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Re: Anyone here in France? [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
Oh ffs

I lived in provence and the haute savoie. Vaccines will not be a problem by next June. The electorate have short memories.

Vaccine uptake nationally is variable. In 8 weeks it will be a non issue.

Do you mean there are problems with Islam in your rural department. I'm trying to imagine what they might be beyond parochialism.

Yes, women being followed in one area is indicative of the country going to war with 2% of its population.

No one likes immigrants, they arrive. People get annoyed and blame them for taking jobs they wouldn't do, crime they almost certainly didn't commit and all sorts of other nonsense.

Oh stop being patronising.

I am an immigrant in France, I know what they are like. You have to integrate and try to speak the language. You have to adopt their values. They will not accept people coming to live in their country and then attack their values. I took one of their jobs but I am accepted. This isn’t a 1st generation issue as you put it. A lot of inner cities have areas affected.

There are problems with islam communities and their wanting to ignore basic pieces of French culture and law such as hijab in the classroom etc. A teacher was beheaded less than 2 months ago. Nearly every domestic attack over the past 5 years was Islamic in nature.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [SheTries] [ In reply to ]
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So, you're an immigrant in France and you know how all of France is? How funny...
Last edited by: Francois: May 12, 21 5:38
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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Francois wrote:
So, you're an immigrant in France and you know how all of France is? How funny...

I don’t claim to know all of France but what I do know is what you need to do to be accepted as a foreigner. I respect their culture and tradition, I speak good French and I take part in the community. I have seen enough of French tv to understand there is a problem brewing and Macron isn’t addressing it.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [SheTries] [ In reply to ]
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You’re lacking significant perspective on the problem it seems...
This has been a problem mentioned in every single damn election since Giscard D’Estaing at least. Maybe before but I wasn’t born.
The “Muslim” issue isn’t one. It’s a suburb issue. It’s a low SES issue. The far right uses it and you seem to be buying it as some other voters. I’ve heard Le Pen spew bullshit for decades.
You definitely need to get a bit of perspective.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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Here's a list of issues in France:

A social welfare state that is patently unaffordable with no honesty with the electorate. The gilet jaune want lower taxes and more benefits

A employment contract scheme not fit for purpose. It overly protects workers making businesses risk adverse in terms of hiring and expansion. When social costs per month are x thousand. Why would you do it.

What's a non issue.

Refugees

Muslims

What's a perceived issue:

Muslims

Root cause:

Inability to integrate due to structural barriers.

It astonishes me that people say "you need to speak the language, get involved..... Blah blah"

Tunisians and morrocans and others speak native French, but when you're ostracised to a banlieue, and you can't work, or you can, you're hardly going to go and get involved in the community in versaille, and yet areas with zero immigrants are moaning about groups of people that literally don't impact them
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Very good summary.
Unfortunately, the Front National continues its shit of claiming immigration and particularly Muslims are responsible. They don’t even bother differentiating Muslims with northern African descents.
As for the general unhappiness of northern African descents... well their ancestors fought for France and were lied to and parked in shitty areas. They’ve been trying to integrate for 70 years.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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Francois wrote:
You’re lacking significant perspective on the problem it seems...
This has been a problem mentioned in every single damn election since Giscard D’Estaing at least. Maybe before but I wasn’t born.
The “Muslim” issue isn’t one. It’s a suburb issue. It’s a low SES issue. The far right uses it and you seem to be buying it as some other voters. I’ve heard Le Pen spew bullshit for decades.
You definitely need to get a bit of perspective.

And the discrimination issue. For decades Muslims in France have faced significant employment, housing, and education discrimination in France. It is not surprising that some folks that are marginalized by society do not embrace that society.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
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Yep. See my answer to Andrew.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [SheTries] [ In reply to ]
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SheTries wrote:
Nearly every domestic attack over the past 5 years was Islamic in nature.

Many of these attacks were committed by people who did not go to a Mosque, ate pork, drank, and did drugs. Many were "radicalized" in prison.

Do you think the fact that the unemployment rate of Muslim youth is 400% of non-Muslim youth plays a roll in their turning to crime and radicalization?
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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It amazes me people talk about North Africans not integrating. They were reluctantly permitted to move back to france, then parked in the absolute arse holes of cities like marseille and Paris, then everyone starts moaning they didn't integrate
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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And you can even include Pieds-Noirs to this. Who actually were French and still treated like shit.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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I've a friend who's grand parents moved to Algeria on behalf of said government. Apparently the fact they originated in France didn't help their kids on moving back.

France has a problem with Muslims in the same way the republicans have a problem with Biden being a socialist........
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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My maternal grandmother was a pied noir. Born in Casablanca. Then lived in France for a few years including during WWII where she was arrested by the Gestapo and had a few days in jail with special treatment... before moving back to Morocco and then back to France to be treated like crap.
Several of her friends who were northern African natives were treated a lot worse than she was.

But the attitude I can’t fucking stand are immigrants bashing other immigrants.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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As the child of an Irish immigrant who arrived in London at a time when signs in boarding houses read "no blacks, no dogs, no Irish"

I've zero tolerance

I've spent most of my adult life as an immigrant.

There are Muslim fruit loops. There are also basque, Irish and other fruit loops "with a cause"

I spent a lot of time in the middle east, work for, with and living alongside Muslims. The fruit loops are not representative of the vast majority who study, work, have families and practice their religion.

I have friends who are extremely devout, and constantly ask them if they'll get bonus point for converting me.

Guessing on a daily basis I've interacted with more Muslims for a longer period than the average westerner. 30 of my 35 neighbours were Muslim families and I have never, ever experienced anything less than good will.

One of the best experiences I've ever had was being invited to Friday prayers and I was definitely the "odd one out"
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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That’s my experience as well.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
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Even Barnier is now saying there is a problem and immigration is a substantial factor

My neighbour is Algerian. He is a pillar of the community. He is a lovely guy, I get his shopping for him and keep him company on a regular basis. Even he says there is a problem.

Loving the comments about being out of touch from people who “aren’t at the coal face”.
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Re: Anyone here in France? [SheTries] [ In reply to ]
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SheTries wrote:
Even Barnier is now saying there is a problem and immigration is a substantial factor

My neighbour is Algerian. He is a pillar of the community. He is a lovely guy, I get his shopping for him and keep him company on a regular basis. Even he says there is a problem.

Loving the comments about being out of touch from people who “aren’t at the coal face”.

You are surprised that Barnier is trying to gain attention for his Presidential bid by pandering?
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Re: Anyone here in France? [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
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Nutella wrote:
SheTries wrote:
Even Barnier is now saying there is a problem and immigration is a substantial factor

My neighbour is Algerian. He is a pillar of the community. He is a lovely guy, I get his shopping for him and keep him company on a regular basis. Even he says there is a problem.

Loving the comments about being out of touch from people who “aren’t at the coal face”.


You are surprised that Barnier is trying to gain attention for his Presidential bid by pandering?

No kidding...what a shocker...

Oh and one guy said yes there is a problem. But he's Algerian so it must be true. Because minorities who are immigrant never side against their own. Eye roll.
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