Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview
Quote | Reply
I put this together for my bike blog on my LBS website, thought I'd share it here as well.


Last week I had the opportunity to ride for the first time, and race, the new Ironman Canada bike course in Whistler, BC. It being such a new course, there really isn't a whole lot of information to go around on it. So to help future years of riders and athletes, I thought it would be prudent to provide a technical analysis of what athletes should expect on the course.

The route is just under the full 180km distance, and at least in 2013 was closer to about 178km. The total elevation gain is a whopping 1972 meters according to the barometric altimeter on my Garmin Edge 500. Initial accounts of the course had the total ascent pegged closer to about 1300 meters, which was a pretty gross understatement of the course's difficulty. According to Strava, the course has a number of Cat 3 and 4 climbs.

I'll say from the get go, one of the most valuable tools you can have in your inventory for a ride like this is a powermeter. I can't stress enough how important energy management is on this type of a bike course, which many seasoned triathletes have already dubbed one of the most challenging bike courses in the entire Ironman series. While the climbing may be equal to other routes like Ironman Mont Tremblant, St. George, or Couer d'alene, its the layout of the route that will get you. The vast majority of the climbing is condensed into two long ascents, one early in the route, one that'll take you right into T2. The potential to burn matches on this route is pretty high.

Secondly, even some of the strongest cyclists I know on this route opted to run 11-28 cassettes on their rigs. I ran an 11-28 with a standard crank and found myself dipping into the 60 and 70rpm ranges to try and keep around 180-200 watts, which would be about the top 1/5th of the field and set me up for a very good marathon. Anyone riding longer than 6 hours should be considering a compact crank with an 11-28 cassette. That being said, there is also quite a bit of descending on the route and the many varying grades would make a pretty good case for an 11 speed transmission. With my gearing I found myself spinning out a couple times and hitting about 76kph. The secret to this ride is being a smart cyclist, if you happen to be a very smart and strong cyclist, you'll be laughing when you hit the marathon.

A course like this also probably presents a pretty good case for aero road bikes with tri bars, but I wouldn’t’ say that you absolutely need to go there unless a road bike is your only option and you can get into a good riding position for triathlon with it.

Here's a link to my Garmin Connect file if you'd like to follow along as I go through the course.

If you prefer Trainingpeaks, here's a link to that file/workout.

The Start

The ride begins in T1 at Rainbow Park, on the shores of Alta Lake, Whistler's alpine swim venue. From km 0 to km 22 the route undulates and rolls a fair bit but ultimately descends about 160m. This is a great section to find your legs after the swim, settle your heart rate, and maybe start taking some calories in. It's a fairly easy section and athletes basically have entire lane to themselves for each direction of travel. I'm not going to say much about this section because it's pretty straightfoward.

The Callaghan Climb

This is where the real fun begins, at around km 22, you take a sharp right, hit an aid station, and begin the long ascent up Callaghan Valley road. The climb is about 13km in total with about 410m in elevation gain for an average 2.8% grade. The pitches along the climb vary from just over 0%, to a steep as about 10%. There are very few sections where it actually flattens out.

Here you'll want to hit that first aid station at the beginning of the climb and settle back into a pretty easy gear and be ready to sit up and patiently make the climb. I'll caution you here, when you've spent 6 months training for a 180km bike ride followed by a marathon, you're going to feel great 22km into a ride after tapering for two weeks. I played leap frog with so many riders who I knew weren't as strong a cyclist as me here and wanted so bad to lean over and whisper to them that they should calm down, but its not my place, it's their race. At this point in this course you should be riding very conservative and you should at least begin this climb with almost no pressure on the pedals.

The beauty of having a power meter is that it allows you to basically flatten out the course by enabling you to keep your overall wattage pretty flat. Whether you're riding uphill, downhill, or flat, you can ride at XYZ watts and know that you're remaining within your means. It was the riders with powermeters who were often getting passed here because they knew how little they had to work. Before my first Ironman, Jordan Rapp was telling us all about how to ride up Richter in Penticton, and he told us he'd often be making the climb and have other guys blasting by him, everyone wondering what was up with the pro that they just passed. Well, by the time they hit the rollers, their legs would be toast and Jordan would breeze on by. It's about riding smart, not strong.

After a little while, you hit the peak, cross the timing matt where all your friends will wonder what happened to your bike split, and begin your descent. I averaged about 20kph up this climb, and 44 kph down it. So you make up plenty of time on the descent.

Callaghan to Pemberton

From the bottom of the Callaghan descent about about km 45, to Pemberton at km 90ish, you're mostly descending, but once again, its fairly undulating and rolling terrain. Unlike the rollers at Challenge Penticton, the climbs here are short and shallow and actually make it difficult to notice you're net ascent until Whistler. After you pass through the crowds at Whistler and the area where you started, you begin the long descent down towards Pemberton. As you pass through Whistler the highway turns from the Sea to Sky highway into Highway 99, which athletes have entirely to themselves for the duration of the bike leg of the race. This is pretty awesome and one more reason to love the residents of Pemberton and Whistler, they're basically allowing you to maroon them in their communities for the better part of 10 hours.

This section is almost entirely downhill and is punctuated by only the odd brief climb. I should say however that the single steepest sustained pitch on the entire route is on this section. It's a 9% grade for almost half a km and will easily have you out of the saddle dancing your bike back and forth to keep your effort low. I kept my effort to about 210 watts here and did the climb just under 10kph, to give you an idea of just how abrupt this climb is. It seems to come out of no where, and there's no understating how important it is to just take this hill slowly and methodically.

At a number of points on this section you'll be taking advantage of whatever your biggest, baddest, and fastest gear is here. Going back to the whole powermeter thing here, if you can stick to a solid target wattage on the downhills in this section you should be able to make up a pretty decent amount of time through this section.

I'll also mention that this is a great time to take in some calories, stretch your legs and back from time to time, and look up and take in Whistler's stunning natural beauty. You're nestled in the mountains here and some of the views are truly stunning through this area.

The Pemberton Out and Back TT

At the bottom of the descent you'll pass through Pemberton around the 92km mark and pick up your special needs if you have any. From Pemberton you head north-northwest on a long flat section. It's a 50km stretch with just 4m of elevation gain through the whole thing, so its about as flat as you'll ever see. This is the only area on the entire route where the pavement left a little something to be desired. There are aid stations, porta-potties, and everything you need to recharge here.

If you've ever wanted to know what it's like to be in a time trial, this is it. It's flat and straight and you can do this section with your eyes shut if you wanted to. Through here its ever important to dial in your aero position and get small in the wind. On a course with so much up and down you're often spending a tonne of time going slowly with no aero benefit, or too fast for you to care about your aero penalty. Through this section, relax your body, allow your skeleton to support you on your bars, and think small, like an arrow piercing through the wind.

My one gripe about this section this year was the amount of drafting that I saw on the course. The Ironman draft rules are explicit, you have to leave 7m (4 bike lengths) between you and the guy in front of you, once you enter that 7m zone you're in the draft box and have 20 seconds to make the pass. And once you're in that box, you MUST make the pass. Once complete, the guy behind you is responsible for dropping out of your draft box. Since this is the only flat section where you reasonably could draft for any long period, there were a lot of athletes drafting and moving in packs. As a weak swimmer and a strong cyclist I passed about 700 riders on the 180km bike route, so I get to see a lot of riders. Through this section I was moving from one peloton to the next. Now I know that everyone is supposed to race their own race and not care about the moral decisions of others, so the cheating part of this doesn't really bother me, but the safety issues are what get me going here. Ten or twelve middle of the pack triathletes riding three abreast and 4 deep in aero bars with hands away from the brakes is a recipe for disaster and make it near to impossible for riders to safely get around them. I saw once guy go down hard, and a number of riders overlap and clip wheels and nearly take entire groups with them. Unsafe, it's just unsafe, and I would hope that next year the marshalls are strict on this.

As you come back from the 50km out and back you'll pass through Pemberton again, hopefully having made back some time for what awaits you. When you go through here, be sure to give the residents and spectators a wave and a thank you. It's by their grace that we have the entire road to ourselves, and they're stranded in Pemberton until about 6pm because of it.

