I heard it's not raining at the finish? So maybe they'll keep it together?

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----------------------------------------------------------

keep it simple , keep it real .
--Brett Sutton

But i dont really know that much about bikes. I just sit on em and do as i am told. peddle. hard and fast.
--Chrissie Wellington

I think the best way to get faster is to enjoy it, the more you do the better you get, so go out and enjoy swim, biking and running, and don't feel to constrained and just do lots.
--Stephen Bayliss

i was trying to beat jack to it today. i didn't know i'd have to worry about anyone else.

---

---------------------------------------
Fruit snacks are for winners

In an attempt to not repeat what happened yesterday, Andy may ride off the road.

I think it will be a repeat with Evans winning.

Or Thor, because.

Nah, that's a Frank move.

I predict FrAndy lose more time, Contador/Evans/Sanchez drop TV, and Cadel ends up in yellow.

I'm losing track... what is the undisputed best bike in the world at right now?

---

2014: 40k TT focus

Race reports at http://tripikapp.blogspot.com

TITANFLEX

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Just Triing
Triathlete since 9:56:39 AM EST Aug 20, 2006.
Be kind English is my 2nd language. My primary language is Dave it's a unique evolution of English.

definitely the s5 right now.

the next two days do not bode well for it though. the team version is too heavy for the alps. If thor had the VWD though, definitely.

;)

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Can we have some love for EBH who's out in the break again today?

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

yes we can
also Hoogerland, who made some hard efforts to get in a break yesterday, and is now bridging up!

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Oh, and Hoogerland is at it again as well. Serious case of HTFU; his stitches on the inside of his knee are apparently infected...

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Hoogerland? more like Zombieland (fast zombies)

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I thought Velo News had a great line yesterday when they called it the Thor de France

I think we should also give HUGE props to Ryder for that stage win. If you watched from the beginning of the coverage you will have seen him driving hard at the front of a breakaway attempt for like 30 minutes, and they got caught. And he went again, this time with thor. And then he dropped everyone on the climb. A massive show of force. While Thor was more a show of cleverness. He only made 1 move, the right one, and conserved energy.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

OK, so they're going up a Cat1 and there's four (4) Europcar riders on the front of the peloton. And a bunch of Liquigas guys. It ain't happening today. Haven't seen Frandy all day.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

dude, 100% chance a GC contender attacks at the final cat2

and 90% chance that GC contender is not Frandy.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I think one of them will attack--Andy did attack yesterday.

I'm just hoping for some old-fashioned crazy guys attacking early and often. I guess the current crop of CG studs are just not like that (TV excluded).

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

The descent after the Cat 2 climb is in bad shape, someone should take advantage

Daddy Schleck just admitted in an interview that he thinks Andy will probably lose more time on the last descent.

With support like that he'll never get over the hump.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Neither Frank or Andy has thrown down a significant attack, yet. The 30 sec or 2 sec "attacks" did little damage on the other GC guys.

Either, both of them are too concerned about the other to really put a hurting on the other GC guys, or they don't have the legs to separate from the other GC guys.

---

Suffer Well.

I still want to know how the ST analysts can distinguish between an all out attack that doesn't work because the others are able to cover it

and a half assed attack.

how do you know? forildo?

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I think if Andy and/or Frank are escared of losing time on the final descent, then they must attack.

Voeckler has old school attacking style?

---

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

How do you reckon he got where he is? He may not be a climber, but he attacks early and often.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Perhaps significant should have been replaced with effective?

---

Suffer Well.

They may attack, I'm just not sure they can attack and get away especially with only a cat. 2 climb left (maybe the whole stage has softened up everyone though). Yesturday, it seemed like LT got caught with their pants down more than anything, and added to that their poor descenting skills, they struggled. AC/Evans and others are ready for attacks and probaly WANT attacks from the Schleck's, could really set up great counter moves.

---

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

'


It just irks me to hear the best bike racers in the world criticized when the case MAY be that they are just all near-equally good right now, rather than being wimps.

The ascent rates on the big climbs seem to indicate they are pretty close to non doped limits of human ability!

