Did he need to go that fast for his team? That is really a solid swim for prelims if it was an anchor leg where it wasnt really needed. Maybe post up a link to results, or some videos. Still a long way off Lezak's low 46, but that was a Bob Beamon type race...

Sorry, I meant to post the link. No, he didn't NEED to go that fast, USA qualified first for finals by a comfortable margin.

Official results page here ---> https://results.universiade2019napoli.it/#/sportdetails/SWM

Dean's swim here - second leg of the relay. Lane 5.



Lezak's swim was also supersuited (and draft aided :-)) That makes a huge diff. There are a few swims in the textile era that I'd rank ahead of that for pure performance, e.g. Cam McEvoy's 47.0 from a few years ago. But Lezak's swim was huge and had all the drama around it...

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What meet is this anyway, seems like a lot of names I have never really heard of. Is there a reason we are saving the big guns, another big meet coming up? Dean's time is sick, should certainly get the attention of the coaches. Think maybe he should be moved to anchor for the final..

WUG's (World University Games) are on now, it's a second-tier international meet, at a level just below Worlds/Olympics/PanPacs that the "A" team always attends. It's on a tier above Pan Am's for the USA team. Tallswimmer went to WUG's back in the day. I believe that athletes must be enrolled in University / College or recently graduated, and I don't think athletes are allowed to swim at both WUG's and Worlds (although there might be an exception for relay-only spots).

Worlds start in 7 days...

Zach Apple is there too, he's probably going to be put on the finals team for the relay.

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as far as the relay order, it doesn't matter. USA is about 3s ahead of the field, with more time to drop with Apple. I'd actually like to see Dean lead off, see what he can do in the big pool off a flat start.

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Just scanning through the results, the Brazilian squad was led off by Luis Gustavo Borges. Wonder if he's Gustavo Borges (from the early '90s and 2000's) son? He'd be the right age, born 1999.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustavo_Borges

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https://swimswam.com/...1-finals-live-recap/

Zach led off in the final with a 47.7, Dean went 47.48 (just a little off the morning's swim). Impressive performance, only 0.15 off the meet record.

US women went 1-2 in the 400IM.

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https://www.instagram.com/...igshid=1nnprdtp09li2

We've got a few kids at WUGS and Tristan is going to Worlds.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

I would lead him off so he gets a tapered swim to maximize his world ranking
...

US relays at WUGs and Pan AMs have to bring their A game to put up fast times in the event that a relay at Worlds is Disqualified. The next 4 countries outside the top 12 in the heats at worlds get the slots as only 16 teams are allowed to enter relay events.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

It is also known as FISU games...

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Yes... and he goes to M.

Ella Eastin is swimming 200 IM at both meets due to Baker giving up the 200IM for worlds.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

First results of elite Worlds are in, and Canada is ahead of the USA in the medal count. Eric Hedlin bronze in the 5k!

Men’s 5k

http://omegatiming.com/...FFFFFFFFFFFFFF02.pdf

Results page
http://omegatiming.com/...hips-ow-live-results

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So 53:22 for an accurately measured 5000 meters, or about 1:04 per 100 m. Not a bad pace. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Any predictions from the ST experts!

I’ll start with the easy ones.

Ledecky 1500m (WR) ?
Paltrinieri 1500m (WR)

Ledecky 800m ( won’t go sub 8)

Women’s 4 x 200m free = Aus

200m women’s free Ruck!!!

Titmus 400m free to beat Ledecky. Not sure!

Easy predictions

Dressel wins 100 fly (new WR 49.7x)
Ledecky 400/800/1500
Peaty 100 breast
King 100 breast
Hosszu 200/400 IM
Sjostrom 50 fly
Titmus pushes KL and finishes the 400 less than a body length behind.

Probably, but less than sure thing
W 4x2 Australia
M4x1 free and medley -usa
Sjostrom 50 free 100 fly
Peaty 50 breast


Crapshoots
100 free (men’s and women’s)
W100fr C Campbell or Sjostrom
M100fr Dressel/Chalmers/Grinev
50 free men’s and womens
W200 breast (there’s like 3-4 women who are right around the 2:21 mark)
200 free


More later

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Peaty & King are a given.

Will go Blume for 50m free.!!

Jason, where do we watch the events online in Canada?

No idea. FINA tv is streaming (for a fee) but it’s not available in the US. NBC has rights in the US. Whether we can get it I don’t know. CBC is supposed to be streaming events, but not sure if that’s everything or just certain disciplines? And whether we can get FINAtv I haven’t looked st.

I know FINA has yet to reach an agreement for tv rights in Australia, so they might be SOOL.

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My weekend is packed between Serena and Federer at center court at Wimbledon, the Tour de France, the Cricket World Cup finals between England and New Zealand and some misguided plan to pack in 7-8 hrs of tri training. Luckily my family is away so I should be able to fill the gap with watching swimming.

OK heading out for 60 min jog and 90 min outdoor swim now! And you are right how badly my IM swimming is sucking now that my runs are way longer than 20 minutes (generally 40 min to 60 min).

I'll check CBC

Well, you should be ok since pool swimming doesn’t start til next weekend. Just FYI, Worlds encompasses multiple sports,

Swimming
Open water swim
Diving
High diving
Waterpolo
Artistic
And I think there’s something else that I’m forgetting.

Open water is on this week, Women’s 10k is today. Not 100% sure of the schedule but this week is likely diving and artistic swimming (synchro) and early rounds of waterpolo.

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Glad to hear you are able to run 60 min now!!! Are you running outside or on the TM???

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Outside running! I think my run today went better than Serena at Wimbledon, but her paycheque was a lot better. Today's TdF stage was a long winded snoozer. I'll look forward to the swimming action next weekend! I actually skipped a 3 km open water race near home this morning. I'm saving my $$$ for a few Olympic tris and the 12km Lake crossing race at Mont Tremblant in 3 weeks. If anyone has a link to the 10km open water, that would be great.

OK found the link to the open water men's 5 km. What are these guys allowed to wear for suits on upper body?

http://www.cbc.ca/.../play/1570353219718/

Open water suits - must have the FINA logo, sleeveless, textile, non-buoyant. If you browse around the Arena website (arenawaterinstinct.com) you’ll see examples.

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https://www.instagram.com/...?igshid=mlsm4hue0t78


As Jason said open water suits are subject to the same Non-buoyant rules as the pool. No zippers are allowed either.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Why do they allow upper body fabric for open water, but not in the pool. You'd think they would have the same for both (plus women have upper body in pool for obvious reasons, so why not men if they allow us to have upper body coverage in open water)? I am not seeing any logic to this.

It’s FINA . Logic need not apply.

I think one of the reasons is around records. Open water records (if they even exist) are pretty meaningless, but in the pool they basically allowed for a compromise that allowed “some” technology without going to the 2009 silliness.

