Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Moving to Munich, what bike
Quote | Reply
Fellow Twitchers, I seek your gear hiphy wisdom (also posted on Weight Weenies forum):


I am moving to Munich Germany from San Francisco California in September for work. I have lived in sunny California my whole life, so this will be a big change on pretty much every level. Naturally, I am wondering what bike I should get for this new chapter of my life (since it's obviously the most important question to answer right now).

Background
Very competitive cat 2 bike racer. I flourish on climbs due to being naturally light, but I have become relatively adept at racing in most amatuer racing conditions (bad to nonexistent roads, rainy descents full gas, etc.). I enjoy crits, but I am not great at them due to an innate fear of bunch sprinting that I am continually working through. I've won most of my races from sprinting from small groups on hilly races, but I've also gotten lucky once or twice and just rode away from the field on a flat day.

Winter Training habits
When I move to Munich, in the winter I would like to try some track riding so would have a separate bike for that (I hear there's a velodrome in Munich). I can also get into cross country skiing (I already do downhill skiing but the training benefit of that is questionable). I plan to have a good trainer setup. That being said, I want a bike I can ride throughout the year since being stuck inside is going to be really hard for me. Eventually, I'll probably get a mountain bike for serious off road stuff, but I'm also not afraid to take my road bike down some light dirt/gravel full speed.

Current setup
I'm currently riding a 2018 Giant TCR Pro 1 rim brake size ML. With climbing wheels it's at 7.1kg and with Hed Jet 6+ it's around 7.4kg (ready to race, no bottles or computer). I will probably move up a size in frame to a 58/L bike when I upgrade.
Handlebar stack: 650
Handlebar reach: 500

The disc brake conundrum
After recently racing in the rain with my aluminum tracked Heds, I didn't feel the need for disc brakes...but I could also see the benefit. I also tend to get some brake rub during race intensity accelerations (usually on steep grades, but not always) due to a combination of liking snappy braking (pads close to rim) and throwing my bike everywhere to try and make the move. I feel like disc brake wheels would be stiffer since more spokes and maybe less chance of contacting pads and costing me some watts (I need all the watts). However, there's some good deals on rim brake frames that are hard to pass up. Additionally, disc bikes are where the industry is headed and I want my bike to stay relevant for a long time. I personally think disc bikes look cool and I like the idea of increased compliance due to lack of brake bridge (is that a real thing or am I making this up?).

Then of course comes the 11/12 speed thing. Shimano will probably go 12 speed next Dura Ace iteration so I don't want to buy something that's going to be a pain in the ass in a year (e.g. need for 12 speed specific freehubs like what happened to most 10 speed wheels that became obsolete). I would like electronic shifting and something reasonably aero and light. It also needs to travel well (flights back to the states, for example).

My budget is under $8k. What bikes should I be considering? I'm a cat 3 mechanic and can build up a frame if that's a better solution.
Last edited by: ColeofCali: Jun 4, 19 7:51
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jealous!

sprichts Du denn Deutsch?
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [BrianB] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ja ein bisschen, aber nicht genug!
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I spent 9 months living in Duesseldorf, over 10 years ago now. I thoroughly enjoyed it. (and, learning German, as best I could anyway, was part of the adventure)

Are you planning on racing while there?

I raced while I was there -- masters races, which were fast but no faster than a hard masters race in the US. The equivalent of US Cat 1/2 races looked quite hard. Actually ... I was in Berlin 2 yrs ago and did a race where they threw us in with the 1/2's and I was barely hanging on (then again I am 55+ now)

ErikK on this forum helped me out with info when I did the Berlin race. He is there, and is a top-level amateur. So maybe he will reply if he sees this.

Can't help with bike recommendations for Munich, except to say that when I was there in January there was a crap-ton of snow. Also in November the weather was not very nice, so you will have some adjustment from CA for sure. I didn't ride either time.

But I will add this: I bought a Ritchey Breakaway (Ti/carbon) 3 years ago, to use when traveling, and it's been the most useful bike purchase ever. I've been able to take it as checked baggage, no extra fees. (and have raced on it)
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Canyon expecting to come out with a new Aeroad this summer? I would imagine that you'd be able to get one iteration of that fully ready to race for under 8k, probably with Ultegra Di2. Plus being in Germany, you'll have easier/sooner access to the new frame, components, etc. I think you can even get fit at Canyon's factory as part of the bike purchase.
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [BrianB] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
BrianB wrote:
I spent 9 months living in Duesseldorf, over 10 years ago now. I thoroughly enjoyed it. (and, learning German, as best I could anyway, was part of the adventure)

Are you planning on racing while there?

I raced while I was there -- masters races, which were fast but no faster than a hard masters race in the US. The equivalent of US Cat 1/2 races looked quite hard. Actually ... I was in Berlin 2 yrs ago and did a race where they threw us in with the 1/2's and I was barely hanging on (then again I am 55+ now)

ErikK on this forum helped me out with info when I did the Berlin race. He is there, and is a top-level amateur. So maybe he will reply if he sees this.