Desperation is going to set in the next couple of days though, so we may see crazier stuff =)

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

The wimp part is Andy going down hill.

---

Suffer Well.

truth

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I guess, but I also think he's allowed to attack because he's really not a full on GC threat (thus why he's allowed to get in breaks that stay away). Sure, he's in yellow now, but wait until Saturday and see if he doesnt end up in about 7th, and also look at how tip toeing many of the GC guys did in the Pyrnees (sp). AC/Evans/Sanchez/Schleck's would never be allowed an attack and get in a break that gains 6 mins on the peloton on any stage (unless it's an mt. stage where they climb away from everyone).

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Watching the Eurosport feed which stinks today, I am surprised no one makes a move on the descent its so spread out

the old school crazy attacks you want will happen only with a crazy outlier talent, which is less likely today with the depth of talent in the world, the depth of professional training and teams, and maybe, the reduced level of doping going on.

should be more common in womens cycling, maybe we should watch that!

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Understood. My point is though that there used to be climbers that had TV's attitude and could set stages like today on fire. Think The Chicken, Virenque, etc. What we have now is a bunch of tactical studs who aim to make as much of a gap with as little effort as possible, and the second tier guys just don't have the capability and/or support to light it up.

And Jack, spare me your disdain about Rasmussen and Virenque being dopers, because in those days they all were.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

I bet the Schlecks try to attack on the last climb, if only to ensure they get some kind of gap they are bound to lose when they soft pedal down the descent. Even though its dry, this descent is more technical than yesterday's and that does not bode well for the less skilled GC riders.

Expect Cadel and Voeckler to put time on the others on that descent, with the Schlecks, Basso losing out the most. SS, AC will hold their own descending and will likely not lose too much in that phase.

---

---

"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
Sponsors: SciCon | | Every Man Jack

Huh?

First of all I can disdain everybody, and them, for doping.

Second, a peleton where everyone is doping is likely to have more outlier talents than one that does not, for a variety of reasons, and also the cost of massive risky efforts is probably less, because you can recover so quickly.

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

if contador or evans crash on the descent today

will the schlecks wait? =)

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

In other words, you don't want steroids in baseball but you still want guys hitting 60-70 home runs.

Could your view on how dopers raced the race in the past, affect how you may potentially view a *cleaner* Tour? If, they are in fact *cleane*r, than your view/understanding of how they race, I would have to assume must change. To expect guys to simply ride up the road and having to BRAKE when climbing and attack day after day, would seem unrealistic.

We may have a bunch of tactical studs because quite frankly, that is how they have to ride a race like this.

Which is funny because now that they may be getting *cleaner*, we now are complaining about the lack of attacks (and we wonder why doping is such a huge legacy/part of cycling).

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Ha, not a chance, but they will ride side by side so they can come with a cover story for their actions...something like their brakes went out and they couldn't slow down!

---

---

"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Elliot | Cycle2Tri.com
Sponsors: SciCon | | Every Man Jack

Heh. Just a matter of having to adjust my expectations of what happens on stages like this one I guess. This type of stage (lots of cols, not necessarily the highest ones) used to be where maximum craziness ensued. If this is the new reality, I'll have to get used to it I suppose.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

x2.

But what a blast it is to re-learn what bike racing at the Grand Tour level is all about. Not only for us, but the actual racers!

WOW what a change in roads..

---

Just Triing
Triathlete since 9:56:39 AM EST Aug 20, 2006.
Be kind English is my 2nd language. My primary language is Dave it's a unique evolution of English.

They're in Italy now dude :-)

Apparently there's parts of the climb that are closed to the public because the road's to narrow.

As I'm typing this the last Dutch hope (Rob Ruigh) falls. Grumble.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Did AC get caught in that crash? I cant see him in the front of the group, yet.

Edit: nevermind, all the GC guys are there.

---

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Sporza said he was OK.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

AC ok, voeckler ok

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

And he goes... Dropped the group.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

I think the word we may be looking for is "sustained". I don't think Contador really cared if his attack was effective, he just kept going. Vs Andy who puts in probably an equally hard attack, but shuts it down a lot quicker than Contador would appear to do.