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Jellyfish protection is why the body suits are allowed in OW. They wear them at nearly every venue regardless if there are jellyfish or not though.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Not so fast...Sarah Bacon won Silver in womens 1 Meter Springboard diving... and China is way ahead...

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Karen ST Concierge

https://www.foxsports.com.au/...891193a454316bacb7d9

What a joke that this person can compete in anything ever again.

In the women's 10K, Xin Xin of China won in 1:54:47.2 by 0.9 sec over Haley Anderson of the U.S. Thus they averaged about 1:09 per 100 m for 100 x 100 m on no rest.

http://omegatiming.com/...FFFFFFFFFFFFFF02.pdf

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Yes!

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They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

What do they do for any nutrition/aid.I assume for a 2 hrs race, its just head down and hammer?

Feed zones

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I have not watched this but how do they take their feed. Is it like a bike stage race or XC ski race where team managers are giving their own guys specific bottles, or just a free for all from race support.

It looked like bottles (re-used Gatorade bottles, open cap) seemed pretty popular. They were held in fairly loose cup holders at the end of a stick marked with the country flag. In this race, all athletes swam through the feed zone each time and similar to a NASCAR pit stop, some would slow and grab their bottle and others would swim right through.

The technique for grabbing the bottle was pretty cool - they'd grab their bottle mid-recovery, flip to their back, and do one-arm backstroke while chugging what they could from the bottle. The bottles were left behind and all seemed to float, and were scooped back up when there was no traffic.

This was a fascinating race to watch and it makes me really excited for Olympic open water!!

Side note - Xin Xin came from way back in the ranks (30s) at around halfway and worked her way up to the front by 9.9km. It's a bit less than a 2-hour time investment to watch but it was pretty cool. I was able to stream it from "The Olympic Channel" via my cable provider.

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KJ
Swim and Triathlon Coach
AllTerrainEndurance.com
KJ@allterrainendurance.com

Florian Wellbrock of Germany took the Men's 10K in 1:47:55.9, winning in a photo finish by 0.2 sec over Marc Antoine Olivier of France. That's 1:04.8 per 100 m. The 1500 scm WR holder (14:08 or 56.5 per 100 m) Gregorio Paltrinieri of Italy was 5.1 sec back in 6th, just behind top U.S. 1500 m swimmer Jordan Wilimovsky.

http://omegatiming.com/...FFFFFFFFFFFFFF02.pdf

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

That's 1:04.8 per 100 m with no walls//

You keep saying no walls like these swims should be slower than a pool one. Let us not forget that these guys get to wear super suits, are most often swimming in salt water, and of course get to draft in a huge pack. I would say all those things well out weigh not having flip turns, probably by a few seconds a 100 I would guess..

OK, I defer to your professional judgment.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Do you know if this was a salt or freshwater swim? Either way I’d rank it slightly slower than or even with the pool, given that Gregorio P will be in the 14:30’s for the 1500. (58 ish average). For 10k LCM I’d think he could hold 4’s and 5’s .

Of course, according to the SwimSwam comment section he swam it like a total noob, so there’s that.

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I'm assuming that this was salt water, but don't know for sure. That's worth a second or two per 100 right there. And I had a look at all the top 20 Guys splits, they traded leads throughout the race, so someone was always on the gas, and there was a lot of drafting going on. For me in a pool, I can get around 5 seconds a 100 in a good draft, factoring in that the guy in front is doing a pace 5 seconds faster than I would have gone on my own. And then you have the super suits, I think we all know they are at least a second + per 100 there.

10k is a lot further than a 1500, I would bet that none of those guys could swim that time in a pool on their own, but maybe? And keep in mind that a "lot" of guys swam that time today, and the 14;30 guys is just outclassed by the drafting and the tactics at the finish. Probably 15;25 guys in that group, maybe even beat him.

My only wish is that it would actually be rough water sometime, maybe with a surf entry and exit too. And I see Jordan took the lead right at the end, but got swarmed by the final sprint it looks like, I will have to watch the race when it comes up on youtube or somewhere else to see the finer details that don't get shown in raw splits..

The final sprint speed is a key factor... very few can gap the field on pace. Paltrineri is my pick for gold next year, more specific training and experience will be huge factors.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

The guy who won is also a 14:36 1500 guy and I believe he’s beaten Paltrinieri before. Willimovsky (sp??) is sub 15. (14:50 ish, IIRC? I’ll look it up later). Not sure about the others in the front group, but I’d be surprised if they were 15:25 guys, unless their PB is old and they’ve just been focusing on open water.

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Indeed Germany's Florian Wellbrock, the 10K winner, went 14:36 for 1500 LCM at the Euro Champs in 2018. Willimovsky has gone 14:45 and Paltrinieri 14:34.

https://www.fina.org/...ype=overall-rankings

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

They aren't wearing super suits like the old rubberized ones, they're tech suits with long legs and cover the torso. The advantage is less than in the pool, because after about 3 minutes they do absorb some water. Yes, there's salt water, but also currents, chop, going around buoys, and getting dropped and swimming by yourself. Then there's that crazy reach up and hit the sign finish thing. I'm going out on a limb to say that these guys would all go faster in their own lanes in a pool, given same distance. But 10k in a pool would be dizzying.

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Karen ST Concierge

The advantage is less than in the pool, because after about 3 minutes they do absorb some water. //

Actually, the advantage is in the compression, think that has been well established now, the tighter the better. The material absorbing water is really immaterial, as long as the compression stays in place.

Now it is, but the reason the poly supersuits from ‘09 were so stupid fast was because of the water impermeability (and the compression) They trapped a layer of air against the body and acted like a wetsuit.

That’s one of the benefits of the dual layer suits, they trap a bit of air for a bit longer than a single layer suit.

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Hmmm, I don't think they outweigh the turns and especially not by a few seconds. Wilmovsky isn't going to have a problem holding 1:06's all day in a LCM pool.

I do wonder what the slowest a guy could be in the 1500 and still hang with the pack. The American Heron got dropped and he is around 15:20.

Hmmm, I don't think they outweigh the turns and especially not by a few seconds. Wilmovsky isn't going to have a problem holding 1:06's all day in a LCM pool.

I do wonder what the slowest a guy could be in the 1500 and still hang with the pack. The American Heron got dropped and he is around 15:20. //

Well it wasnt 1;06's, it was high 1;04's. So that would be over 6 straight 1500LCM races in low 17 minute range. I think right now for you and I, this is just a thought exercise, but someone out there might know what someone actually does in a 10k pool race? Have we ever heard of some distance stud doing 6x1500LCM on the 17;15? Or the in any distance, but on the same interval? That would be a 100X100LCM on the 1;05, do people do that, or has anyone?