The Pemberton Climb

Around the 145km mark you'll begin the climb. There's so much anticipation and hype to it I really can't think of a whole lot to say around this part. It's about a 25km ascent, often into the wind which comes out of the south. It's really the part of the ride that keeps the athlete honest. From Pemberton into T2 you'll cover about 30-something kilometers and climb over 750m. In and of itself this isn't an earth shattering climb, it's the fact that you've just ridden 150km and are about to run a marathon that makes it sort of a beast.

All I can say here is have patience. About three quarters of the total climb is spent at a 0-2% grade, but the other quarter varies between 5 and 8%. That's enough of a chunk that it'll shut you down for the run if you aren't careful. Be methodical in how you apply your efforts through this section. Let the tough guys go and be content with catching them on the run. If they blast past you and you never see them again, then they're a stronger rider than you anyways.

Like I said, this section just keeps athletes honest. There's no secret to being a good cyclist and triathlete and a strong climber other than hard work. If you do your homework, and spend time in the hills during your training rides, and mix that with a strong dose of patience on race day, you'll have no problem with this section.

Conclusion

This is the approach that I took and I was very happy with my bike split overall. Honestly, you can make up enough time on the downhill and flat sections if you ride smart that on a net basis this hill will maybe take about 20 minutes off of what youre bike split would be on another course. I ended up riding 5:50 on the bike leg of the race on a normalized average power of 180 watts, when I raced Whistler my ftp was about 280 watts. Based these numbers I nailed my goal of doing the ride at about 68-70% of my threshold and with a TSS score of about 280.

The conservative approach on this course allowed my to run a sub-4 (barely) marathon and pass 188 other athletes in the process. In my humble opinion, Iron distance triathlon racing is all about the bike. You spend more than half of your race in the saddle, and when you get out of the saddle those legs have to keep you going for another 42.2km. So you're best served to spend a lot of your training hours getting strong and smart on the bike and make that Ironman ride the easiest ride of your entire season.

The Whistler bike course is one of the most beautiful and challenging routes I've ever ridden. The residents of Whistler were simply amazing at providing support through their volunteers and their cheers on race day and they deserve a huge thanks for this. I had an amazing time racing this course and look forward to riding it again one day.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks! I've bookmarked this post and plan to read it over and over as I prepare for Whistler 2014.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Nice summary. Definitely agree that a power meter and good understanding of your goal pace is essential.

I would add/challenge a few points.

- 11sp drivetrain makes no difference to climbing or descending speed. Only difference is one more gear option in the mid range.
- aero road bikes are definitely not needed on this course. A properly fit tri bike is just as easy to climb as a road bike. The course has no technical descents, except the one switchback which is quite easy. You really want a comfy aero position for the flats.
- don't underestimate the climb from Callaghan back to whistler. Some decent sections on the 10k stretch, not a good time to ignore the power and hammer with the crowds.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Raf,
Spot on review of the course. I'm not used to riding a hilly course like this coming from Houston, TX so I was worried about how I would handle the ride. My goal NP was 200 watts (FTP was ~ 285 watts come race day). My philosophy was to ride the ascents as easily as I could (try to keep it 220W or under which was hard to do on some of the steeper climbs), coast the descents, ride the Pemberton flats at goal watts and ease up the last couple miles once we were done with the real climbing... and hope everything averaged out to where I wanted it to be.

Bike time was a shade under 5:44. My final NP was 205 watts (AP was 189W so VI was 1.08), IF=.72, TSS was about 300 (which had me worried but I was okay when running).

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Jctriguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Good point on the 11 speed drive train. You're absolutely right. I was just thinking if people were used to their normal range and wanted to add a 28 then it'd be an okay option. But you're totally right, not absolutely necessary, and honestly, given the compatibility issues 11-spd brings up, unless you have plenty of dough to shell out (which many riders here obviously do), probably not worth the upgrade. On the point of having lots of coin, I was amazed by the number of tricked out P5's I saw there. I had nothing but envy for the 60+ guy who was riding a P5 Six Di2 with Zipp 404's and Garmin Vector pedals...

As far as the aero road bike, I saw a few converted S5's out there. But for slower riders or people who don't like to spend a tonne of time on the TT bars who are in the market for a bike for a race like this, I feel like a bike like the S5 or a Venge might be a good happy medium. For any experienced rider or anyone going sub 6:30, no need for aero road bikes, but with all the ascending and descending, others might benefit from the cross breeds IMHO.

Good point on the Callaghan back to Whistler. Totally agree.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
GMAN19030 and GreatScott, thanks for the comments! Glad to hear that it was spot on/had value.

Gman, powermeters are a godsend on courses like this. Nice bike split, what were you riding out of curiosity?

There were a lot of guys out there from TX. i guess we have hills, you guys have killer heat!

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Great overview. I totally agree the power meter is essential for this course. I'd add that anyone planning on racing this course would do well to preview it prior to the race to gain a better appreciation of the Pemberton climb. The guys who passed me early in the bike on Callahan clearly didn't know to save their legs for later in the ride!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Outstanding look at the course! It is an amazing course to be sure.

I had the opportunity to ride it 3 times before the race, all in much tougher conditions. We lucked out on wind. It makes it much more difficult. Anyways, I rode without a powermeter, as I get TOO lost in numbers and prefer to race by feel. Am I leaving things out there, perhaps, but this was my plan...

Out of transition, I went hard (breathing heavy on the climb) because I wanted to be ahead of as many people as I could for that little descent. It wasn't as scary as I thought, but there were 400 less people in front of me out of the water than Penticton last year. This made it a LOT easier. I cruised down to the turnoff to Callaghan at a pretty good pace, then climbed very conservatively to the turnaround. I descended fairly aggressively, just enjoying passing people and feeling fast :) and then was fairly conservative to Whistler. I was then aggressive again to Pemberton, because I was very comfortable on the descents, and knew I could make up time without frying my legs. The flats were to be conservative and I was. The drafting was horrible, and I was caught behind the 3rd pack (I believe) and was never going to catch them. I understand your comments on safety, but part of me (the part I'm working on) thinks if they are going to cheat, and crash, that's their fault. It was blatant. From Pemberton on my goal was to go hard. Honestly, I had ridden it into headwinds twice, and I knew I could make up time. I think one person caught me going up to Pemberton, but I passed a bunch of the packs coming back.

In the end, I rode 5:18, obviously no clue about power. I also felt I could run well off a hard last 20 miles. I ran 3:20 so that was a sign for me that I am on the right track.

Cannondale Slice with compact crank and 11-25. Used it all. 11-28 with standard next time would probably be my choice for the extended downhill sections, but I was happy with gearing for the most part.

Just another idea on how to race it. Is my way right? Who knows, but really happy with plan and execution. If only I wasn't in 35-39 I would've met EVERY goal!

Brent

DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I would add that the fastest descents were from T2 to the turn up to Callaghan on 99. I think I had my top speed right before the turn...47mph.

______________________________________________

I *heart* weak, dumb ass people...
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
raflopez wrote:
I ended up riding 5:50 on the bike leg of the race on a normalized average power of 180 watts, when I raced Whistler my ftp was about 280 watts. Based these numbers I nailed my goal of doing the ride at about 68-70% of my threshold and with a TSS score of about 280.


GMAN19030 wrote:
Bike time was a shade under 5:44. My final NP was 205 watts (AP was 189W so VI was 1.08), IF=.72, TSS was about 300.

I'm always amazed when I see these numbers. I just completed my second tri-season, and my first riding with power. So, still very much in the learning phase. I averaged 198W, with NP of 210W, at Penticton for a bike split of 5:56. Riding a Scott Plasma 2, with Flo 60/90 and an aero helmet. My position is a typical MOP 40-44; a bit high and could be better, could be worse. I was aero throughout the day, except when climbing. I raced at 178lbs. How do you (I) ride a 5:50 on a tougher course at 180W?