"He says from his couch".

x2! A very impressive ride yesterday by Ryder.

who is the crown in their jewell according to Paul

Andy had one of the most devastating attacks yesterday, on his brake pads....

How about Norway this year?

---

Suffer Well.

called it!

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

AC goes on the attack, everyone is able to easily hold wheels!

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I can't stand watching Andy climb... Look forward dammit!!!

somebody is going down on this downhill.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

called it

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

After seeing this final decent, what are the odds of FrAndy crapping their pants? 1:1?

EuroSport's feed: "And his bike is stuck in the briar patch"

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

The Eurosport guys just called him out for this too. hahaha

OMG Carport guy! :)

(eurosport comment) "If it wasn't my job to keep my hands off my eyes, I'd have them there" (covering the descent)

---

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

Bert did his homework. He's descending like a madman.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

AC is soooooo cool just hammering down the descent

AC attacks on the downhill. I think he has found FrAndy's weakness.

---

Suffer Well.

I want more Schleckism's after the stage today!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Voeckler took the same exit!

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Voeckler in the same carport!

---

Suffer Well.

after the Frandy's comments in the press last night, how could you NOT tell the mechanics to put the 25c grippy as shit tires on and be read to bomb that descent? lol

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I just saw that! Eurosport says it is a French problem. ;)

---

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

and there goes the yellow

---

Just Triing
Triathlete since 9:56:39 AM EST Aug 20, 2006.
Be kind English is my 2nd language. My primary language is Dave it's a unique evolution of English.

wow I cringed on that descent

I FUCKING LOVE CONTADOR!

Bike racer right there.

All the tire in the world can't compensate for "pussitis."

---

Suffer Well.

Sanchez and AC TTing together - so nice. Let us hear the Judas cry afterwards....

you think poo came out there, for Voeckler?

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Win or lose, there's absolutely no question that Contador is a far superior bike racer to Andy.

Eurosport says only 25 seconds donw...

---

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

I might be coming around. I love the way he races.

Amazing!

Hold up!

Frandy caught him!

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Andy just went "BOO" to AC right there at the end. WOW, tv cameras totally lost that group.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Wow off twice and keeps the yellow

---

Just Triing
Triathlete since 9:56:39 AM EST Aug 20, 2006.
Be kind English is my 2nd language. My primary language is Dave it's a unique evolution of English.

Andy and Frank may not sleep tonight.

Hmm, the finish today might slightly contradict that.

AC's descent and break with Sammy was impressive, but I'm equally impressed by AS covering that gap (who knows whether it was by himself or not, of course)

Gain: Zero.

But at least he tried. Man, this is going down to the wire. And I can't watch the damn TT Saturday.

---

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.

Huge finish for the Schleck's there. Bravo to get back on with AC at the very end.

---

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Tomorrow should be a good one:



and Friday Alpe D'Huez.

---

Suffer Well.

It was voted the toughest stage this year, I am very excited for it

But, in the end, what he did accomplished nothing....Tomorrow is the big day and maybe he burned too much up today. Of course I say that and I know he's the best pure rider in the race, beef or no beef.

Bob

With help. Spackler's right, AC is finally starting to put his stamp on this race. I expect big things in the next 2 days.

nah, everyone else had to burn the same matches.
maybe more since he made that time by just falling, and they had to claw it back on the flats.

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

How so? Contador climbs as well or better than Andy, as evident by dropping him the past two days. He goes downhill FAR better, as evident by dropping him the past two days (Andy can thank the chasers for getting him to the line; he was in a group). Andy can't TT, Contador is hands-down the best GC TTer.

That's why one of them has 6 GT victories and a slew of other stage races like P-N.

In the mental battle, this was a huge sigh of relief for the Schleck's. In the same breath, AC is really coming onto form, and at this point is making the race right now, the past few stages.

Tomorrow, I'm thinking is goign to be brutal!

