Aren't there a significant number of people in HK who have status as British Nationals? I'm not sure what the whole deal is...if you are ethnic Chinese (whatever that means) I think China considers you a citizen no matter what.

Full embargo? Oh oh...I need to get to Harbor Freight quick!

There are thousands of British Nationals in HK, but there are also thousands of US Nationals in HK as well that live abroad. The British have almost no capability to execute a NEO of any size in HK. Not sure how the US would execute a NEO in a metropolis of the size and density that is Hong Kong. The best thing any of these people could do for themselves is to likely GTFO however possible. US or Western Educated Hong Kong citizens are definite targets of the Beijing regime.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I think it is a lot more than "thousands". My quick wikipedia search revealed that 3.4 million Hong Kong residents registered as British National (Overseas) prior to the handover. So they have some sort of quasi-British status below full citizenship, although China considers them Chinese citizens with no consular protection.

The point the Britain, as well as the USA, has little or no ability to extract people or influence the outcome is agreed. I'm hopeful that the HK government will fully retract the extradition bill and that will be enough to satisfy the majority of the protestors and it will die off. Maybe I'm too optimistic.

The UK has like two assault ships? And one Aircraft Carrier?

The US is the only country with the ability to successfully carry out a NEO in a place like HK...except that if that occurred we'd be at war with China.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

and as long as it stayed conventional we would sounded hand them their ass... but no one wants this.

Funny, Douglas McArthur thought something similar. That the US technological superiority could overpower China. That ended badly. And remember - the gap in tech superiority was much greater in 1950 vs today, and the Chinese did not have nuke ICBMs then.
https://www.vanityfair.com/.../10/halberstam200710

Not to put too fine a point on it, but there is an old Sicilian saying:

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Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

BNO explained https://www.gov.uk/...sh-national-overseas

Not really, at the time we weren't really prepared because we were under-trained due to being a constablury force in Japan. And although we weren't ready for the human wave attack that was the Chinese Army. A whole lot of them are dead. But speaking conventionally, we have a better Navy, Better Air Force. A land invasion of China makes little sense for the US, this specifically would a punitive expedition to rescue American Citizens. Anyone talking land invasion of China, just like a land invasion of Iran needs their head checked.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

This further explains the BNO passport - HKers with this passport don’t have the same rights as British citizens such as right of abode in the UK. So the way I understand it - they’re stuck in HK.

https://www.scmp.com/...port-and-what-holder

I’d really like to see HK and Taiwan become their own independent countries - as they should be since their culture and political systems are completely different to China (even though HK has changed a lot since 97 and there has been much more influence from the Mainland).

But I just can’t see this happening in any way because so many countries are “loyal” to China due to trade .. Before 71 or so, Taiwan was actually officially recognised as China until relations improved with PRC (Mainland).

The whole thing deeply saddens and worries me.

Some non SCMP reading on HK if anyone is interested.
https://www.hongkongfp.com/category/topics/

Yes HKFP are good as SCMP is now almost the mouth piece for the Communist party (ok a bit exaggerated but they’ve been censured since the handover) .. a real shame as it wasn’t always that way.

Already we can see that workers are getting sacked for dissenting. A really serious worry. The spiral is going ever more downwards.

And to think that previous generations fought against communism and totalitarianism .. but hey, the Almighty Dollar is what rules the world innit.

it annoys me when western countries only stand up for independence movements and do the right thing when the country doing the oppressing is weak or not of any strategic interest. Why shouldn't those in Hong Kong have the right to self-determination? It is a lot bigger than Kuwait and Kosovo and the west had no problem standing up to Iraq and Serbia. I'm not suggesting military action but lets put our national self interest away and support an independent HK if that is what they want.

I landed at HK airport around 1130 Tuesday night, the second night of the airport shutting down departures. The protesters in the arrival hall were not really an issue. They were pleasant and helped me when I had a few questions. The crowds in the departures hall were completely different. They were pretty close to what the news is reporting. Aggressive and LOUD! Upon exiting to the train you have to walk on a bridge that goes under the departures hall. It sounded like a rick concert! I got outta there at the right time though. The airport announcement that the evacuation order was in place and riot police were assembling upstairs. I watched some of it unfold when I got to the hotel and it was extremely tense up there. On the train to town I spoke with a few protesters and they told me the schedule of what they were going to do for the next few days. Needless to say I moved my return to the USA flight to a different airport! I want nothing to do what HK airport till this is resolved. At the border of HK to China Shenzhen for the first time I saw several soldiers aligned at the gate with more "cattle coralls" set up for order. Just inside of the China border there were several military transport vehicles visible and driving around, I have never seen that before. I sure hope they get this figured out soon, I miss the "old HK".

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Owner of a few Speed Concepts since 2011.

I work for a large international mining company. They have announced an indefinite ban on all travel through HK. I am sure that other companies will doing the same. I will be going the long way round on my commute for a while.

I'm not sure why you think executing a NEO would mean we would be at war with China.

If China wanted to smack down HK without getting into war with us, the first step would be allowing us, and other Western nations like the UK, to evacuate. The exception might be refusing to allow us to evacuate people they believe were stirring up the trouble to begin with.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

aren't we making the same point? What is and isn't a sovereign country is a dynamic situation (Kosovo, come to think of it a lot of eastern europe). Some independence movements the west recognizes and supports, and others they just want to go away; with self interest being the major influence in deciding which are supported.

So you are ok with Hawaii wanting to be independent again?

Or Texas?

Or Alabama?

Well, how do you feel about the Civil War?

The last time I've looked at our NEO Doctrine, most of it involves forcible entry. To execute a NEO in HK we'd need to establish a beach head and probably seize the airport. Now, having the consulate text every US Citizen they have on the docket as in HK to gtfo, that's different, but that's not a NEO.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I'd be fine with Hawaii being independent if that is what they wanted. i know there is no legal way for a state to secede, but it doesn't seem right to annex a group of islands by force, then use the law to support that now they are part of the union they can't legally leave.

The thought of the confederate states leaving looks pretty good to be honest. i guess they would have to take some of the debt they have helped run up, but lets make it happen.