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Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos?
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Hi,

Here is a video of Challenge Davos - barely speaking German - but it seems the commentator is saying Joe Skipper had a panic attack 50m after the start of the swim? Can anyone help translate?
https://www.youtube.com/...28&feature=share
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [lorin26] [ In reply to ]
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lorin26 wrote:
Hi,

Here is a video of Challenge Davos - barely speaking German - but it seems the commentator is saying Joe Skipper had a panic attack 50m after the start of the swim? Can anyone help translate?
https://www.youtube.com/...28&feature=share

Yeah, I wasn't sure if that was Joe Skipper, I thought it looked like him. It was in German so couldn't make heads or tails of what was being said. Does anyone know what happened?
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [lorin26] [ In reply to ]
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He posted a video on Instagram. He had to be pulled out on the swim.

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
http://www.blueseventy.com
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [timr] [ In reply to ]
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Link? Looked at his insta, twit, FB, and utube. Didnt see anything.
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [adambeston] [ In reply to ]
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It was on his instagram stories, which are only available for 24h. He said he had a panic attack, the water was rather chilly. Happens to the best of us
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [lorin26] [ In reply to ]
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Thought it was him and the way he looked its a good thing he stopped...he looked freaked out. Better that then he tries to push on and something really bad happens.

"see the world as it is not as you want it to be"
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [CementBottle] [ In reply to ]
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CementBottle wrote:
lorin26 wrote:
Hi,

Here is a video of Challenge Davos - barely speaking German - but it seems the commentator is saying Joe Skipper had a panic attack 50m after the start of the swim? Can anyone help translate?
https://www.youtube.com/...28&feature=share


Yeah, I wasn't sure if that was Joe Skipper, I thought it looked like him. It was in German so couldn't make heads or tails of what was being said. Does anyone know what happened?

Not much more information in the German commentary, really. They said Joe had just arrived by train the day prior, which may or may not have been a contributing factor at this altitude, and had sort of a panic attack/difficulty breathing in the cold water right from the beginning so he called it a day. As did everybody else a couple of minutes later, unfortunately.
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Anni23] [ In reply to ]
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Anni23 wrote:
It was on his instagram stories, which are only available for 24h. He said he had a panic attack, the water was rather chilly. Happens to the best of us

It certainly does. i swam in the ocean a hundred times before it happened to me. Knowing what it is allows you to overcome it in my view.

But the first time you are like “wtf is happening”
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Animalmom2] [ In reply to ]
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Animalmom2 wrote:
Anni23 wrote:
It was on his instagram stories, which are only available for 24h. He said he had a panic attack, the water was rather chilly. Happens to the best of us


It certainly does. i swam in the ocean a hundred times before it happened to me. Knowing what it is allows you to overcome it in my view.

But the first time you are like “wtf is happening”

Is it an actual panic attack, or a reaction to the cold water?
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [adambeston] [ In reply to ]
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I'm sure he will post a YouTube video. He was in good spirits and laughing about it. He called himself a bunch of names and said he had to grab a kayak. Challenge had a picture of him walking out of the water holding his chest but I can't find it anymore.

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
http://www.blueseventy.com
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [dunno] [ In reply to ]
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I think it’s impossible to say for sure but I saw a cardiologist, sports psychologist and a doctor that specializes working with endurance athletes

The view espoused by the latter is that the combination of cold water, wetsuit constriction, and excitement can trigger gasping which freaks you out.

I couldn’t put my face in the water for more than a few minutes. It took me an hour to do a swim that takes me 35 mins. I had to hang on paddle boards

I live in Hong Kong and I had been swimming in the pool the week before the colder swim (bussleton). I didn’t do a practice swim the day before the race and it was cold that morning

I was pumped to do the race and went out hot then 300m in i felt funny and started gasping

I later looked at my records and HR was like 175

All three doctors referred to it as a panic attack
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Animalmom2] [ In reply to ]
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I had a very similar start at Challenge Maine 2015. It was a long run into the water, and then through the breakers. After about two minutes I was in rough shape -- couldn't breathe, freaking out, whole nine yards. It was my first "real" open water swim after I'd broken my back the year prior, too, so I had all the nerves about getting hit where my spinal fractures were. And IIRC, water temp was low 60s -- so definitely a bit of a shock to the system.

I managed to get myself calmed down by just focusing on my breath for the next 5 minutes, and then was able to slowly bring the intensity back up.

