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Tubeless article on the front page
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I need to clarify a statement in the tubeless article that's on the front page. Near the end, GK writes that our Hed Jet wheels are not suitable for tubeless. The Plus Jets are ready for tubeless. Yes, the skin on the wheels is thin - we don't make it any heavier than necessary, but a correctly installed tubeless valve will not damage anything. We've tried to crack the skins by overtightening valves, with pliers and they hold up fine.

We have valves in stock, they have a metal flange on rim side, making it impossible to pull them though the valve hole by overtightening. We have four lengths, up to a 100mm that will fit a Jet 9 or Vanquish 8. Threads do not go all the way down the valve, so order the size for your rim depth - that is, don't get the longest one thinking it will fit anything. There may not be enough threading for a shorter rim.

Installation on Jets goes like this:
-tape up your rim. Our included tape works for tubes and tubeless.
-inflate your tire with a tube. The tube will make the tape stick down and seal tightly. You only have to leave the tire inflated with the tube for a couple minutes.
-take the tube out, put the valve in. There's a trapezoidal rubber grommet/sleeve on the valve, the wide side of the grommet points up to the top (air fill end) of the valve, and nests in the drop center section of the rim.
-finger tighten the nut.
-with the butt end of a screwdriver, a sharpie, or similar implement, bear down on the valve from the tire side, as if you are trying to mash it through the rim. You don't need to go red in the face for this part, but do bear down with some weight. While you maintain that pressure, finger tighten the nut. go ahead and make it tight.
-let everything go. The rubber will spring back a little, and will keep tension on the nut, keeping it all tight

It's my experience that with this method you get a secure valve, no skin damage to the wheel, and the valve is still removeable in the field. I can bear down enough with my thumb to make the nut go slack and unscrew it. I don't have especially manly thumbs, but even a tire lever should suffice to depress the rubber, release tension, and unscrew the nut.

Andy Tetmeyer (I work at HED)

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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [andy tetmeyer] [ In reply to ]
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While on the subject, could you add any color to Mavic's Road UST standard, the upcoming ETRTO Road Tubeless standard, and how those vary from what others in the industry are doing?

Love my Jet Blacks :)
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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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I only have a non-answer. I try hard not to comment on design at other companies. I have heard that the Mavic tubeless system works really well - as it should if you are keeping control over all the variables.

Andy Tetmeyer (I work at HED)

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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [andy tetmeyer] [ In reply to ]
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Understood. I guess what I meant to ask was "are these free and open standards or are there licensing fees?" and "is there a lot of communication within the industry on this sort of stuff?" I also have a set of the Mavic UST Road wheels and, yes, that system works very well.
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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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Some are open standard. I think UST is open, but then you're limited to specific tires for the system to work as intended.
Some dimensions for simple Tubeless Ready are patented and require a license, or you design around those patented features.

Andy Tetmeyer (I work at HED)

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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [andy tetmeyer] [ In reply to ]
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andy tetmeyer wrote:
I need to clarify a statement in the tubeless article that's on the front page. Near the end, GK writes that our Hed Jet wheels are not suitable for tubeless. The Plus Jets are ready for tubeless. Yes, the skin on the wheels is thin - we don't make it any heavier than necessary, but a correctly installed tubeless valve will not damage anything. We've tried to crack the skins by overtightening valves, with pliers and they hold up fine.

Hey Andy - I'll see to it that the article gets updated. Last I'd heard, the Jets were listed as non-tubeless because of the fairing thickness... there used to be some info on your website about it, I think maybe a blog post. I cross-referenced with some online retailers and reviews that also said it's not tubeless-ready.
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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [andy tetmeyer] [ In reply to ]
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Do you have a link for the valves? I couldnt find them anywhere on the HED site.
Thanks!
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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [andy tetmeyer] [ In reply to ]
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For tubed tires, it’s become common knowledge that you want a nice and durable rim tape, with Velox-brand cloth tape being a perennial favorite for bike mechanics around the world. This still holds true, and I have a box of Velox in my garage still today. There are also non-adhesive nylon or plastic rim tapes that are a stretch fit over the rim, which tend to work fine as well (though they can become pushed off-center more easily than Velox, which has a light adhesive to help it stay put).

I actually disagree. I frequently see cotton cloth tapes in my wheels travel badly off-center, to the extent that it noticeably affects tire installation. I don't think the adhesive actually does much besides hold the tape in place while it's being mounted.
This can probably be avoided by using cotton tape that's as wide as the entire bead set bed, but then it'll add too much height.

Cotton cloth tape also seems poor in terms of maintaining a smooth and clean bed for the inner tube. In addition to developing rough frays, under high pressure it really doesn't hold up well long-term to irregularities below.

Older single-wall rims typically have a depressed channel much like modern tubeless rims, and "rubber band" rim strips usually actually work extremely well on these rims. I recently switched back to them on my 1979 Ukai hoops after trying Velox for a while and seeing it migrate all over the place.
For most modern rims, I think it's maybe best to just use tubeless tape, even on non-tubeless rims. Less prone to slippage, makes for a lower center channel, and it's usually not a problem if the bead seat shelf is built up very slightly.
Last edited by: HTupolev: Jul 19, 19 17:12
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Re: Tubeless article on the front page [HTupolev] [ In reply to ]
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Hey Andy,

I just added some questions re GP5000TL on Hed Plus rims over on the new "Tubeless wheel and tire SUPER THREAD" (here: https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=7012721#p7012721).

Very curious on your thoughts on aerodynamics for this combination. Is it likely to be as good as the GP4000Sii, or even the GP Attack 22mm? (I know the rolling resistance will be different).
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