And it would be interesting to know all the PR's of the guys in that big group. I know for me and a lot others, we swim way up in OW as compared to pool times, and a lot of guys just swim down too. I'm still betting that some guy(s) in the group, are nearly a minute slower in the pool than the fastest guy..

In the men's 25K race Axel Reymond of France won in 4:51:06.2, besting runner-up Kirill Belyaev of Russia by only 0.3 sec. That's averaging 1:09.9 per 100 m for 250 x 100 m on zero rest. In the women's 25K, Ana Marcela Cunha of Brazil won in 5:08:03.0, besting Finnia Wunram of Germany by 8.6 sec. Cunha averaged 1:13.9 per 100 m.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I caught some of that race last night. Looked brutal. For those that didn't, there was a lot of rain. At times you could not see the shore due to how hard it was, and there was speculation from the broadcast team they would end the race at 3hrs, which is the required minimum time for an official result. Parts of the race even looked like a bunch of lost triathletes, as the swimmers sat up and were asking officials if the race would be called (pretty severe change in tactics when you're 2hrs+ in to the race and want to know if you have another 2hrs to go or just 30min).

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Damn, that does sound brutal!!! Averaging under 1:10 per 100 m under those conditions for 250 x 100 m is pretty incredible. Thanks for your "reporting". :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

And the pool competition started today!!!!

4x1 free relay , Canadian women look strong. So do the aussies of course.

On the men’s side, Blake Pieroni had a fantastic split. Should be Caeleb, Nathan Adrian, and prob Zach Apple along with Blake in the final. USA men qualify easily for the final, unlike worlds 4 years ago.

400 free, will Titmus challenge? What’s gonna happen with the Yang/Horton grudge match?

So much drama, and it’s only day 1!

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Horton refused to share the podium with Sun Yang, because he's a drug cheat.

Wow...Titmus bead Ledecky.

I don’t think yang should be allowed to compete either, but Horton is being a drama queen.

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I knew it would be close, but wow!!! Let’s see what the 800 brings!

Looks like Katie died in the last 100 looking at the splits...

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When was the last time Ledecky lost a major meet final?

In the 400-1500, she was undefeated in international competition until now. 2012-2018 That’s a pretty good run at the top (and she’s not done yet...)

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So happy for Titmus (I'm sorry, I'm American and I rooted for a swimmer from another country). It was actually a blowout the last 25. Same thing for Simone blowing by the last 25 for the silver in the relay (I just love how she closes); also I'm happy for Cate Campbell.

I don't really care about any of the distance events, but I'd like to see Biedermann's record go down. Not like I'm routing for Sun (or Horton), but I was hoping one of them would do it.

Great American 4x100 relay (especially Apple). But I'm still for Chalmers in the individual. Is that un-American?

Let us not forget the stroke events: Peaty went 56.88 for a new WR in the 100 breast semis. No other swimmer has ever gone under 58, much less under 57, and the 2nd place qualifier at this meet was 58.67, almost 2 sec slower!!!!! Peaty is definitely in a diff league in the 100 BR.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I figured he’d reset the WR at this meet after going 57 something in prelims. In this event, there’s no one else to even talk about. It’s not boring, exactly, but it’s predictable.

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McNeil seeded 2nd in 100 Fly and Pickrem 2nd in 200 IM

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Disagree. I've met Mack, his family are close with a good friend of mine's. He is a calm, level headed guy, and is prepared to stand up for what he believes in. More Olympic champions should do the same, IMO.

Should do what, tilt at windmills? Not that Yang isn’t s problem, but he isn’t THE problem, if you know what I mean.

I’m sure he is a calm level headed guy, from what I’ve seen of him he seems like a good fellow. But that doesn’t mean that in this situation he isn’t a drama queen. Everyone has people or situations that push their buttons. Yang pushes Hortons buttons.

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"Why don't more athletes speak out against doping?"

Athlete speaks out.

"He's a drama queen".

Maybe. I don’t think I’ve said that athletes should be publicly speaking out against doping, especially not individual athletes. Honestly, I don’t think that accomplishes anything. It’s just playing whack a mole.

The system needs fixing. Yang is a symptom...,

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Where is Travis Tygaart when I really need him!!!!

Horton didn't "say" anything. He "did" something. Probably all he could do. @JasoninHalifax if you were in his shoes beaten by a guy with Yang's history and someone in the crowd yells out "Drama Queen"!.......need I say anymore? Mac's a great champion in every sense of the word and a great leader for the team.

Yeah man. I'm speaking broadly. I generally like and agree with most things you say, but feel pretty strongly about this.

Horton copped it big time from the Chinese after what he said during the Olympics, so I'm even more impressed that he's sticking to his guns.

Not getting on the podium is “saying something”. It’s explicitly a statement. It’s an action designed to express an opinion on something.

If someone in the stands is going to yell at Horton, I’d be the first to call that guy a d-bag...

Look, he has the right to say whatever he wants, and I completely support that right. I also think it’s ineffective at accomplishing anything meaningful, which is what I want to see. Drama queen was perhaps too harsh. “Quixotic “ perhaps?

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The Chinese swim fans are trolling the SwimSwam comments section on Horton not standing on the podium pretty hard. I imagine his Instagram account is flooded..., so yeah, I really do admire him for sticking to his guns, but it’s gotta be like beating your head against a brick wall...

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I believe what Horton did was brave and wish that more athletes in all sports had the courage to stand up and make a statement about drug cheats and the crap system that allows the stars to be protected. Maybe if it happened more the system would be less flawed.

I disagree with you when you say it's achieved nothing. It's brought a whole pile of grief on him. Just read reports of the number of hate emails, twitter stuff etc. No doubt there'll be explanations required within Australian and International sporting organisations, not to mention hightened diplomatic tensions as Park has now linked this to disrespecting China. It's an unbelievable chain of events because this has been allowed to fester. He's going to feel the pain which is totally ironic as he isn't the one not playing fair.
The last time an Australian created such controversy at the podium was at the 1968 Olympics with Peter Norman.
Just like then, what Horton did was draw a line in the sand. I reckon he's a hero.

Same on reddit swimming... calling people white supremacists for calling out his poor behavior.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

I dvr’d the last 30 mins of the nbc coverage. Watching the relay finals now...

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It actually makes me feel quite sick to see how much the Chinese fans can hate on someone for calling out their hero who is so obviously a cheat. One positive test and then the hammer/vial smashing incident in most countries would be enough to make fans turn against their athlete, but not here.

Getting the discussion back to swimming....

Is it just me, or does the men’s 2free seem like a crapshoot? 15 guys between 1:46.18 and 1:46.9 in prelims.

