I'm a terrible swimmer, so I won't give advice, only relate my experience. :)

I was where you're at about two years ago. I was just swimming more and more yards hoping that fitness was going to make me faster. I finally got it through my skull that I needed to learn how to swim properly, not just more. I started with the TI book, which I think is good for the basic stuff; balance, etc. I went through several other books, and some coaching from a masters coach. The drills and stroke work helped me immensely! My stroke count now is about 16-18 per 25yds and I'm very comfortable swimming about a 1:30 pace for long distances. I also did 6:18 in a sprint two weeks ago (and almost barfed on the beach :)) so there is some speed there too. Best advice is to find a coach. Everyone always says that, but with swimming it really helps.

Chris

I second the TI and coach route. Even one or 2 60min lessons, especially with video analysis, could be a big help. Also, I'd forget about doing anything more than one lap repeats with good rest after each rep until you can get down to a comfortable 22 or less strokes per SCY length. 30 per SCY length is indicative of a massive balance or technique problem that needs to be addressed via drills. there is no short cut! Swim golf is a good game for this (spl + time = score). You can even do laps taking no more than x strokes and kick to the end if you cant make it.

Another good option is to get a friend with a video camera to film you swim. A coach could do underwater stuff (or you could if you have the equipment) but a lightbulb might go off re: a thousand things just by seeing yourself from above. Things like arm crossover, leg scissor kicks, fishtailing spine, etc., which can each be addressed through drills.

The drill thing can be frustrating b/c we want to be constantly "upping the yardage" to indicate progress, but its the only way to go IMO. That is how the women and young fish-kids that I could bench press 5 times over can effortlessly glide by me in the next lane. Its all about comfort, balance, and technique.

Also, look at it this way: A crap swim means you have nowhere to go but up. Don't ignore it, unless you honestly hate to swim, in which case the du route might be for you. I was a runner/biker w/ no swimming background and it was really fun & satisfying to realize massive gains in this limiter each season.

Good luck!

You definitely need some coaching. You will never get anywhere until you get some decent technique. Not that I have any, but that is why I know.

I started out a few year ago at 2:15 per 100 and around 25 strokes per 25 yards. Got Laughlin's TI book (2001) and got myself down to 1:50 and 18 strokes swimming comfortably. Finally decided to take a new look at what Terry was teaching now and pulled the trigger on the Fishlike Freestyle DVD. The DVD is awesome and put the finishing touches on the last couple of years of drills/swimming. It shows the timing that only comes from a video. Two weeks later - easy is 1:43 and 15 strokes per length. Take what TI teaches you and build on it from there. You can definitely find a groove and bring the numbers down.

Chubby

  If you can't find a coach, there's usually swim lessons at the local pool. Sign up for an adult lesson, a private lesson, or at the very least get a good swimmer to watch you for a few lengths and give you some help. A few swim lessons or a swim clinic will make a huge difference in your speed. You're likely doing stuff you don't aren't even aware of that's really slowing you down.

I will add my voice to the chorus. I used to be crap (50min Half Ironman swim in Jan), but now I am less so. I did a 28min 1500, SCM, the other day, which was a massive improvement for me!

Being in a master's squad is good, having a coach is also good. One thing on the drills etc, is to work on ONE thing at a time. There is no use trying to keep balance, length, catch, pull, kick etc all in your head at once - I believe for non swimmers this is too hard. With your coach, work out what is the biggest limiter, work on that, then when you have mastered it, move on to the next thing.

One more thing - frequency really helps with swimming. If you can do 4 per week you will really make progress. Good luck.

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kiwipat

per ardua ad astra

First suggestion get a coach.

I know sometimes money can preclude a coach. I know for me this year because of a number of life changes I can't afford a coach. In that case, here are some tips:

1) Ask some of the fast swimmers to help you. If you know a few triathletes who are good swimmers just ask them to help you out a bit. If you go when they are in the pool and offer a beer or two they likely won't mind. If you don't know any fast swimmers, just ask someone at the pool. Don't interupt their set and ask them when they are warming down or standing at the end. I never mind when people ask me - what I mind is when people stop my set and ruin my workout.

2) video tape yourself and then compare it at slow motion with some tape of good swimmers. There are a lot of sites on the internet that have videos of top swimmers.

3) pick one thing you know you are doing wrong - I can think of three that are very likely that I see every new swimmer doing a) stiff ankles - either pointed toes or flat footed - relax your ankle, think of it as the end of a piece of rope when you are kicking so that it flows with the leg motion; b) not finishing stroke - you probably finish your stroke at your waist - make your thumb brush against your thigh with every stroke and push hard right through this point. when you are tiring you should feel it here first for now; c) over reaching - if you've been doing TI etc without a coach you have probably spent a lot of time working on your balance in the water and your rotation - now your hand is entering the water far past the centerline of you body (i.e. right hand enters on left sid of body). you want your hand to enter near the centerline of your body. If you feel like a snake (side-to-side) moving through the water this is very likely. Focus on watching your hand enter in front of your face.

Hope this helps. Where do you swim.

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"which is like watching one of your buddies announce that he's quitting booze and cigarettes, switching to a Vegan diet and training for triathalons ... but he's going to keep snorting heroin." Bill Simmons, ESPN

Would I be better off using long slow better strokes?

Definately - but for now I wouldn't even think about how fast my stroke is. I would focus on how may hand enters and where it exits the water. I wouldn't even worry about strokes per length right now. It sounds like you are still a bit away from these being meaningful measures for you.

I would also do some kick sets. I know your legs are probably trashed from the other training, this is more of a drill than anything else. Relax the leg, kick from the hip and, without actively bending/straightening any lower leg joint (ankle, knee) just kick slowly. You knee should bend only slightly and your ankle should flex back and forth. I stress though that at this point in your development this knee bend and ankle movement are only the result of your leg moving back and forth. The lower leg should be almost relaxed. Hard to explain in text but think of a willow tree in the wind and try to apply that connected motion to your leg. If you have kids, get them to pretend to be a tree in the wind and watch how their bodies move interconnectedly without any real muscular effort (I say if you have kids because they will just do it, an adult will think too much and ruin the imagery I am trying to create for you).

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"which is like watching one of your buddies announce that he's quitting booze and cigarettes, switching to a Vegan diet and training for triathalons ... but he's going to keep snorting heroin." Bill Simmons, ESPN

The best way to improve your swimming is "go for a bike ride"!!!

Just kidding. Good luck!!

In reality------I DO swim train by going for a bike ride!! : )

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Paul

Ok one last tip please, I swam today purposly getting my hand into the water correctly and seconds per 25 came off. How should the rest of the stroke look. All the help has been greatly appreciated.

I want to be fishlike, but not smelly or slimey

How to describe?

If you were to pull yourself up onto a ledge with both hands close to the centerline of your body how would you do it?

Now do that basic motion with each hand individually and then finish hard out to the hip.

Does that make sense?

You want to catch the water when your hand enters then pull straight down your centreline with your elbow bending (and slightly to the side) so that in front of your chest your whole forearm is pushing water and then you continue with the hand through to the thigh.