Scott
Last edited by: GreatScott: Aug 31, 13 13:39
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Probably power to weight ratio. I was ~150lbs on race morning. FTP is 270. I averaged 176watts and came in at 5:41.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Love the review RAF,

I read everything about this course before coming out from NH and made sure every ride all summer had well over 1000 feet vertical for every 20 miles. I also rode from the Village to the top of Callahan on Thursday so I would feel comfortable through the entire first part of the race. When I left T1 I knew that this was my best shot yet at Kona having done a good swim for me at 1:12 and feeling real good. Even so I watched the power like a hawk and got passed constantly on the uphills but kept the power on steady at all times. I sailed past folks on the flats and downhills. My new P5 really helped as well and this was the first time I raced with the Supersonic tires. Man those things are fast. Heading back from Pemberton I even remarked to a few of those passing me like I was standing still that I was going to take my time because I planned to run fast. I also did not like the big packs. I caught one near the turnaround and since I refuse to draft I went round them and a few miles later a guy comes up to me and asks me if I knew that I was dragging 40 guys down the road. I laughed and said something about being the old guy. (I'm 53 and the pack was mostly 30 something's.)
The one thing about this course I would like to let folks know about is that on the way back to Whistler there is a downhill that really needs to be ridden with caution. I should have paid more attention when we climbed it but it is a serious S turn and I went into it too fast. The P5 has great brakes though and handles like a dream so I was fine.
The ride was about 5:31 which I was VERY happy with but by being so diligent avoiding power spikes I was able to run 3:41 and get my first Kona slot. Anyone trying to find the best IM venue on the planet should seriously consider this race.

Carl Hefflefinger
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
178lbs....

______________________________________________

I *heart* weak, dumb ass people...
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Raf and gman-

Was wondering if you could share your weight on race day or watts/kg for your bike split? Just trying to get a better feel of what will be needed in 2014.

Thanks!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [heffle] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
heffle wrote:
The one thing about this course I would like to let folks know about is that on the way back to Whistler there is a downhill that really needs to be ridden with caution. I should have paid more attention when we climbed it but it is a serious S turn and I went into it too fast. The P5 has great brakes though and handles like a dream so I was fine.

Carl Hefflefinger

To be fair to the race organizers, there were two or three volunteers plus signage there. But yes, the toilet bowl is the only time I used my brakes outside of the turnarounds and the finish in town.

Congrats on Kona qualifying! AWESOME job!

Brent

DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
raflopez wrote:
On the point of having lots of coin, I was amazed by the number of tricked out P5's I saw there. I had nothing but envy for the 60+ guy who was riding a P5 Six Di2 with Zipp 404's and Garmin Vector pedals...

The last guy out of the water (he didn't finish the bike) was riding a P5-6 loaded down with gels, bento box and what looked like 3 tubes!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
raflopez wrote:
Good point on the 11 speed drive train. You're absolutely right. I was just thinking if people were used to their normal range and wanted to add a 28 then it'd be an okay option. But you're totally right, not absolutely necessary, and honestly, given the compatibility issues 11-spd brings up, unless you have plenty of dough to shell out (which many riders here obviously do), probably not worth the upgrade. On the point of having lots of coin, I was amazed by the number of tricked out P5's I saw there. I had nothing but envy for the 60+ guy who was riding a P5 Six Di2 with Zipp 404's and Garmin Vector pedals...

As far as the aero road bike, I saw a few converted S5's out there. But for slower riders or people who don't like to spend a tonne of time on the TT bars who are in the market for a bike for a race like this, I feel like a bike like the S5 or a Venge might be a good happy medium. For any experienced rider or anyone going sub 6:30, no need for aero road bikes, but with all the ascending and descending, others might benefit from the cross breeds IMHO.

Good point on the Callaghan back to Whistler. Totally agree.


I wouldn't dismiss the 11s option quite so quickly. I usually ride compact plus 12-25 10s. For this, as I put aeros and bar end shifters on, I decided to move to 11s. With Campy the 12-27 is the 12-25 plus a 27. That suited me fine, as it gave an extra sprocket (which i used a lot) but allowed me to keep a max of a two tooth increment on the cassette. Had I gone for > 25 with 10s, I would have ended up with a 3 tooth jump, which I would not have liked.

As for aero road vs tri, I tricked out my SLC-SL: switched the seat post head, Adamo saddle, -6 to -17 degree stem with 1cm reduction, plus a Vuka front end and a disc cover at the back. For me this gave a very comfortable yet fairly low set up which I could hold for most of the ride and maintained some resemblance to my road bike feel (though handling took some getting used to). I'd count myself as an experienced road rider, went 5:47 in the 45-49 Ag with ave power of 169W at 169lbs. So I guess I fit your "no road bike" profile anyway.
Last edited by: Greg66: Aug 31, 13 16:15
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [instigator] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
On race day I was 157lbs give or take a pound, 180 watts NP, 176 watts average I think.

Was riding a trek speed concept 9 with zipp 404's, Rudy project wingspan, decent aero position but not super aggressive.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeah I was one of those guys with a tricked out P5 but life is about choices and until 10 years ago I did not swim and didn't own a bike. I worked 70 to 80 hours a week building a business and just running road races because that's all I had time for. Now I spend half my time working and half my time training and couldn't be happier with the life balance.

We live in a geat country (whether you live in Canada or US) that allows us to make these choices and accomplish just about anything.

Funny about the last guy out of the water though. I kept an old aluminum Elite bike for 9 years until I thought my triathlon strength was good enough to not be "that guy".
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Greg66] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
5:47 on 169 watts is pretty awesome. I think you've got To have the quickest split on that power range here.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ha! That made me pull the file into WKO and check. 189, not 169 average; NP 209. Maybe a few too many power spikes in there for my own good.

My bad on the 169. Apologies.
Last edited by: Greg66: Aug 31, 13 15:57
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Greg66] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Haha I was thinking you must have bought one one if those Cervelo TestTeam Speedsuits for $50 at the expo tent.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
If I had thought it would have given me 10 minutes, I would have!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
raflopez wrote:
GMAN19030 and GreatScott, thanks for the comments! Glad to hear that it was spot on/had value.

Gman, powermeters are a godsend on courses like this. Nice bike split, what were you riding out of curiosity?

There were a lot of guys out there from TX. i guess we have hills, you guys have killer heat!

My 2011 Trek Speed Concept 9.9. It was its final voyage as my 2014 Trek SC came in this week.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [instigator] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
instigator wrote:
Raf and gman-

Was wondering if you could share your weight on race day or watts/kg for your bike split? Just trying to get a better feel of what will be needed in 2014.

Thanks!

I was about 165 lbs on race day.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
PeteDin206 wrote:
raflopez wrote:
On the point of having lots of coin, I was amazed by the number of tricked out P5's I saw there. I had nothing but envy for the 60+ guy who was riding a P5 Six Di2 with Zipp 404's and Garmin Vector pedals...


The last guy out of the water (he didn't finish the bike) was riding a P5-6 loaded down with gels, bento box and what looked like 3 tubes!

I saw that bike in transition.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I think for stronger riders the 11 is more important than the 28.

I went with 11-25 in Wistler and there was only that one switchback hill on the way to Pemberton that I felt like I needed another gear and that was over in 30 seconds anyway.

I was first AGer out of Pemberton, and 2nd into T2 and I used the 11 a lot. its essential for this course to be ridden fast IMO. I have always been of the opinion that they should provide an 11 with every power meter. If you are reducing your efforts up the hills all the time, but not increasing them on the downhills, then the pM might be making you slower!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
A friend of mine betteredgertime from IMC from 2years ago by1 hour and qualified for Kona. Very excited for her.

On Power, I can understand maintaining on uphill
but how do you manage on downhill?

Thanks

Cervelo R3 and Cannondale Synapse, Argon18 Electron Track Bike
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Interesting, I rode a 5:38 on 186w AP/208w NP at ~170lbs.

Cannondale Slice with HED Jet 5s w/cover + Zipp Vuka Cockpit. Looks like this:

Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [cervelo-van] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Just ride my biggest gear at target wattage until I run out of gears. So like the previous poster said, the 11 tooth cog is probably just as important as a 28 on this course. Could make up a tonne of time having the right gear for the descents here.

At the penticton course when you hit the rollers you end up playing leap frog with riders pushing up the hills then just coasting down the other side. Makes way more sense to try and keep the target watts up the ascents and putting down whatever your gearing will allow as close as possible to target wattage on the other side. You often end up getting repassed on the ascents for the first little while, but by the end of the ride you'll often end up ahead.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [owen.] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
owen. wrote:
Interesting, I rode a 5:38 on 186w AP/208w NP at ~170lbs.