I’m rooting fir Guy, or Chalmers, or Scott, Or Haas, or Seliskar, or Rapsys, or <anyone not named Yang>

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Ya, I was just looking at those prelim results, lots of guys very close together. Changing subjects, did you notice that Ledecky did not swim in either the prelims or the finals of the 400 free relay??? I remember she was on this relay in the 2016 Oly, not sure about the '17 Worlds but in any case, one less medal for her at this meet.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

It seems like she’s dropped it from her programme. She didn’t swim the 100 free at ‘18 Nationals, which was the selection event for ‘19 Worlds, Pan Ams and WUGs.

They aren’t giving up anything by not having her on there. The 4 women in the final are really good, and the 100 isn’t a great event for Katie anyway. I guess that with the 1500 being added they had a decision to make as to where to put the focus.

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Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

In other news, Horton has been receiving death threats from Chinese folks.

That's not cool at all....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Maggie MacNeil (CAN) takes down Sjostrom in the 100 fly!!! 2nd fastest performer ever, and only the 3rd to dip under the 56 sec mark! (Vollmer, Sjostrom, and now MacNeil) She did it with a phenomenal back half, 5th at the 50 in 26.7, then 29.0 for the 2nd 50 for the win!

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

And Dressel just destroyed the field in the 50 fly to win by nearly half a second, just off Govorov's WR. This event was by no means a sure thing for Caeleb going in, with Govorov and Santos in the field. If he's this fast in the 50 (22.35) then I'm predicting really good things in the 100. Sub 50....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Pickrem takes bronze the 200 IM. 2 ladies in 100 Back final tomorrow.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

Canadian women are doing so well across many events. How come they are so much better than Canadian men?

Dunno, but the men are making some improvements. Thornmeyer is up there, maybe not a medal threat but a solid finalist, and there are a few young guys who show promise. I think one of the big issues in Canada is hockey. A lot of the best athletic talent goes there at a young age, particularly on the boys side. I believe that more girls get into swimming than boys.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

will we see sub-58 from Masse? 58.5 in semi's, it's possible,,,,

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I just saw the 100 fly, I'm happy for the winner, I wanted someone to dethrone Sarah. In the 200im however, it was a complete blowout. I thought the race would be closer than that.

Yep, no canadian men to note, but I'll admit in year's past I always rooted for Ryan Cochrane and Brett Hayden (who was a perfect pace-setter for Adrian in the 2012 100m final).

And FINA sent Horton a warning letter..... they don’t like it when athletes have opinions of their own...

https://swimswam.com/...over-podium-protest/

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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Makes sense. As the father of a high school hockey player who thinks my swimming is pretty ‘’lame” and “nobody cares.”, I get it. Same is true in US, best male athletes go into major sports, although with a population at 10X Canada’s we get some good swimmers too.

Why would you want swimmers to run in and out of the water? This isn't cyclocross (or triathlon), it's swimming. Do you start your running races by running out of a lake?

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

I have done many 5 and 10k pool swims, in both LCM and SCY, and many 5-10-25km OWS races, in both fresh and salt water. The pool is faster. It just is. The conditions don't change, body temperature isn't an issue, there's no waves, you can still draft off of your lane mate and perhaps most of all, your arms get a rest on each turn (completely underrated, you don't realize how much this can help until you are putting in mega-yardage as an experienced swimmer).

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

Why would you want swimmers to run in and out of the water?//

Because that is how OW swimming started, and continued up until recent history. The lame in water start came into play right around the time they started cancelling and shortening swims. But glad you are happy with how they run them now, it goes with the dumbing down of all events these days.

I find that in-water starts tend to be quite a bit more "friendly" than beach starts. People aren't as aggressive. There's no need for goggle-punching and face kicking that comes with that type of aggressiveness.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

The pool is faster.//

Well first of all there is the measurement factor. Not sure how they do these OW races, but maybe GPS? But lets assume there are accurate for comparison sake. Do you think that those top 20 or so guys could all swim 10k in a LCM pool and average under 1;05? I really dont know this answer, that's why I asked if anyone had experience with world class guys doing long sets, or even races in the pool. You say you have done them, what are the best times from top guys you see?


I just feel that if you lined all those guys up in a pool(where you dont draft, not sure what you are talking about there) and they all swim 10k, a lot if not all are going to fall short of that pace, especially without those full body suits. I might be wrong, but I need some proof..

I find that in-water starts tend to be quite a bit more "friendly" than beach starts.//

That is mostly a function of being able to lengthen out the starting line. If you packed everyone in the water 10 wide instead of 50 to 100, it would be almost as crazy as a running start. And it is not about running, it is another water skill that we learned and used to do, dolphining in and out, navigating surf if there was any, and learning how to pace completely different from all that underwater work to get good position...

Where's that post about Erik Vendt's fabled 30x1000y on 10?

"This monster set has been the subject of rumour and discussion on many occasions and as I have access to someone who would know the �real story�, I thought I�d ask someone who�d know - his coach at the time, Josh Stern:

Ha.
The rumours are funny.
I think 10:00 intervals became the story because it averaged out to faster than 10:00 per 1000.
What really happened is this - some Aussie Open water 10/25K swimmer was in Boston during the summer and he did a set at a summer club pool that was 20 x 1000 Free.
We heard about it and Erik wanted to go farther - thought 25 was good but "anybody" could do that so we decided 30.
We knew we needed 5 hours so he came in 3 hours early for practice (which was 3 & 1/2 hours back then).
We started at 1 on 11:00, 1 on 10:00, 1 on 9:50, 1 on 9:40, 1 on 9:30
Then 1 on 10:15 and 3 on 9:45, 1 on 9:30
Then 5 on 10:00 and so on
Around #17-#19 we realised that Erik hadn't eaten anything (ANYTHING!) before he came in to train.
So we threw a 11:00 1000 around #21 or #22 and shoved a granola bar down his throat with some sports drink or water.
He hung tough through #23 and #24, and blasted through the last 6 where the intervals stayed at 10:00.
He finished well under 5 hours even with the 11:00 food interval (I think he was 3-5 min under) so that's probably where the whole 10:00 interval came from.
His slowest 1000s were around 18-22 but he was never slower than 10:00 on any of them except the first 1000 he did which was 10:10 or 10:15 on the 1000 #1 on 11:00 - he was under on all the 10:30 as well as the 11:00 food stop.
I wrote all the times down when he did it - as well as the 500 splits - and kept every split during each 1000 to keep count.
He did negative split every 1000 - I don't think he even remembers that - except towards 18 or 19 when he started to have trouble counting... that's when we realised he hadn't eaten anything before training. (ugh) He started to phase out mentally until we got some food in him.
Man, what a great kid Erik was. Just a great, great kid.

