true "Can anybody trust the polls anymore?" One would think she doesn't trust your poll. Maybe she thinks her independent status will bring enhanced coverage and leveraged power that she can use to her advantage come 2 years. As sincere as politicians can be, I agree with others that she is just being true to herself and is willing to roll the dice.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [gofigure] [ In reply to ]
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gofigure wrote:

I would argue the tried and true "Can anybody trust the polls anymore?"

Polling seems to be pretty darn good - case in point Warnock v. Walker, just recently. Just because they blew the 2016 election doesn't mean we have to ignore them forever.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
gofigure wrote:

I would argue the tried and true "Can anybody trust the polls anymore?"

Polling seems to be pretty darn good - case in point Warnock v. Walker, just recently. Just because they blew the 2016 election doesn't mean we have to ignore them forever.

Well then she just committed political suicide. I looked up the CIVIQs folks https://civiqs.com/faq

I guess the science of this business has never sat well with me and I have always had a bias to distrust. Knocking on a door and talking to a stranger to get his thoughts gives me more comfort than having people answer online surveys.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [gofigure] [ In reply to ]
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gofigure wrote:

Well then she just committed political suicide.

Or she's playing 6D chess. Maybe shooting for VP. Or even P!
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Here’s an article about Sinema’s apparent use of FB marketplace.

I noticed some language in the article that supports my idea that Sinema’s communication style is a problem.

The article used words like “alienated,” “enigma,” “random,” “rarely speaks to the press,” “never attended Democratic Caucus meetings,” “mercurial,” and “convoluted.”

It will be interesting to see if Sinema’s communication style is more comprehensible or better received going forward.

https://slate.com/...ketplace-senate.html
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [Barks&Purrs] [ In reply to ]
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So on point. Though this hat is endearing to me. When I picked my mom up from the hospital after getting massive brain surgery, where they pretty much sawed off the top half of her skull and then re-attached it, I realized we had nothing to hide the then horrific-looking Frankenstein look. So we ran to the nearest store, and the only hat in stock was a Do Epic Shit trucker cap. Which ended up being fitting when she was finally able to resume her lifelong love of hiking and walk by herself on a trail. Though we've since retired the DES hat.

I also like Sinema's pink Wahoo Bolt. Straight fire - too bad it's gone.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [Barks&Purrs] [ In reply to ]
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Barks&Purrs wrote:
Here’s an article about Sinema’s apparent use of FB marketplace.

I noticed some language in the article that supports my idea that Sinema’s communication style is a problem.

The article used words like “alienated,” “enigma,” “random,” “rarely speaks to the press,” “never attended Democratic Caucus meetings,” “mercurial,” and “convoluted.”

It will be interesting to see if Sinema’s communication style is more comprehensible or better received going forward.

https://slate.com/...ketplace-senate.html


Wow, that is a fascinating article. She is a total kook.

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Last edited by: DarkSpeedWorks: Dec 15, 22 9:24
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Post deleted by spudone [ In reply to ]
Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [Barks&Purrs] [ In reply to ]
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Barks&Purrs wrote:
Here’s an article about Sinema’s apparent use of FB marketplace.

I noticed some language in the article that supports my idea that Sinema’s communication style is a problem.

The article used words like “alienated,” “enigma,” “random,” “rarely speaks to the press,” “never attended Democratic Caucus meetings,” “mercurial,” and “convoluted.”

It will be interesting to see if Sinema’s communication style is more comprehensible or better received going forward.

https://slate.com/...ketplace-senate.html


I'm in Phoenix and have seen many of her cycling and triathlon for sale posts on Stevebay (FB page mentioned in article) for several years. I don't think it makes her kooky or that there's anything wrong with her doing that, notwithstanding her current day job.

I've often thought that I might run in to her some day on one of the popular road cycling routes. If so, I'd love to have a polite conversation with her. Perhaps I could help her see the error of her ways. Though I doubt it, of course.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [spudone] [ In reply to ]
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I like that story about your mom and the hat.

We lived in Rochester, MN for 3 years, which is home to Mayo Clinic, as you know. During our first week in town, we did school supply shopping at Walmart and saw a kid who looked like they had the top half of their skull removed: bald and stitches or staples circumnavigating the head. The kid wasn’t wearing a hat or anything. I had never seen that before. I loved living in Rochester because of the medical diversity/ community and other reasons — I think it’s my favorite place that we’ve lived.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [spudone] [ In reply to ]
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spudone wrote:
I realize a congressperson is supposed to support constituents. But work is the last thing I'd want to talk about when I'm out on a long bike ride. Regardless of what I might think about her work performance.