Cannondale Slice with HED Jet 5s w/cover + Zipp Vuka Cockpit. Looks like this:


My moving time was exactly the same as your's. I stopped twice... once to re-lube and pee and once to pee and let a peloton pack get a couple of minutes away from me as I didn't want to play their game.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Last edited by: GMAN19030: Sep 1, 13 16:22
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
So I was one of the slower bikers(life happens) but did any one get stung by any massive stinging insects? I got stung/hit just above the right corner of my glasses coming past the special needs bags area the 2nd time just before the aid station in Pemberton and before the climb? My right side of face was swollen and had a black eye from it.



Russell

Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [russllmar] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
That happened to me 3 days before the race on the lip. Not fun.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [russllmar] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
My training partner got one of these on these on the left thigh, through his shorts I think, 4 days pre race. Huge swelling.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [russllmar] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I got stung somewhere about halfway back to Pemberton on the flats. I'm always amazed at how those little buggers can get a sting off when they just bounce off you at high speed. I still have a swollen spot on my finger.

Carl
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [heffle] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I got stung on both hands in almost the same spot on each hand.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [russllmar] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yup, got stung once two days before the race at Rainbow Park (caught the little bugger in the process and pulled him and his stinger off me). And then twice on the ride, once descending towards Pemberton, once on the out and back from Pemberton. Both those times they flew in through the neck of my jersey and stung me by my HR monitor. Just grabbed the spot where I felt the sting through my shirt and crushed whatever was in my hand. Ugh.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [TriZag] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
            
GreatScott wrote:
raflopez wrote:
I ended up riding 5:50 on the bike leg of the race on a normalized average power of 180 watts, when I raced Whistler my ftp was about 280 watts. Based these numbers I nailed my goal of doing the ride at about 68-70% of my threshold and with a TSS score of about 280.


GMAN19030 wrote:
Bike time was a shade under 5:44. My final NP was 205 watts (AP was 189W so VI was 1.08), IF=.72, TSS was about 300.


I'm always amazed when I see these numbers. I just completed my second tri-season, and my first riding with power. So, still very much in the learning phase. I averaged 198W, with NP of 210W, at Penticton for a bike split of 5:56. Riding a Scott Plasma 2, with Flo 60/90 and an aero helmet. My position is a typical MOP 40-44; a bit high and could be better, could be worse. I was aero throughout the day, except when climbing. I raced at 178lbs. How do you (I) ride a 5:50 on a tougher course at 180W?

Scott


TriZag wrote:
Probably power to weight ratio. I was ~150lbs on race morning. FTP is 270. I averaged 176watts and came in at 5:41.


I see bike splits on this thread of 5:40 - 5:50 at Whistler with average power of 175w - 190w. For example:
5:25 at 214w and 172lbs (1.25) - Jctriguy
5:30 at 202w and 165lbs (1.22) - Coopdog
5:38 at 186w and 170lbs (1.09 w/lb) - Owen
5:41 at 176w and 150lbs (1.17) - TriZag
5:44 at 189w and 165lbs (1.15) - GMAN
5:47 at 189w and 169lbs (1.12) - Greg66
5:50 at 176w and 157lbs (1.12) - Raf

My 5:56 at 198w and 178lbs (1.11) at Penticton leaves me scratching my head, wondering what I am missing. Perhaps Whistler and Penticton are comparable after all?

Note: edit to add subsequent entries.
Last edited by: GreatScott: Sep 1, 13 15:53
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
GreatScott wrote:
I see bike splits on this thread of 5:40 - 5:50 at Whistler with average power of 175w - 190w. For example:
5:38 at 186w and 170lbs (1.09 w/lb) - Owen
5:41 at 176w and 150lbs (1.17) - TriZag
5:44 at 189w and 165lbs (1.15) - GMAN
5:47 at 189w and 169lbs (1.12) - Greg66
5:50 at 176w and 157lbs (1.12) - Raf

My 5:56 at 198w and 178lbs (1.11) at Penticton leaves me scratching my head, wondering what I am missing. Perhaps Whistler and Penticton are comparable after all?

There is a lot more to it than just power-weight ratio,, and people usually use w/kg, makes the numbers seem bigger ;)

Position is a huge factor over 5-6 hrs racing. How you move around to drink and eat can make a difference. Did you stop at special needs, or blast through all the aid stations? At 178lbs, you are likely on the larger side compared to the other riders, either taller or 'thicker'. Times at Whistler might be faster due to the drafting, even for those of us that didn't draft. You get a boost every time you pass someone, 20-30 secs to follow their draft. If you pass 50 people in the ride, you can spend up to 25min in the draft. Penticton would have had less drafting due to the smalle field size. Whistler was also 2-2.5km short of 180km, adds ~4min to all of our times.

Also, can't forget the difference between power meters. Some might not be calibrated properly. Some just read higher than others.

I was 5:25 (including 2min stop). 214 ap, 231 np (1.08 VI). ~172lbs on race day, 1.25 w/lbs (2.75 w/kg).
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Jctriguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thank you; this helps. Fwiw, I have a muscular build and an average position. I held that position all day unless climbing. Lots of solitude on the flats.......one rider 30 meters in front, another 30 meters behind.

And yes, I gotta start thinking in metric.

Scott

Ps - those are fantastic numbers you put up, nice job! Gives me hope for the >170 crowd.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Nice roundup of the bike splits. Cool to see the different data points between riders. I'll add in that I did stop to use the loo on the Pemberton out and back. So my moving time on the garmin wa 5:47ish, but my split time was 5:50 overall. Puts me right there with Greg66.

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Raf thanks for your description. I will make sure I keep a copy of this for my attempt at IM Whistler next year.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [avagoyamug] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
avagoyamug wrote:
I think for stronger riders the 11 is more important than the 28.

I went with 11-25 in Wistler and there was only that one switchback hill on the way to Pemberton that I felt like I needed another gear and that was over in 30 seconds anyway.

I was first AGer out of Pemberton, and 2nd into T2 and I used the 11 a lot. its essential for this course to be ridden fast IMO. I have always been of the opinion that they should provide an 11 with every power meter. If you are reducing your efforts up the hills all the time, but not increasing them on the downhills, then the pM might be making you slower!

Interesting point about the 11. As a point of reference, at IMLP, I can't think of a single place where you need the 11. The downhills are so steep that whether you have an 11 or 12 is irrelevent....you'd be coasting. At IM Tremblant (and 70.3 Tremblant) there are many gradual downhills where I felt that I could have used an 11. As a point of reference, I found a 12-28 10 speed Tiagara cassette on a 50-34, riding a Quarq at 185-188W range for my 2 IM's recently (which was right above 3W per kilo effort). If I was on a standard crank with 53 tooth, I don't think I'd need an 11. I might just flip over to an SRAM chain and 11-28 cassette for next year at Whistler based on what you are saying. It will probably help me at Tremblant...in fact, maybe I should do that before Kona too as the 50-12 has often felt too "small" for the downhill from Hawi with the tailwind.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'll throw mine in:

5:30 split @ 202 watts

165ilbs, 2009 P2, FC 404 front, FC 808 rear with aero helmet.

______________________________________________

I *heart* weak, dumb ass people...
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
raflopez wrote:
Nice roundup of the bike splits. Cool to see the different data points between riders. I'll add in that I did stop to use the loo on the Pemberton out and back. So my moving time on the garmin wa 5:47ish, but my split time was 5:50 overall. Puts me right there with Greg66.

Yes, interesting to see the results relative to weight/power. I added a few late entries to the table. It all makes sense now, with just the one outlier in our little sample.

Scott
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
5h01 bike time, no power meter, 58 kg (128lbs); 176,5 km on my odometer. The course didn't have the full 180 km.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Great data, the guys next year will love this... although the wind will make future comparisons useless.

I rode completely legal in Pemberton, although the 7m rule helps. I also only made one ~30 second stop at special needs and only slowed down for one aid station.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [owen.] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Just to be sure, is everyone going on Normalized power or average power?
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Anyone else find the course to be 177K? My computer was close to each of the 20K splits including at 160K, but ended up showing 177K.

I think the last 20K section was actually 17k.


-----------------------------------------------------------
"No more hurting people - Peace"
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [bmas] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yes, everyone is in the 177-178 range
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
devashish_paul wrote:
avagoyamug wrote:
I think for stronger riders the 11 is more important than the 28.