Can't help with bike recommendations for Munich, except to say that when I was there in January there was a crap-ton of snow. Also in November the weather was not very nice, so you will have some adjustment from CA for sure. I didn't ride either time.

But I will add this: I bought a Ritchey Breakaway (Ti/carbon) 3 years ago, to use when traveling, and it's been the most useful bike purchase ever. I've been able to take it as checked baggage, no extra fees. (and have raced on it)

Good info WRT racing over there. I do plan to keep racing, not sure what the equivalent P12 field is there though. We always hear that the racing is so hard in Europe but I wonder what level people are actually referring to when they say things like that. Like, if a decent cat 1 here goes to Europe, do they just get dropped in whatever is equivalent to cat 5? Or do these comments generally refer to US pro going to Euro pro? Because that I could believe. Pro racing is hard here and it looks really really hard there.
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Road racing in Germany is a bit complicated. There are races for license holders under UCI rules and races without the need of a license (Jedermann = Gran Fondo).

Races for license holdes in Bavaria (the region of which Munich is the capital) became less and less in the last years. However In a circle of about 300 km around Munich you can still race every weekend. Allmost all races are either crits (be aware in Germany crits usually are points races) or on short rounds below 15km. There is currently a reform of the license system underway, but often the masters have a own race, the “Amateur” have a own race (I would think this is the equivalent to Cat2-Cat5) and the “ Elite Amateur” (equivalent to Cat1) have a own race. In the “Elite Amateur” race continental Pro are often allowed go start. For this kind of races I take an Aero road bike. Coming to Munich I would recommend to enter a club and get a German license, you will start as a Amateur and when you become a member of the first 500 racers you become Elite Amateur.

Totally different but also very competitive are the Gran Fondos in the Alps which you can access quite easily from Munich. Here I would take the lightest bike I can afford.

Last point for the moment. The track for the 1972 Olympics does not exist any more. There is no velodrome in Munich. The next indoor track is in Augsburg, about 90km from Munich.
,
Last edited by: BergHugi: Jun 4, 19 12:49
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [BergHugi] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
BergHugi wrote:
Road racing in Germany is a bit complicated. There are races for license holders under UCI rules and races without the need of a license (Jedermann = Gran Fondo).

Races for license holdes in Bavaria (the region of which Munich is the capital) became less and less in the last years. However In a circle of about 300 km around Munich you can still race every weekend. Allmost all races are either crits (be aware in Germany crits usually are points races) or on short rounds below 15km. There is currently a reform of the license system underway, but often the masters have a own race, the “Amateur” have a own race (I would think this is the equivalent to Cat2-Cat5) and the “ Elite Amateur” (equivalent to Cat1) have a own race. In the “Elite Amateur” race continental Pro are often allowed go start. For this kind of races I take an Aero road bike. Coming to Munich I would recommend to enter a club and get a German license, you will start as a Amateur and when you become a member of the first 500 racers you become Elite Amateur.

Totally different but also very competitive are the Gran Fondos in the Alps which you can access quite easily from Munich. Here I would take the lightest bike I can afford.

Last point for the moment. The track for the 1972 Olympics does not exist any more. There is no velodrome in Munich. The next indoor track is in Augsburg, about 90km from Munich.
,

Thanks BergHugi.

What do you mean by "become a member of the first 500 racers?" Is there a limit to how many Elite Amateurs there are at a given time? If so, is this per province or for the whole country?

Also, how are the gran fondos there more competitive? I'm just having trouble imagining what that might mean since in the US it's like a training ride with picnic tables every 10km and the biggest challenge is making it through the various groups of chatting riders...
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I live 50miles South of Munich, right where the mountains start. Many small roads around Munich. Terrain is moderately hilly. Very moderately. The Bavarian Alps do not have to offer too much for climbing with a road bike unfortunately. However, the South of Munich is generally the more scenic area to ride. But this will also depend on where you live in the city. Getting in/out of the city is fairly easy along the N/S axis, there are good bike paths.

I always start my race season in Northern Italy with some Gran Fondos (Italy is not far away, especially when you're used to US distances). Yes, these are huge races and are very competitive. You actually need a license for these (in Italy everyone has a license). You can get a daily license but this is a huge hassle with the medical and so.

Furthermore, there a quite a few interesting/competitive GFs in Austria later in the year.
Quote Reply
Re: Moving to Munich, what bike [ColeofCali] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
All license holders are ranked and the first 500 of the German ranking list form the “Elite Amateur” category.
These Gran Fondos often have thousands of participants. May be one can call it a real race only for the people at the front, but often also guys from the MOP or BOP take it very serious. These races are in Italy, Austria und Switzerland (all are reachable from Munich, the region is smaller than California, with the exeaption of the beer glasses every thing is smaller). And the top riders do it semi professional with all the drawbacks including PEDs. In Germany there are not many timed Gran Fondos.
Quote Reply