The rumours are better - much easier to follow and understand. The reality was that the set was much, much harder than 30 x 1000 on 10:00.
It probably would have been better if we did the 10:00 intervals for all of it. I just wanted him to change speeds more and control every swim.

So there you have it. Certainly one of the �all time� workouts!
Last edited by: gunsbuns: Feb 8, 15 22:29"

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

So there you have it. Certainly one of the �all time� workouts! //

Pretty sure that was yards, quite a way from LCM, good try though...

And a nice podium moment in the women’s 100 fly as the medalists posed for pictures with ‘don’t give up Rikako Ikee’ written across their palms

The young Japanese star is out at least for the year to get treatment for leukemia

If there was a 10k race in the pool and they did it shaved, tapered and suited up, yeah, they'd all average faster than 1:04's. Workouts are a different matter, some would be able to, some wouldn't.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Kind of a shock in the men's 200 free semi where Guy, Chalmers, Haas, and Seliskar all failed to Q for the final.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Like I said earlier, the 200 free is a complete crapshoot on the men's side. You just have to be off a tiny bit.

Not surprised that Haas didn't make it though, and (I think I'm remembering this correctly) that Guy didn't have a great meet at British trials. The 200 isn't really Chalmers best event either...

when was the last time Seliskar raced the 200 free LCM???

I think the fastest 3 American 200 free guys right now are probably Pieroni, Farris and Dressel....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Those guys could all hold 1:05 for 10k in a pool. I did a 10,000 long course for time in high school (second swim of a 25,000 meter day, end of a 110,000 meter week), was a 4:10 400m swimmer at the time, and I held under 1:15. These OW cats are badasses.

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

And so what was the rationale for having the selection meet 1 yr before the Worlds??? (Somewhat rhetorical Q.)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Damn you animal !!! lol

I won't re-litigate that question, but I will tell you it is the right thing to do. Every quad it's all Chicken Little, but the Olympics turn out just fine. To lose 6-8 weeks of training time for an early summer double shave in the year before the Games is not a winning strategy when USA Swimming gets paid for Olympic Medals. It's the US Olympic Committee, not the US World Championships Committee ;)

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

Maggie McNeill?????

Awesome, don’t follow swimming enough to have heard of her.

Maurice

Those guys could all hold 1:05 for 10k in a pool. I did a 10,000 long course for time in high school (second swim of a 25,000 meter day, end of a 110,000 meter week), was a 4:10 400m swimmer at the time, and I held under 1:15. These OW cats are badasses. //

No doubt they are the best in the world at this long stuff. But even your example of doing 1;15's and only being 5 seconds a 100 slower than those guys are now, doest knock that extra 5 seconds. Like I said, no doubt some people could do it, but all 20 guys that make up the lead packs? I just dont think it is that common, but maybe I'm wrong. But if I'm right, and just a few can go that fast in a pool not drafting with jammers, then all those other guys are going faster to be able to be sprinting with them at the end.. That was my main point, but would still like to see a flat out 10k LCM race in a pool somewhere, and the times guys do..Thanks for some hard evidence though. Have you ever heard of anyone doing a 100x100 LCM on the 1;05 base?

More girls than boys in the sport here. We have some great younger talented boys on this team that are about 1-2 years out from making an impact at this level. Cole Pratt, and Josh Liendo are Sr team rookies at 16. Most of the 18-19 year old girls are veterans on the national team now.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

She’s young and dropped 2 secs off her 100 fly PB this year (at least). You have to really follow Canadian AG swimming to have heard of her.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

A weird connection but this guy used to be our masters local coach, and ran our small club:

http://www.swimontario.com/news_detail.php?id=1920

Not sure how much direct influence he’s had on the junior program,

Maurice

As shit as the situation is it is this is a positive and embarassing for FINA.

'It comes after Horton walked into the dining room at the athletes’ village and received rapturous applause for his stance.'

https://www.foxsports.com.au/...6ef91bf7684db90f81c6


I hope FINA get called out as the Australian team got sent a letter too.

Yes, it was yards. a 1:04 100m converts down to a :56-:57. So, if Vendt is holding :56-:57, that's roughly the same pace as those OWS paces mentioned earlier. Don't let everyone's facts and experiences ruin your opinions.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

By far and away Yangs worst offence is being indirectly associated with Total Immersion coaches who promote his stroke as “ideal”

I still get a headache every time that slow mo video pops up.

Having said that it’s really hard (for me) to disagree with what Horton has done here.

I remember when Hacket refused to shake Melouli’s hand in London 2012, a bit different because he still stood on the podium.

Maurice

Actually, now that you've repeated a summary version, I remember when you explained this in more detail before. Also, just this evening I was talking with Lee Houchin, who swam for Indiana around same time you were at Michigan, and he offered a similar explanation, though he was not as certain of it as yourself. Lee swims at the same club as myself but he is still a bit burned out, only swims 1500-2000 maybe twice a week. As you prob recall, his cousin Charlie swam on the 4 x 200 relay in the 2012 Oly and also has a youtube video wherein he kicks 400 LCM in 4:55. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

HOLY FRIGGING SORE SHOULDERS BATMAN!!!!! A 25,000 LCM DAY???? AT THE END OF A 110,000 LCM WEEK???? God damn, god damn, that is just incredible. SHEET, these ironman guys just think they train hard. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

And, Vendt went 30,000 yds, not "just" 10,000 m. Also, totally agree on your earlier post about the pool always being faster than OW.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I came into this thread and saw this and then I thought, "I guess this is what you do when you have to be in the pool at the same time as Lochte and Phelps and you have the fortune/misfortune of your career overlapping with theirs!!!!"

And, Vendt went 30,000 yds, not "just" 10,000 m..

I get that he "swam" the pace of the racers, but he had rest, their time was continuous, big difference. Of course he did it for 2 1/2+ times as long, dude was a total stud. Like I said before, it would be interesting to see what they actually could do in a pool race. Doing a time with rest is one thing, a straight through 1;04+ for 100x100LCM, I just dont know? Thats doing 110x100SCY on the 56+ interval. Give me a set that someone has done like that? I remember a guy in my day doing a 100x100SCY on the minute, Mike Burton I think it was. He was like Erik in that he was a training machine, better trainer than racer.


I know someone can do it, but what about the other couple dozen guys that fill out a lead group in these big OW races? Are they all that fast in the pool? I just dont think so, thats all, and goes to my point that OW swims are faster than the pool..

Ledecky out of the 200 free due to illness :-(

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It would be cool if FINA would have 5K and 10K races in the pool. They could have stringent qualifying standards, swim two to a lane, and swim just one heat of 20, so the 5K would take around 50-55 min and the 10K around 1:40-50.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

If I were these OWS competitors, I’d be knocking on FONA’s door, wondering why they need a jet ski directly in front of the group, breathing in the exhaust for 2 hours.