I went with 11-25 in Wistler and there was only that one switchback hill on the way to Pemberton that I felt like I needed another gear and that was over in 30 seconds anyway.

I was first AGer out of Pemberton, and 2nd into T2 and I used the 11 a lot. its essential for this course to be ridden fast IMO. I have always been of the opinion that they should provide an 11 with every power meter. If you are reducing your efforts up the hills all the time, but not increasing them on the downhills, then the pM might be making you slower!


Interesting point about the 11. As a point of reference, at IMLP, I can't think of a single place where you need the 11. The downhills are so steep that whether you have an 11 or 12 is irrelevent....you'd be coasting. At IM Tremblant (and 70.3 Tremblant) there are many gradual downhills where I felt that I could have used an 11. As a point of reference, I found a 12-28 10 speed Tiagara cassette on a 50-34, riding a Quarq at 185-188W range for my 2 IM's recently (which was right above 3W per kilo effort). If I was on a standard crank with 53 tooth, I don't think I'd need an 11. I might just flip over to an SRAM chain and 11-28 cassette for next year at Whistler based on what you are saying. It will probably help me at Tremblant...in fact, maybe I should do that before Kona too as the 50-12 has often felt too "small" for the downhill from Hawi with the tailwind.




It's an interesting discussion. If you reach 'coasting velosity' on a descent does that mean the gearing/time it took to reach that velocity does not matter? And surely if you have 11 'coasting velocity' is higher and you can keep the strain on the chain for longer before spinning out. Also I don't like to ride at higher than 90rpm for very long if at all on IM race day. Still maybe a physics guy can disprove all this.
Last edited by: avagoyamug: Sep 2, 13 16:46
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [bmas] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
bmas wrote:
Anyone else find the course to be 177K? My computer was close to each of the 20K splits including at 160K, but ended up showing 177K.

I rode the course Friday prior to the race and had it at a little over 110 miles.

I think they could have moved the flat section out 1 mile and made it spot on.


Bruce
ALBOPADS XTERRAWETSUITS NEWTON OAKLEY FIZIK GARMIN ROTOR COMPUTRAINER QUARQ HONEYSTINGER
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [antonbp] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
antonbp wrote:
bmas wrote:
Anyone else find the course to be 177K? My computer was close to each of the 20K splits including at 160K, but ended up showing 177K.


I rode the course Friday prior to the race and had it at a little over 110 miles.

I think they could have moved the flat section out 1 mile and made it spot on.

They would have to pave another mile to do that. Pavement ended at the turnaround.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [dstu] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
dstu wrote:
antonbp wrote:
bmas wrote:
Anyone else find the course to be 177K? My computer was close to each of the 20K splits including at 160K, but ended up showing 177K.


I rode the course Friday prior to the race and had it at a little over 110 miles.

I think they could have moved the flat section out 1 mile and made it spot on.


They would have to pave another mile to do that. Pavement ended at the turnaround.

I rode it Friday and there was brand new pavement at the turn around, so they could have taken it a little further out. I do not know how much further. It looked like at least a mile.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [antonbp] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
antonbp wrote:
I rode it Friday and there was brand new pavement at the turn around, so they could have taken it a little further out. I do not know how much further. It looked like at least a mile.

Are you sure you rode to the same turnaround we used on race day? The road curved off about 300m after the turnaround, not sure how you could tell how far ahead it was paved without riding it? Seems strange that they would've not bothered to extend the course to a ful 180km if they had available road left.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [avagoyamug] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
My last 5 Ironmans my cadence has not averaged more than 80-81 RPM and this does not include coasting zeros. I am not a high RPM rider, but not low RPM either. 11 might be useful for Whistler....or perhaps just give away seconds each time reaching coasting velocity and start coasting early as doing zero watts is a good investment for the run. Also I think for a smaller rider (I am 137) we don't gain that much pushing at a certain point because our brute watts to Cda is generally not that favourable, whereas, I have found doing climbs at half IM race pace in an Ironman generally leads to faster bike splits with no impact on the run (keep in mind that on the false flats and false flat downhills, it is possible to go pretty fast at lower than IM target watts).

I have found that the general pacing guidelines are likely based on the sample size of powermeter users that respresents the bulk of athletes, they being in the 150-180 lb range. I am not sure that those pacing guidelines give an optimal time for the 110-140 lb riders who end up giving away some gains on the climbs where watts per kilo is their big advantage...on the false flats for riders of this size, Watts per Cda are generally bad compared to larger riders, so there is no point riding the courses with the same tactics.

Sure, don't do stupid things like climb at 100-110% FTP, but not sure that riding 70-75 FTP on climbs, flats and gradual downhills gives the best result for the smalller riders, who might benefit from some more variability index given how physics helps/hurts them at different parts of the course. If we ride like bigger guys we give away our advantage and then we ride like bigger guys when we have a disadvantage.

Anyway, might be an interesting study....take the power files of a bunch of small men and women and see what set of tactics lead to an optimal outcome. Also not sure if the NP construct has the same physiological impact on smaller riders versus larger riders. Smaller runners are able to run with more pace variations and accelerations with less downside than bigger ones.

Dev
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [coopdog] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Throwing my numbers in, although they are nowhere near as impressive as the others, and don't explain my massive blowup on the run as I clearly did not go hard enough. Also makes me question my tested ftp (computrainer, 20' and 5' protocol, coached, tesed in July at 300... allegedly).

185 lbs/84 kg, 6:04 (moving time of 6:00 plus pee stops), AP 168, NP 188, TSS 247, IF .62, VI 1.13.

I'd say "damn, I rode that conservatively, my run must have been fantastic." It was through 7 for me then downhill from there. I think it was nutition/hydration. I'd like to try IM again to try to figure out this run thing, but so much can go wrong in a 17 hour day, and it takes so much time and energy to prep for one.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [ChrisM] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I can add my numbers as well:

Height 6'3"
Weight 182lbs;
Time: 5h 40' 54"
Avg Pwr: 149w
Max Avg Pwr (20') 164w
NP 172W
Avg HR 118

The power numbers are from a PowerCal so I have no idea if they have any meaning whatsoever - but I sure like the extra pretty coloured line in the charts when I download the data!

I also was attacked by a stinging insect the size of a large dog that almost caused me to crash on the Pemberton Meadows section. I was stung on the inner thigh and the swelling lasted at least a week and stretched from groin to knee. On the positive side the fear of dying from a crash and later from an anaphylactic reaction kept my heart rate up!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [mlawless] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Interesting numbers, I'm having a discussion on BT with a few experienced racers, and they were questioning whether the PM was working (it seems it was) as the ave watts for guys of our size is fairly low for the times. Yours are even better, lower AP/NP faster time.

I wish I "ran" like I only rode 168 ap
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [ChrisM] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
ChrisM wrote:
Interesting numbers, I'm having a discussion on BT with a few experienced racers, and they were questioning whether the PM was working (it seems it was) as the ave watts for guys of our size is fairly low for the times. Yours are even better, lower AP/NP faster time.


I was keeping track earlier in the thread and saw a pattern that made sense to me. Gotta wonder about the outliers.

GreatScott wrote:

5:25 at 214w and 172lbs (1.25) - Jctriguy
5:30 at 202w and 165lbs (1.22) - Coopdog
5:38 at 186w and 170lbs (1.09) - Owen
5:41 at 176w and 150lbs (1.17) - TriZag
5:44 at 189w and 165lbs (1.15) - GMAN
5:47 at 189w and 169lbs (1.12) - Greg66
5:50 at 176w and 157lbs (1.12) - Raf
Last edited by: GreatScott: Sep 6, 13 15:31
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeah, I posted that list over there, for reference points, and it raised eyebrows about whether my PM was working. apparently the file's been run through WKO (I guess, that's above my pay grade) and the PM seems OK.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [mlawless] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mlawless wrote:
I can add my numbers as well:

Height 6'3"
Weight 182lbs;
Time: 5h 40' 54"
Avg Pwr: 149w
Max Avg Pwr (20') 164w
NP 172W
Avg HR 118

The power numbers are from a PowerCal so I have no idea if they have any meaning whatsoever - but I sure like the extra pretty coloured line in the charts when I download the data!