You're right. Maybe she doesn't ride much, or much alone, because of that.
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Post deleted by spudone [ In reply to ]
Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [spudone] [ In reply to ]
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So many Congresscritters seem to spend most of their time in DC. To some extent, that is necessary, but I wonder if that allows more detachment from the people in their district that they're supposed to represent.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [spudone] [ In reply to ]
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Only skimmed most of the comments. I am actually amazed at how naive Dan appears to be.

I know I am cynical but Sweet Lord.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [BLeP] [ In reply to ]
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BLeP wrote:
Only skimmed most of the comments. I am actually amazed at how naive Dan appears to be.

I know I am cynical but Sweet Lord.

He stuck with Lance until the very end. I admire the loyalty and optimism.
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
i'm surprised by the lack of any honest thought in the responses to your post. perhaps i place too much faith in my LR amigos.


OK, I'm reversing myself on Sinema. I'm all-in with her.

After her staff guidance was (allegedly leaked), per DB,

These instructions are all awesome. Triathlon and health first. Politics second.

Do the alleged instructions smack of entitlement and elitism? Hell yes, they do! But it's a good example to set nonetheless. We should strive for all people and all types of employment to be able to value personal time and healthy recreation as much as Sinema is (allegedly) able to. We should all get lots of sleep. We should all eat well, per the recent article on the Slowtwitch front page.

Some tidbits according to the Daily Beast:


Quote:
Kyrsten works hard, but is protective of her personal time,” reads the very first paragraph of the document, which explains that Sinema has “time-consuming commitments outside of this job.” Those commitments seem to be a reference to her extensive schedule of training and competing in marathons and Ironman events—which are referenced numerous times in the memo




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The document also makes clear that much of Sinema’s time outside of “regular hours” consists of exercising and training for athletic competition. “She wakes up very early to work out, and sleep is very important to her,” it says. The memo also specifies that on weekends, she “needs a later start to accommodate her training schedule,” which entails scheduling no work obligations earlier than 1 p.m.



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Due to her very high level of activity,” reads the memo, “she is always hungry and needs to consume a lot of protein each day.” The memo states that Sinema takes three meal/snack breaks and cautions staffers against scheduling anything after 6:30 p.m. without first “ensuring she has dinner.”



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Sinema’s workout and exercise regime are portrayed as a central focus of staffers scheduling duties. Staffers are instructed to consult with Sinema and schedule recovery time after races, book weekly massages even if they overlap with the legislative workday, and verify that the dimensions of hotel pools accommodate her desired size




Last edited by: trail: Dec 22, 22 14:27
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Re: If everybody is upset with you probably doing something right (Sinema) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
Slowman wrote:
i'm surprised by the lack of any honest thought in the responses to your post. perhaps i place too much faith in my LR amigos.


OK, I'm reversing myself on Sinema. I'm all-in with her.

After her staff guidance was (allegedly leaked), per DB,

These instructions are all awesome. Triathlon and health first. Politics second.

Do the alleged instructions smack of entitlement and elitism? Hell yes, they do! But it's a good example to set nonetheless. We should strive for all people and all types of employment to be able to value personal time and healthy recreation as much as Sinema is (allegedly) able to. We should all get lots of sleep. We should all eat well, per the recent article on the Slowtwitch front page.

Some tidbits according to the Daily Beast:

Quote:
Kyrsten works hard, but is protective of her personal time,” reads the very first paragraph of the document, which explains that Sinema has “time-consuming commitments outside of this job.” Those commitments seem to be a reference to her extensive schedule of training and competing in marathons and Ironman events—which are referenced numerous times in the memo

Quote:
The document also makes clear that much of Sinema’s time outside of “regular hours” consists of exercising and training for athletic competition. “She wakes up very early to work out, and sleep is very important to her,” it says. The memo also specifies that on weekends, she “needs a later start to accommodate her training schedule,” which entails scheduling no work obligations earlier than 1 p.m.

Quote:
Due to her very high level of activity,” reads the memo, “she is always hungry and needs to consume a lot of protein each day.” The memo states that Sinema takes three meal/snack breaks and cautions staffers against scheduling anything after 6:30 p.m. without first “ensuring she has dinner.”

Quote:

Sinema’s workout and exercise regime are portrayed as a central focus of staffers scheduling duties. Staffers are instructed to consult with Sinema and schedule recovery time after races, book weekly massages even if they overlap with the legislative workday, and verify that the dimensions of hotel pools accommodate her desired size

i like this:

But her desire for to-the-minute efficiency for work obligations—compared to the time she set aside for other pursuits—leaves some questions about her priorities.

anytime anyone is criticized by couch jockeys of questionable priorities, that's a sign that priorities are calibrated perfectly.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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