It’s also wild to see the variations in stroke rates, even just in the front pack. The German Wellbrock was close to 30, while many others were up around 40.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

Explains the fade at the end in her past race.

Someone just tell him he’s right so we don’t have to listen to his woefully inept argument. What’s your background in anyway? It’s not swimming eh?

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

Maybe.

Apparently something is going around. Mackeon is out too. Ruck scratched (apparently healthy though, just saving matches for 1back). Hosszu shit the bed and failed to advance to semi’s - very unusual for her...

And Ledecky has scratched out of the 1500 final too...

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I found it interesting watching the recap om youtube of some of the OW races where people would wait a while before diving in - sometimes quite a while. Not sure where the 'waiters' ended up getting in the race.

A 25km race must be brutal.

For me, it was 1 minute of fun followed by about 5 and a half hours of discomfort. Out of all of the races and such that I’ve done, I think this required the most recovery. I was toasted for a week.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

Arrgggghhhhh…

Rapsys touches first in the 200 free, but was deked for a false start. Yang gets credited with the win....

Imma go cry now....

https://swimswam.com/...nning-mens-200-free/

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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Huge bummer.

Also, Ledecky out of the 1500 (and 200), claims she's not feeling well.

She could just do drills for 1500m and treat it like a warm up set and win the stupid thing (1500m)

she's good, but she's not quite "that" good. And if Ledecky is out due to illness, I gotta think that she really feels like crap.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Duncan Scott following Horton's lead...

https://swimswam.com/...shake-with-sun-yang/

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Fuck Sun Yang, he has no place at this meet or in the sport. I sure hope his warning letter for unsportsmanlike conduct is incoming from FINA:
https://twitter.com/.../1153637588768608256

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

Hopefully CAS hearing returns the proper verdict and takes away the medals from this meet, at least...

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Scott handled that very well IMO.

Horton and Scott’s actions are clearly really winding up Sun Yang which is more than they could have hoped for. He’s actually attracting more negative exposure with his own actions.
Shows him up for what he is. He clearly has little respect for the sport.

Good luck. FINA doesn't give a shit. China's mid-1990's female performances were never stricken, and the whole country should probably have been banned for a period of time. FINA didn't follow the Russia ban and basically allowed any Russian athlete that whined about it to swim in 2016. They were so far behind on the tech suits they created the WR mess we have with guys swimming in wetsuits from 08-09. Go back even farther, and in the 70s they were more interested in limiting US dominance (reduce country rep from 3 to 2) and basking in the East German overthrow of American power than actually looking at the obvious issue staring them in the face. Add in all the random "stars" here and there that turned out to be drug cheats.. FINA just sucks all around.

In the pool, I think the rule change to breaststroke showed me they won't take the hard stance, ever. Instead of saying, no, F you, no dolphin kicks in breaststroke, they said well, everyone's doing it we can't DQ everyone, let's change the rules.

And now Scott and Yang have received warning letters....

There's an Oprah meme for this, I'm sure...

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

---

I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

Man, I just saw the race. Yang is truly classless, and I like the way Duncan Scott handled (like a gentleman) the "in the face" by Yang. I wonder if at the end of the meet (or sometime shortly thereafter), Yang will give a press conference crying like Efimova did in '16, or maybe he'll get kicked out of worlds like Rasmussen got kicked out of the tour that one year.

The other races were pretty good though. The women's 100 breast was closer than I thought it would be, and in the men's 100 back, I was pulling for Grevers, but the better man won for sure.

Meanwhile, Lochte is coming off his 14 month suspension for using improper methods of receiving otherwise legal supplements. But yang is allowed to compete after smashing blood vials with a hammer.

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Yang's taunting was Roger Clemens roid rage-like against Piazza

In the youtube video I watched, I did not see anyone move during the start but the camera angle was not the best. Have you seen a video that showed clear movement by Rapsys???

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Yep, it was on the NBCSN feed and was clear. The starter for the men sucks, her cadence is too slow and has been causing many stood down heats and near false starts.

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

The vid linked in the SwimSwam article clearly showed him move slightly.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Morozov fails to advance to semis in the 100, Dressel goes 47.3 cruising into the finish, Smoliga has a suit malfunction, and the 200 fly swimoff looks like they had a gentleman’s agreement to neutralize the first 150 and sprint the last 50.

Crazy session...

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Well, that's a real bummer for Rapsys. Thanks for the info.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Somehow that video did not come up on my computer when I read that art before, but tonight it did. I can see his slight movement now but man, it was pretty slight, at least to me after watching it 4 times.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

HOLY CRAP!!! Milak completely destroyed Phelps' 200 fly WR, goes sub 1:51!!

that's a record I did not expect to see challenged this year. Wow, just wow.....

https://twitter.com/.../1153997444574826497

edit - I might have to switch to Arena suits... top 3 guys all wear them....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

And Caeleb split 49.33 on the mixed medley relay (obv with a flying start). Phelps' 100 fly record is looking more and more likely to go down too.

At least his 400IM record is safe, for now....

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Turned it on just in time for the swim off - that was fascinating! I love (watching) swim offs, and ya this one felt like there was some pre-planning!

---

KJ
Swim and Triathlon Coach
AllTerrainEndurance.com
KJ@allterrainendurance.com

What's interesting is that their semi-final splits were actually closer together across the board than their swim-off splits.

Semis: .15 .29 .16 .00
H-2-H: .37 .28 (.33) .13

Ironic that he hated swimming the 4 IM yet it may well be his longest lasting record. Also, I think Cate Campbell's 51.10 to catch Simone is probably the fastest women's 100 LCM split ever. Her catching Manuel after starting 1.25 sec behind was a Lezakian feat. I'm surprised no Aussies have pointed this out yet. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

It was a phenomenal swim by Campbell. Still shouldn't have been enough to win. Simone was both ~1/2 second slower than she split in the W4x100FR, & fairly slow off the blocks. Campbell made up 2/10ths just on the exchange.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Can't really fault Simone too much though. Better to be a little conservative than risk getting the DQ. I don't imagine they've had a lot of practice on the mixed relay exchanges, and Dressel will have a faster touch than she's used to from the women.

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You're right, not trying to put it all on Simone. 52.low is what you typically get from her, and the R/T wasn't horrible. Nothing in that relay was all that bad, but only Dressel really seemed to be completely sharp. Murphy was faster than in the 100 back, but still .6 off his best. Lilly King only matched her flat-start time with a relay exchange, but she wasn't swimming at the front in clean water like she usually is. Overall, USA was a little short of perfect, and Australia capitalized. Good on them.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Here you have a video from the race.
NBC commentators are not sure what is happening.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQPBhj7gHR4

Shorter version.