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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [rrheisler] [ In reply to ]
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Strong swimmer, but I only “race” out of the start in small races that permit sufficient in-water warm-up in my wetsuit. After the chaos of a mass start, a begin to feel more in control, and I begin my steady move through the field. I understand that this strategy won’t work for a professional athlete, but it seems consistent with the pacing and fueling plan that I have for both the bike and run legs. The lack of warm-up opportunity, particularly for cold water swims with large fields guides my race selection.
Last edited by: Wild Horse: Sep 1, 20 5:26
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [lorin26] [ In reply to ]
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The most amazing part of that video was Andi Dreitz running out of T1 without his bike

:-)
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Anni23] [ In reply to ]
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Anni23 wrote:
It was on his instagram stories, which are only available for 24h. He said he had a panic attack, the water was rather chilly. Happens to the best of us

Happened to me my first year of doing open water swims....awful feeling.

https://www.miles4matt.run/
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [ In reply to ]
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It looks like the race was cancelled in the middle of it. I saw Sabi and Dreitz together in the video and that was funny Dreitz leaving T1 without his bike. Anyway, weather looked miserable.

https://www.facebook.com/ChallengeDavos/
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Animalmom2] [ In reply to ]
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There is a thing called the mammalian dive reflex. You can find plenty of info on the googles but bascially it's a survival mechanism that helps to conserve oxygen when humans and other mammals submerge their faces in cold water. There are nerves in the face that trigger a set of physiological responses, including slowing the heart rate and constricting blood flow to the extremities. I've read different things but the general consensus seems to be that it can be triggered by water colder than 70F and comes on faster and more intensely the colder the water temp. I also think some people naturally have a stronger reflex than others.

When you combine that involuntary reaction with the adrenaline of a race start and the physiological demands of swimming it can lead to a panic attack feeling pretty quickly. Hard to breath, tunnel vision, and ultimately the creeping thought that this is how people die on the swim. I would say I get it about 50% of the time I swim in open water (I live in the northeast US where water temps are often below 70, and always below 65 in the ocean). It's a terrible experience and one that has come to limit my enjoyment of swimming and participation in races, especially ocean swims. Depending on how strong the reaction is, I can usually calm it down by doggie paddling for a couple minutes until my body acclimates, but by that time any hope I may have had of a decent swim is out the window and I'm fighting to make up time the rest of the race. It's a crazy feeling knowing you're physically capable of swimming, done it hundreds of times, even reasonably proficient in a pool, then your body just says no in open water. Even stranger that it doesn't happen consistently. I've had some good races with ocean swims in the 60's but it's definitely the expection not the rule.

My buddy and I swam this weekend in a local pond where we do most of our OWS. No wetsuits and the water temp had just fallen into the upper 60's. Panic attack within the first 2 minutes. Fortunately the water was on the warmer side so it was a mild one. I always use a swim buoy if I swim alone (which I rarely do).
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Wild Horse] [ In reply to ]
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Wild Horse wrote:
Strong swimmer, but I only “race” out of the start in small races that permit sufficient in-water warm-up in my wetsuit. After the chaos of a mass start, a begin to feel more in control, and I begin my steady move through the field. I understand that this strategy won’t work for a professional athlete, but it seems consistent with the pacing and fueling plan that I have for both the bike and run legs. The lack of warm-up opportunity, particularly for cold water swims with large fields guides my race selection.

Particularly important in cold water.

I know it's not the case, but every single race should allow swimmers to warm up; anything different is an accident waiting to happen.
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [CementBottle] [ In reply to ]
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CementBottle wrote:
lorin26 wrote:
Hi,

Here is a video of Challenge Davos - barely speaking German - but it seems the commentator is saying Joe Skipper had a panic attack 50m after the start of the swim? Can anyone help translate?
https://www.youtube.com/...28&feature=share


Yeah, I wasn't sure if that was Joe Skipper, I thought it looked like him. It was in German so couldn't make heads or tails of what was being said. Does anyone know what happened?

You can turn on closed caption for the video, and set the language to translate to English.


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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [lorin26] [ In reply to ]
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I feel lucky I grew up surfing. Nor'easter - 10 years old - dark skies - cold AF water - 8-10 feet - pull into a barrel - lip to the side of the head - pounded into the water - no idea which way is up - pitch black - running out of air - scratch for the surface - swept out in rip currents - leash breaks - board goes to shore - you now swim through huge waves to get back to shore - sharks - etc.

Do it again over and over, year after year, swell after swell

I dont think its possible to panic in the water anymore.
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Re: Did Joe Skipper have a panic attack in Challenge Davos? [Dgconner154] [ In reply to ]
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I'm very familiar with the Mammalian dive reflex. I used to SCUBA dive a lot in Norcal (Monterey, CA) water. A "warm" day was 60 deg. F water temp. Normally it's in the mid-50's. The first few minutes after putting your face in the water, even with a mask and neoprene hood on, just sucks. It's like having an ice cream headache while gasping for air. Hower, having experienced it enough times, I expect it and know that it will pass in a few minutes. I don't do hardly any OW swimming outside of races, but my experience SCUBA diving has prepared me for the inevitable gasp reflex when I first jump in at the start of a race. I did 70.3 CdA a couple of years ago, and the first couple hundred yard sucked but I settled in and had a comfortable swim.

Now, I'm assuming that Joe Skipper has done enough OW swims that he too has experienced this enough times to know what it is and that it will pass, which makes his reported panic attack curious to me. I wonder if there weren't some other factors that came into play besides cold water to cause this? It would seem to me that anyone that's experienced this enough times before wouldn't get freaked out about it.
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