I also was attacked by a stinging insect the size of a large dog that almost caused me to crash on the Pemberton Meadows section. I was stung on the inner thigh and the swelling lasted at least a week and stretched from groin to knee. On the positive side the fear of dying from a crash and later from an anaphylactic reaction kept my heart rate up!

That's a heck of a time given your metrics and your size. You must have drafted the whole time! ;-)

I also was bit by some insect on both wrists in almost the identical spot on each. I think they have black flies the size of small birds up there. I still have the bite marks and it has been 12 days.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [ChrisM] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
ChrisM wrote:
185 lbs/84 kg, 6:04 (moving time of 6:00 plus pee stops), AP 168, NP 188, TSS 247, IF .62, VI 1.13.

Your VI of 1.13 probably didn't help your run. Were you riding a compact and coasting down the hills?

My numbers were:

5:18
176.93km
NP 204
AP 190
VI 1.07
TSS 243

170 lbs
6'2"
Cervelo P2
Hed tri spoke front, disc cover back
Torpedo bottle, two bentos

Graham Barron Design: Custom west coast house design http://www.grahambarron.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [rhet0ric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rhet0ric wrote:
ChrisM wrote:

185 lbs/84 kg, 6:04 (moving time of 6:00 plus pee stops), AP 168, NP 188, TSS 247, IF .62, VI 1.13.


Your VI of 1.13 probably didn't help your run. Were you riding a compact and coasting down the hills?

My numbers were:

5:18
176.93km
NP 204
AP 190
VI 1.07
TSS 243

170 lbs
6'2"
Cervelo P2
Hed tri spoke front, disc cover back
Torpedo bottle, two bentos


Pretty much, and a 12-30. Then add the climbs during the descents, tried to shift early and soft pedal those. The VI is frankly in line with all my training rides (which simulated the whislter course and were 1.11 - 1.15) and it was something my coach has been trying to get me to fix. Not very successfully. I actually lapped each of the big segments, the VI was pretty bad in the Alta to Callaghan, Callaghan descent, and Whislter - Pemberton descent sections. The rest were 1.05 ish
Last edited by: ChrisM: Sep 6, 13 16:04
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Drafting? What is this drafting that you speak of?

I certainly tried as hard as I could to stay 1/2 a bike length back from my front wheel - and was moderately successful - I think there was only one time that I overtook my front wheel too slowly - but I think the front wheel was blocking me!


I think the heart rate was actually a bit of a problem. I was targetting about 125bpm but after the race it was clear that the last hour my HR was gradually falling and I fell apart at 17k on the run - it took about 10k of gorging at Aid Stations to be able to get back to running. The problem in retrospect was that the Ironman drink I planned to use was horrible and I replaced it with water without adding more calories from elsewhere. Of course, at the time my cognitive capacity was too reduced to comprehend that issue and deal with it on the bike.

Luckily it still ended with a PR race and I was ahead of my best predicted time with a finish of 11h 52' - a solid MOP result (especially as it was my 3rd swim of the year!)
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [ChrisM] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
ChrisM wrote:
Pretty much, and a 12-30. Then add the climbs during the descents, tried to shift early and soft pedal those. The VI is frankly in line with all my training rides (which simulated the whislter course and were 1.11 - 1.15) and it was something my coach has been trying to get me to fix. Not very successfully. I actually lapped each of the big segments, the VI was pretty bad in the Alta to Callaghan, Callaghan descent, and Whislter - Pemberton descent sections. The rest were 1.05 ish

For interest's sake, I did my first two training rides on a compact and 11-25. My VI for those rides were 1.09 and 1.11. I found I was spinning out on the compact even on the rolling hill sections, never mind the steeper descents. With a 50-12 you must have been spinning out all the time.

Then I switched to a 53-39 and 11-28. My third training ride was VI 1.05. On race day I was 1.07. What I found was that the 53-11 allowed me to pedal down the hills and even out my variability. I passed a lot of people on the descents. 39-28 and 34-25 are nearly identical for climbing.

Even with a VI of 1.07 I was still too spikey on race day (too much max power over FTP), got caught up in the excitement I guess, and it hurt my run. I was okay for the first 10km but slowed down after that.

Graham Barron Design: Custom west coast house design http://www.grahambarron.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Jctriguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jctriguy wrote:
antonbp wrote:

I rode it Friday and there was brand new pavement at the turn around, so they could have taken it a little further out. I do not know how much further. It looked like at least a mile.


Are you sure you rode to the same turnaround we used on race day? The road curved off about 300m after the turnaround, not sure how you could tell how far ahead it was paved without riding it? Seems strange that they would've not bothered to extend the course to a ful 180km if they had available road left.

The pavement ended at the turnaround. The new pavement paved over the old road. To extend it presumably would have been a bigger more expensive job, as they would have had to make new sub-road. (Not sure what the technical term is).

Graham Barron Design: Custom west coast house design http://www.grahambarron.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [rhet0ric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rhet0ric wrote:
ChrisM wrote:

Pretty much, and a 12-30. Then add the climbs during the descents, tried to shift early and soft pedal those. The VI is frankly in line with all my training rides (which simulated the whislter course and were 1.11 - 1.15) and it was something my coach has been trying to get me to fix. Not very successfully. I actually lapped each of the big segments, the VI was pretty bad in the Alta to Callaghan, Callaghan descent, and Whislter - Pemberton descent sections. The rest were 1.05 ish


For interest's sake, I did my first two training rides on a compact and 11-25. My VI for those rides were 1.09 and 1.11. I found I was spinning out on the compact even on the rolling hill sections, never mind the steeper descents. With a 50-12 you must have been spinning out all the time.

Then I switched to a 53-39 and 11-28. My third training ride was VI 1.05. On race day I was 1.07. What I found was that the 53-11 allowed me to pedal down the hills and even out my variability. I passed a lot of people on the descents. 39-28 and 34-25 are nearly identical for climbing.

Even with a VI of 1.07 I was still too spikey on race day (too much max power over FTP), got caught up in the excitement I guess, and it hurt my run. I was okay for the first 10km but slowed down after that.


Yeah, I went to a compact when I weight quite a bit more. I am a fairly decent biker, but was a bit nervous hearing the stories going in about the hills, so i left the compact on. In retrospect, I probably could have gone standard, or maybe a mid compact for next season. I'm new to how the power dramtically affects the run, and the ways to avoid that.
Last edited by: ChrisM: Sep 6, 13 16:54
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
The PowerCal he used is heartrate strap with derived power. I wouldn't be too confident in the totals for a course like Whistler.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [SummitAK] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
SummitAK wrote:
The PowerCal he used is heartrate strap with derived power. I wouldn't be too confident in the totals for a course like Whistler.

Gotcha.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [rhet0ric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
What'd you swim? Powertap or Quarq/SRM?

Damn near identical setups and power numbers and you're 20min faster than me! Not saying you were in a pack... but I'd sure like to ride 20min faster on the same watts.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Excellent course description, but people have been doing bike courses with extensive climbing well before power meters existed. I'm not saying power meters can't be a useful tool, but jeez, it's quite possible to gauge your effort without one. It's just a matter of training intelligently with course length and elevation in mind. I disagree with the notion that if you're lousy at pacing you need to spend a lot of money to correct it.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [TriBiker] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
TriBiker wrote:
Excellent course description, but people have been doing bike courses with extensive climbing well before power meters existed. I'm not saying power meters can't be a useful tool, but jeez, it's quite possible to gauge your effort without one. It's just a matter of training intelligently with course length and elevation in mind. I disagree with the notion that if you're lousy at pacing you need to spend a lot of money to correct it.

A power meter helps you in training and racing. It helps you develop better pacing by giving feedback in addition to your perceived effort. It obviously isn't a requirement, but it certainly helps.

The general argument that 'people did X long before long before Y existed' is relatively pointless. Merckx was fast without power meters or 11sp electric shifting bikes, so what! He would have been faster with modern technology, hence the reason why they banned superbikes in the hour record.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Jctriguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
"..It obviously isn't a requirement, but it certainly helps."

Isn't that what I said..?

"The general argument that 'people did X long before long before Y existed' is relatively pointless. Merckx was fast without power meters or 11sp electric shifting bikes, so what! He would have been faster with modern technology, hence the reason why they banned superbikes in the hour record."