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___________________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

I love Rowdy Gaines.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

It is cool that, after all these years, Rowdy still gets super excited about swimming. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

So true; he's a real gem and fun to listen to...

Geiger is breathing to his LEFT, he has NO IDEA that Jason is moving up on him in lane 3!!!!!

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LOL! How'd you know I breathe to my left?

The shocks keep coming. Lilly King DQ'd in the 200 breast prelim for "non-simultaneous touch" at the 50 turn. Also, reigning Olympic Gold Medalist Penny Oleksiak is a healthy scratch from the 100 free.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

46.91

That’s all....

Correction, now SwimSwam is reporting that Caeleb went 46.96 in the final. Chalmers was only 0.12 behind for the silver

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Hope there were no children within earshot of her when she learned of her DQ. Sheesh, woman has a mouth that would make a truck driver blush.

ETA: Dressel.. so close! Fastest "unassisted" swim ever. And Chalmers right behind him, hopefully they both stay on form through to next summer, it will be the race of the Games.

Cody Miller really needs to do an “outtakes” video of Lilly’s potty mouth. That would be hilarious!!

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Yup, and don’t forget Blake Pieroni who went 47.8 in the final, just off the podium. The way he’s improving his 100 gives him a good shot at a medal next year.

The USA coaching staff have an interesting decision to make on the 4x1 medley, who to swim on the free leg? Do you give the finals spot to an on-fire Pieroni, or to Mr. Consistent, even though he has limited training time due to illness?

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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But you forgot about Zach Apple, who split a 46 earlier in the week. Not a decision I'd envy. I'm guessing Apple gets Prelims and a Peroni goes in Finals.

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

If you look at the 4x1 splits, it should be Apple or Pieroni if you really want to start looking forward (and win now). Apple is young, and he dropped an incredible split. Pieroni should split faster based on his flat start performance in the 100m final. I wouldn't argue with giving it to Adrian though, he's earned the right to swim it and himself had a 47-flat split. It's a tough call. If they're all going to be within .1 or .2 of each other at day's end you play the political game and let Adrian have it. It could be a whole different picture by Tokyo.

It's a good position to be in...

I didn't forget Apple, exactly. I'm just assuming that Blake would get the nod since he's swimming the individual and swam well. The big question mark is Nathan Adrian, IMO.

Big difference from 4 years ago when Adrian was holding down the fort on his own... Now the USA's gap is at the 200 distance.

How about the women's 4x2? Break the WR and still get silver!

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Couldn't have asked for anything more from the USA Ladies, the Aussies were just a smidge better. Hell of a race.

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I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html

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Couldn't have asked for anything more from the USA Ladies


Maybe a better split on Manuel's first 50m?

Her previous PB off a flat start was 1:57.01 and she led off in 1:56.09. I think she did what was hoped for and more....

If Ledecky wasn't sick, then the USA probably would've taken it.

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No shit, PB'd by nearly a full second in the same session she had a 100 free semi-final. As Rowdy said, "She did her job." Can't fault anyone's effort or execution in that relay. Australia was just that little bit better today. Can't wait to see the rematch in Tokyo. It's almost certainly going to take another World Record to win.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Yeah, there was a lot of hand wringing a few years ago about the future of the US men's 4x100 relay. But what's old is new again, and we're once again sitting on an embarrassment of riches when it comes to sprinters. Besides the guys at W/C's, you've also got Dean Farris on the rise. 2008 WR is on notice.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Ryan Lochte sittin' at home thinking he's got a shot at 2020 200IM gold. It's a slow event right now...

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good execution across the board. by my count, 4 teams set new national records (Australia, USA, Canada, Russia)… That's a pretty impressive showing.

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I saw Jordan's brother racing u23 at Gold Coast last year. It looked like he could have swam away from the field if he wanted to... he rode with the front pack on the bike and faded on the run.

Ya, I have read that Jordan Wilimovsky's brother is an up and coming elite tri guy. We'll see if he can develop his run more...

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

It would appear that Seliskar will likely swim in the 4 x 200 final since he had the fastest swim (1:45.71) of all swimmers in the morning prelims, when his flat start is taken into account. Seems the coaches will have to decide which 3 out of 4 to swim out of Dressel, Haas, Pieroni, and Apple.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Dressel already has 100 fly and 50 free semis tonight. It’ll be Haas, Pieroni, and Apple along with Seliskar.

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Good points that I had not thought of. :) Looks like it will be a shoot-out in tomorrow night's women's 800 final, as the top 6 qualifiers are within 6 sec of each other. It could be that KL was just pacing herself in the prelims and will blow it out in the final, but that seems a bit unlikely since she has been sick.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Simone does it again!!!!! Beats Campbell, Sjorstrom, Ruck, etc., and does it fairly well.

Can’t get more clutch than her. Haha...Awesome!!!

She's a clutch swimmer all right. Nathan Adrian for the women's team, just delivers when it counts.

49.50 for Dressel..... wow. just. wow......

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Americans are having a good evening session so far. 2 WR's, an American record and a Gold medal.... not too shabby at all....

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So now that the WR is out of the way and he's 1.5 up on the field, does he simply win tomorrow and go after the 50M WR?

Simone Manuel - that has to be the upset of the meet on the women's side.

And Missy Franklin's WR goes down to Regan Smith who just blew the doors off the field with a huge time drop. She gets to validate tomorrow, but 3.x seconds is sizable even if some were in cruise mode.

I can't decide if Simone's swim is an upset or not. At some point, the underdog who continually "upsets" the favourites is no longer the underdog...

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Fair point.. but Campbell and Sjoestrom? I guess it's not fair to her talent to assume she couldn't beat them. Now if she could pop relay splits like Campbell...

I can't remember what lanes everyone was in, but I think C1 had a pretty decent draft when she popped that 51.1? Lezakian…..

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Big day today. 3 WR's and 2 more on watch (M50free, W50Fly).

US Men did as well as I expected in the 4x2 - Australia just too good, and USA has a gap at that distance.

edit - and Yang (I mean China) didn't make it to the podium. Outsplit by Horton too....

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Just got to watch some of the races on youtube, Simone was awesome sneaking in where it looked like no one saw her. Now that lane one has an empty lane and there are no currents like the old days, I think it is time to consider whether it has taken over the 3, 4, and 5 lanes as fastest lane in the pool.

And hate to say it, but I think we win that 4x200 with Caleb, he is going to have to figure out a way to swim it along with all his other prelim swims. I hope he can find Phelps like endurance in that regard, that team needs him badly. And good on the Russians for paying attention and swimming on the lane line to get a draft, probably made the difference between silver and bronze..

with the mixed relays being added, I don't think there's room in his schedule, and I don't think you need him at Olympics.

Lochte is back from his suspension and apparently will be racing at US Nationals. Lets see if he has some of that old man strength. He says that he's been training all through his suspension.