Clearly technology has made athletes faster. No argument there. But we sure don't all need to rush out to buy $1500 solutions to our pacing problems.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [TriBiker] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Sorry, guess I missed the point of your post. You agree with the OP that power meters can be a valuable tool.

PS. Power meters are as low as $700 for a new model and even less for a used model. No need to continue thinking they are super exotic, high end parts. Most people would easily drop that on a set of race wheels that might only save 5min in an IM, yet a power meter and proper pacing might save upwards of an hour for some people.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [owen.] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
owen. wrote:
What'd you swim? Powertap or Quarq/SRM?

Damn near identical setups and power numbers and you're 20min faster than me! Not saying you were in a pack... but I'd sure like to ride 20min faster on the same watts.

Powertap. My swim was 1:13 and my T1 was 6 minutes (potty break), so I came out of T1 behind a large number of faster swimmers / slow cyclists. I was constantly passing people up until just before Pemberton, so a lot of sling-shotting. I wasn't in one of those peletons on the Pemberton flats but did get into some unavoidable drafting.

Graham Barron Design: Custom west coast house design http://www.grahambarron.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [raflopez] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks for the review! I am 6'0, 163 lbs and Whistler 2014 will be my first IM. I'm probably an average cyclist, ideally around 6 hours.
I have a P3 with 53/39 front and 11-25 rear right now which is fine for undulating terrain...
For Whistler would you suggest getting a 12-27 in the rear (keeping front same) or getting a compact 52/36 or 50/34 in the front while keeping the rear the same? Or some other variation?
Thanks!!
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [simplymax] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Honestly I think that going to a 12-27 ought to make the course manageable but your cadence may dip a little lower than it should. I don't think you're going to go wrong going to a 50/34 on the front with the same cassette you have now. 50-11 will be a good gear for descending false flats and 34-25 will be a good gear to have in your pocket when you're making the long climbs, especially the last climb into whistler.

The major descents are so long and steep that you'll probably spin out no matter what you run, so I think your gear choice is going to pay off a lot more if you run ratios catered to the climbs.

Just my two cents. Are you using a power meter?

Raf
http://www.shutuplegs.org
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [simplymax] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
My first IM as well abd I'm planning on riding a 52/36 with a 12/27 cassette... I'm a bit bigger at 6'3" and hopefully down to 182-185 (195 right now). I rode Lake Stevens in a 2:34 last year and hope to ride Whistler in the 5:30s if conditions are good...
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
PeteDin206 wrote:
My first IM as well abd I'm planning on riding a 52/36 with a 12/27 cassette... I'm a bit bigger at 6'3" and hopefully down to 182-185 (195 right now). I rode Lake Stevens in a 2:34 last year and hope to ride Whistler in the 5:30s if conditions are good...

Go to 50-34
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [simplymax] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'm a multiple time 5:50 bike split guy at IMC on the old penticton course which in my opinion is an easier course than Whistler which I raced last year.

50/34 and 12/27 (or 11/28) is a good choice for anyone riding around 6 hours.

Running out of low end gears and mashing too big a gear on tired legs is a mistake made over and over and over, particularly by newbies who are getting their advice from strong cyclists (like I did my first time only to discover during the race that 53/38 and a 12/25 was not nearly low enough for me to spin like I prefer going up the long climbs on the old Penticton course). And like I said, Whistler is tougher.

Grant

Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
PeteDin206 wrote:
My first IM as well abd I'm planning on riding a 52/36 with a 12/27 cassette... I'm a bit bigger at 6'3" and hopefully down to 182-185 (195 right now). I rode Lake Stevens in a 2:34 last year and hope to ride Whistler in the 5:30s if conditions are good...

I did it in just over 6, a little shorter, same weight. I rode a 50/34 with a 12-30. Other than one sharp uphill portion on the long descent to Pemberton, a 27 or 28 would have been OK, but I didn't want to buy any new gear. Seriously, lots of folks were mashing up this little section and it looked painful. I was glad to be able to spin it. But my IM philosophy is it's always better to have a gear you don't need, than not having a gear you do need. Plus the first few miles of the run are slightly uphill, so its a tough way to start after the last 20 mile climb. Glad to have spun up it.

As noted above, the descents are long and have good pitch so you won't be pedaling much, or at least I wasn't .
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [simplymax] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Depends on the approx time you will race or power you are targeting.

Looks like you have pretty good weight to height, but don't know if you are looking at sub 5:15 or over 6:30 or if you have a pm.

I rode a 54/39 with an 11-28 in a bit under 5:30 at 145 pounds. Iirc we had a guy who rode smart at 226 AP at 5:16 with an 11-25 (he was around 150lbs on race day)

An 11-28 should be fine for most people under 6 hours, i only used the 28 once or twice.

Compact cranks will be a bit better but maybe run you 300$ more than a new cassette, depends if you always like to be in a certain cadence.

Also keep in mind that in Whistler late August is usually reliable weather, low wind and mild. Late july, could be 15 degrees and raining or 42 degrees and very windy.

An easier gear or two isn't going to hurt.

Maurice
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [mauricemaher] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mauricemaher wrote:
Also keep in mind that in Whistler late August is usually reliable weather, low wind and mild. Late july, could be 15 degrees and raining or 42 degrees and very windy.

Every time I've been up there in mid-July through late August the weather has been very similar and the historical weather data shows that it is generally pretty consistent through July and August. Wind could definitely be a factor, but that is the case any time during the summer based on the topography.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
PeteDin206 wrote:
mauricemaher wrote:
Also keep in mind that in Whistler late August is usually reliable weather, low wind and mild. Late july, could be 15 degrees and raining or 42 degrees and very windy.

Every time I've been up there in mid-July through late August the weather has been very similar and the historical weather data shows that it is generally pretty consistent through July and August. Wind could definitely be a factor, but that is the case any time during the summer based on the topography.

Well I lived there for 8 years (89-97) and we did two camps last year, Canada day and BC long weekend. Covering about 1000km on course.

The weather for the camp weekends was highly variable, like I said from 15 and rainy on the friday, with what I would say was my toughest, hottest ride in 20 years (full course monday Canada day weekend) garmin said in the 40's (celsius) and big wind.

Who knows, could be fine on race day, or miserable on either side of the hot/cold scenario, my experience is that it can be unpredictable that time of year. YMMV.

Maurice
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [mauricemaher] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Canada day is July 1st though... Very different than the end of July which would be closer to BC Long weekend. My aunt lives up there and I have been up there pretty regularly over the summer the last 3-5 years for MTBing.. I find that once the second week in July hits, through the end of August it is pretty constant except the wind. It is very similar to pretty much the whole region (PacNW/BC). Looking at the daily history for the last 14 years of Weather at Whistler there is one day over 90 (96 in 2009) with a low in the upper 40's which is pretty constant. Most days look like they are in the mid 70's and low 80's. Wind at Whistler and Pemberton rarely tops out over 10mph (gusts) during that same period. It can be different on the road between the two towns though.

http://www.wunderground.com/...amp;req_statename=NA
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [PeteDin206] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
You're right,

Wasn't as hot, only hit a high of 38 degrees celsius on Aug 5th:

http://www.strava.com/...es/72527498/analysis

Or from 14-26 and raining on the friday before,

Not looking into getting into a debate about weather at a race 6 months from now, just saying that conditions last year were pretty perfect and only 9 people or so cracked 5 hours. IE low 20's and minimal wind. The Op was looking for gearing choices, a few easier gears will not hurt when it gets hotter or colder/rainier.

Keep in mind that about 2-3 hours of the bike will be in Pemberton where it is usually quite a few degrees hotter. The wind picks up there in the Pembe valley with heat, and usually headwind coming back to whistler, either with heat or with a front coming in from the coast. Weather in Pemberton is not usually typical of PNW. On two of the 8 days we rode (both full course) it easily hit over 100F, on other days when we started it was about 55F.

Also MTB at altitude in Whistler is in the shade is a bit different than being on the blacktop in Pemberton, we live in Kamloops which on a few days each summer is the hottest place in Canada, In whistler both of those days it was hotter than any of our rides in Kamloops/Penticton/kelowna over the past 5 years or so, and I train a lot in those areas.

Maybe an anomaly? Perhaps, As I said my personal experience with living there and training there over the past few years is that Aug/sept are fairly nice/predictable. May/june/july not so much.

Maurice
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [mauricemaher] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mauricemaher wrote:
You're right,

Wasn't as hot, only hit a high of 38 degrees celsius on Aug 5th:

http://www.strava.com/...es/72527498/analysis

Or from 14-26 and raining on the friday before,

Not looking into getting into a debate about weather at a race 6 months from now, just saying that conditions last year were pretty perfect and only 9 people or so cracked 5 hours. IE low 20's and minimal wind. The Op was looking for gearing choices, a few easier gears will not hurt when it gets hotter or colder/rainier.

Keep in mind that about 2-3 hours of the bike will be in Pemberton where it is usually quite a few degrees hotter. The wind picks up there in the Pembe valley with heat, and usually headwind coming back to whistler, either with heat or with a front coming in from the coast. Weather in Pemberton is not usually typical of PNW. On two of the 8 days we rode (both full course) it easily hit over 100F, on other days when we started it was about 55F.

Also MTB at altitude in Whistler is in the shade is a bit different than being on the blacktop in Pemberton, we live in Kamloops which on a few days each summer is the hottest place in Canada, In whistler both of those days it was hotter than any of our rides in Kamloops/Penticton/kelowna over the past 5 years or so, and I train a lot in those areas.

Maybe an anomaly? Perhaps, As I said my personal experience with living there and training there over the past few years is that Aug/sept are fairly nice/predictable. May/june/july not so much.

Maurice

Come on, this is slowtwitch, we have to debate race day weather for several months out. I am surprised that no one has started this year's annual IM Lake Placid panic thread on "wetsuit/no wetsuit". Perhaps I should start that one now! I'm generally a 4W per kilo guy and my go to gearing is 50/34 and 11-28 that pretty well covers all my needs on every course from flattest to hilliest. If I spin out at 50-12 (forget about 50-11), I'm better saving my watts for the run and simply coasting at zero watts at almost the same speed. Since I am not a front of pack racers, I don't see any benefit in pedaling if my bike can propel itself with gravity at 60 kph while I sit on top in a tuck and have some lunch.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
the new IMC as a LOT of downhills where you can simply use a good tuck-in position and just use those skills...no point in pedaling. Last year, while i had a very hard day, i used the sram 11-26 gear and i could have used another gear. 12-27 with 53-39 would be perfect for me.

one thing that is obvious....last year was PERFECT easy condition. no wind, no heat....just easy condition. it s a brutal course, harder than Lake placid and i expect this year to be really bad as odds are, it will be hot.

overall, a great bike course requiring many skills

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
Instargram
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'm doing IMC this year. I live in the Houston area and just can't find anything to climb around here. There is a possibility of doing a 4 day camp in Colorado to mainly focus on climbing, but other than that and a weekend in the "Hill Country" near Austin all I will be doing is rolling hills on the IMTX course. For a frame of reference, I did IMTX last year and road a 6:24 with no power. Not impressive, but not horrible. Just rode smart and stayed within myself. God off the bike feeling pretty solid. I wanted to know if any of you that have raced this IMC course have any suggestions as to how I could simulate the climbs on my trainer. After reading this thread I think it has pushed me over the fence and will likely purchase a pm (pending the boss lady's approval of course).

Given my ride time from IMTX, lack of hills to train on, and consistent overall bike training/fitness (I've actually gotten stronger since IMTX) do you think it's realistic for me to ride this course under 7 hours?

I am self coached this year as I had one for IMTX and learned a lot (except how to "remotely" train for IMC bike course....ha) so any pointers provided would be very much appreciated.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Bigant] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Bigant wrote:
I'm doing IMC this year. I live in the Houston area and just can't find anything to climb around here. There is a possibility of doing a 4 day camp in Colorado to mainly focus on climbing, but other than that and a weekend in the "Hill Country" near Austin all I will be doing is rolling hills on the IMTX course. For a frame of reference, I did IMTX last year and road a 6:24 with no power. Not impressive, but not horrible. Just rode smart and stayed within myself. God off the bike feeling pretty solid. I wanted to know if any of you that have raced this IMC course have any suggestions as to how I could simulate the climbs on my trainer. After reading this thread I think it has pushed me over the fence and will likely purchase a pm (pending the boss lady's approval of course).

Given my ride time from IMTX, lack of hills to train on, and consistent overall bike training/fitness (I've actually gotten stronger since IMTX) do you think it's realistic for me to ride this course under 7 hours?

I am self coached this year as I had one for IMTX and learned a lot (except how to "remotely" train for IMC bike course....ha) so any pointers provided would be very much appreciated.


The best thing to do on the trainer to simulate these climbs is big gear work. I wasn't ready at all for the inclines last year, and paid dearly for it. I was doing rides in Austin with similar total elevation changes, but at IMC, the elevation changes are basically in two spots (up to the ski jump and coming back from Pemberton). So I was used to spinning an easy gear up the hills for a short period of time, but at IMC I was having to climb at around 65-70 cadence or lower b/c I didn't have the gearing. I'd look in to getting a compact crank if you don't already have one, and work on spinning a big gear for some of your intervals. Should help.

As to hitting 7 hours, I don't see that as a problem assuming your weight won't be a huge factor. My goal for the course was 6 hours based on rolling hills, and I think I finished in 6:24.

Edit: It's been awhile since I read GMan's overview and didn't realize I basically plagiarized what he said. I guess great minds think alike.

______________________________________________

"Sweep the leg...Do you have a problem with that?" - John Kreese
Last edited by: CobraKai Triguy: Mar 18, 14 14:33
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Bigant] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I find some of the Sufferfest videos that focus on climbing pretty helpful for practicing going uphill. I live close to Vancouver, and most of our rides are in similar terrain (very undulating, a few long climbs if you really seek them out)

Long Chile was a silly place.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Bigant] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
It's not the short climbs that get you, it is the long 5Km+ climbs with no break where the grade is 8%, 9%, 8% and when you hit a 6% it feels great.

Not sure how you simulate that in flat country other than ride a mountain bike with real soft tires :).

BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [BCDon] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks a lot for the information guys. Kobra, I'm 6'3 185lbs (should be about 180lb on race day) so I'm at an extra disadvantage. Ha. I'll make it a point to focus on a lot of big gear low cadence work on the trainer. Hell, I may spend 30-45 mins at a time just grinding it out. I'd be really happy with a sub 7 bike to set me up for a solid run. I'll also grab a SF video geared towards climbing. Those vids are killer!!

I'll look into a compact crank as well. I may be getting a new Tri bike (replacing the 2009 P2 with something with geometry to fit my "long/narrow frame) so I'll consider that when I figure out what frame works best for me.

Thanks again, guys!
In Reply To:
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [Bigant] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Just glancing thru the recent posts here and it got me thinking about the weather and the water.

You guys who are familiar with the area.....we can expect the air temp to be in the mid 40's in the mornings? That will be a chilly way to start the bike. Brrr

Also, end of July, will the lake temp be in the upper 60's like it was at the end of August? I know there are no certainties but this type of info helps me to mentally prepare. I'm not good at starting races when I'm shivering. Thanks.
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [eye3md] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Below is the average high and low temperature for Whistler. The water may be slightly cooler, but I don't expect it to drop much (1-3 degrees F colder then last year at most). The PacNW is expecting higher then normal air temperatures this summer so the water could actually be warmer then last year if we have a hot summer.

MonthDaily HighsDaily Lows°C°F°C°FJanuary-2°C28°F-8°C18°FFebruary3°C37°F-5°C23°FMarch8°C46°F-3°C27°FApril11°C52°F2°C36°FMay17°C62°F7°C44°FJune21°C70°F9°C48°FJuly27°C80°F11°C52°FAugust27°C80°F11°C52°FSeptember20°C68°F8°C46°FOctober16°C60°F3°C38°FNovember5°C41°F-1°C30°FDecember-1°C30°F-5°C23°F

http://www.whistler.com/weather/history/
Quote Reply
Re: Ironman Canada Whistler Bike Course Overview [eye3md] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
It won't be much cooler - but it will largely depend on the weather race week. If it's rainy and windy, the water won't be as warm... There's still A LOT of snow in Whistler, which could mean a later melt.

That being said, riding in Pemberton is great right now and highway crews have started sweeping the shoulders.
Quote Reply