Between Seliskar, Haas, Pieroni the relay at Worlds is good, it's just that the distance is a stretch for Apple. Haas was a little off this meet, but he'll be OK next year, or someone else will step up. You've got Dean Farris plus some young guys coming up. Luca Urlando will impress at Trials next year, mark my words.

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mark my words. //

No doubt, but I just have this feeling that Caleb will be the fastest guy in the world in the 200 flat start. I hope he gets a chance to prove me right. I think at the very least, he would be the fastest guy on the US team. But as you say, there will be others that may fill in enough, gonna be a hard decision for the coaches..Just got to keep him out of any relay prelim swims..

After last night, I think all the "Sky is Falling!" scuttlebut about USA Swimming can safely be put to bed, LOL!

A little disappointed in the USA 4x200 relay, but it was clearly foreshadowed. Murphy getting second in the 200 back is a bit of a bummer, but it seems like he's gearing everything towards Tokyo, and was probably not fully tapered for this meet. Other than that, it was all aces for USA. Dressel's 100 fly WR was expected, Regan Smith's destruction of the 200 back mark in the semi's a little less so. But I was most impressed by Manuel's 100 free, honestly, especially after how she was humiliated by Campbell in the Mixed Medley Relay. Simone flat SENT IT from gun in the outside lane, had a half second lead at the turn, and held most of that on the back half for a convincing wire-to-wire win. Very different than her late- close, perfect-finish-touch victories in 2016 an 2017. Sjostorm and Campbell both appeared stunned when they looked at the board after the race.

Given how she crushed the front half of that 100, I'm actually bullish on Simone's chances to double up in the 50, now.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

I think you're right, he has that potential. However, he's currently the fastest in the world at the 50free, 50 fly, and the 100's of those strokes as well. The risk is that the training to do the 200 well takes away from his 50 speed.

Now, there's no stroke 50's at the Olympics, and the 50 doesn't matter for relays, so maybe he breaks Cielo's 50 record tomorrow, drops the mic and moves to the 200 distance.... 200 free complements the 100 fly pretty well.

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If you look at the way the meet lays out at Tokyo, the only conflict the 200 free would create for him is a semi in the same session as the M4x100F final, and it looks like he'd have an hour or more in between. The 4x200 final is in the same session as the 100 free semi-final, but it looks like he'd have an hour and a half rest in between. That part of it really seems quite manageable. The bigger question, other than the one raised above regarding the training tradeoffs, is how frontloading his program with four 200 yard swims (The 200 and 4x200 come early) might affect his later events (50 free, 100 fly, Medley Relay, Mixed Relay).

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

I actually wouldn't be too worried about frontloading the program, as Caeleb always seems to get better as the meet progresses. I think it's really down to whether he and Gregg Troy can build the 200 up while keeping the explosiveness for the 50 and 100, and if they want to take that risk.

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Swimswam comments section is ridiculous. bunch of commenters talking about how she doesn't swim good relays (umm she does...) and only comes up big for individual races. Strangely, same people aren't talking the same about Caeleb who went like half a second quicker on his individual 100 free than the relay. And if you factor in the flat start, his 49.5 individual 100 fly is ever so slightly better than the 49.33 on the mixed relay. Gold Medal Mel is trying to tame that kind of stuff, but still.... ridiculous....

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If you look at the way the meet lays out at Tokyo, the only conflict the 200 free would create for him is a semi in the same session as the M4x100F //

I wasn't really suggesting that he swim the individual 200, just the one on the relay. The way I see it playing out is he does the 50/100 free, 200IM, 100fly, and all the relays if they let him, not sure if there is a max you can swim now with mixed or not. So that would be 9 events right there if allowed, dont need the 200 free. Now I have not looked at the scheduling at all for this program, but lets assume he doesnt have to swim any prelims in relays, that should be doable physically, no?

Meh.

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___________________________________________
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2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

SO got a chance to watch some more events, gotta say that Italian gal was game for a challenge, striking at your opponent when you smell weakness. She might have had a chance if she would just learn how to breath, saw here doing a "lot" of breath holding all through the race. Probably a coach that is just not hip to the new fangled air thingy.

Mixed free was interesting, not sure why the Aussies were holding back the fastest relay swimmer of all time, and at this meet!! Might have cost them the gold, would have been 100's difference for sure. More gold for Caleb, now wondering if he will add that 200IM and 200 free on the relay for the games. He seemed to fair pretty well with this schedule. It would be so hard not to swim the 200 IM, he is the fastest flier and freestyler in the world, and probably top 2 or 3 in the 50 breast. A little back a couple times a week and I think he is battling Lochte, provided Lochte is swimming up to par.

And what about Michael Andrew? He had some good 50's, was hoping to see him battle for gold in the 200IM? That 1;57 he did awhile back seemed to indicate he could be a contender for gold.. Might be an interesting race at trials with him, Lochte, Caleb, and Chase. Another case of maybe leaving two of the top 5 in the world out of the event.

Saw the news about the Aussie girl that got popped and went home, that is going to sting back home for sure. Anyone know yet what it was she got caught with?

Without a substantial overhaul of his training program, I don’t see Andrew putting together 3 quality 200s in 2 days. At this point in the meet, He’s fading in his 50’s.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

The only reason a 1:57 2IM could be considered a contender for gold right now is that the field is pretty weak compared to the last few years. Phelps retired, Lochte out, Cseh getting old and Hagino not back to 100%. Chase looked a little off his best in the 200. (Update - and just missed making the final in the 4IM, finishing 10th in prelims.)

They haven’t said what Shayna Jack was popped for, but it sounds like another possible contamination case (based on her statements anyway).

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Without a substantial overhaul of his training program, I don’t see Andrew putting together 3 quality 200s in 2 days. At this point in the meet, He’s fading in his 50’s.


Well since there are no 50's in the olympics outside of the free, why wouldn't he start training for that 200? I mean, he has already swam it just about as fast as anyone in the world right now, and as I recall, it was his first real go at the race. One would think with all that, he just might have a couple more seconds in him, and that will be a medal no doubt.


Read the article on all the swimmers getting sick, wonder who and how many were affected. One can point to a lot of obvious swims like Ledecky, but surely there are others not so obvious, and just folks toughing out a bad situation, like Katie did coming back for the 800..

Shayna jack tested positive for ligandrol. What I can tell with a quick google search, it’s a non-steroidal anabolic agent, prescription-only in Australia. There was a case of a mixed martial arts guy getting popped after taking it via contaminated supplements, but he was using “high risk” supplements.

It has a fairly long half life, of about 24-36 hours, meaning that you’ll test positive for quite a while after taking it.

Sounds to my non-expert ears that it’s pretty hard to take that particular product accidentally.

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