---

------------------
@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I'm really starting to like Sammy Sanchez. Seems to be a great allround cyclist, aggressive without being stupid. Just wish he wasn't playing domestique for a guy who isn't even on his team.

Andy and Frank are so escared that they're skipping their usual post-stage mani-pedis and are going right to the his and his massages. At midnight they will wake up in a cold sweat and and won't get more than 4 hours of sleep. All because Contador slapped them around today. He gained no time advantage, but gained a psychological one.

It looked like the Schlecks were leading the chase group to me for a LONG time, just saying. Everyone else was trying to hang on

Well, I agree that the Schleck sisters are going to be the new Poulidor's of the 21st century.

Of course if Cadelle ever attacks I might fall over out of my chair...

Bob

All because Contador slapped them around today. He gained no time advantage, but gained a psychological one.

______________________

I think it's even stevens in terms of gaining any mental edge from today. Both can take alot away from today. Schleck's got gapped and still made the finish (especially with how many guys crashed off on that downhill), AC's form is certainly coming onto form. Game on for both.

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I wasn't really disagreeing with you; if I had to put money on anyone I'd almost always bet on AC. He just seems to "get" it better than Andy (as much as one can tell from TV/media). Just saying that today it didn't mean as much as it could have.

No, everyone else was happy to let them do the work to bring back AC. Why would they bother coming around when Frandy were being forced to close that gap?

From the EuroSport feed I was watching, I'm not even sure they knew where the Evans/Schleck group was. I thought for sure, AC had gapped everyone, and then right at the line, the GC group shows up. Was a bit surprised they made the gap.

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Who cares about the GC ;-)

This Thor de France is all about Norway. Two Norwegians in the tour, 4 stage wins, ttt win and yellow jersey.

Heia Norge

Correct

Waiting for Cadel to attack? I guess you haven't followed him since winning the world championships two years ago.

I'd say it's also clear that while Andrea has Frandy, Contador has Sanchez. Something else for the sisters to think about.

Yeah, agree with you.

You think Cadel will have an "off" day or has he matured to completely not bonk on one of the few remaining BIG mountain stages. I think AC is the favorite right now.

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Ok, I should have said "In the Tour de France."

If he ever attacked going uphill, I'd not only fall out of my chair, I'd shit myself. He sits on wheels and doesn't attack. Sure it's a good strategy, but as they Hinault said on Eurosport "Ruder should attack; go out at beat someone."

Bob

That for sure is the BIG question. To be fair, I didn't think Cadel had a shot in this race but damn if he doesn't look like a different rider. I'm still not convinced he (or anyone) can follow Contador on an epic stage but we'll soon find out.

But at this point in the game, if he rides wheels, he wins the Tour. It's that simple.

Edit: I still think Evans is going to have his trade mark "off" day and finish well off the pace. BUT, if he can ride wheels when AC attacks, he's going to win the Tour. I just dont see that happening.

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Yesterday he went on the attack with Contador and then dropped him and Sanchez on the super sketchy descent. He also attacked Sunday.

Cadel has rode the smartest race of anyone in this Tour among the GC guys. He's stayed up front during flat stages, stayed out of danger, has good team support, and has been able to follow the right attacks each time and then been able to respond with his own digs. He really has ridden an fantastic Tour, almost one of those too good to be true rides, where something has to go wrong, right, lol?

---

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

things never HAVE to go wrong.

but they always CAN

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Cadel will not attack because he thinks if everyone stays behind him like they are, he will get all the time he could possibly need in the TT to win.

J, The difference is that the guys today don't go up to the front like Merkcx used to and just ride them off the wheel. When Cancelara did it at P-R everyone was mezmorized.

Andy and Frank are so escared that . . .

You keep saying that is if it's a word.

It is in my part of the world, too.

Last night I heard "estand."

---

Suffer Well.

Do you drink esprite? (Three syllable word.)

and that is because you need to be like 10% stronger than the rest of the field to do that, and nobody except fabian on a great day is like that anymore.

---

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I drink cokadiet.

And he would be right to think that he doesn't have to attack. Being only 1:18 behind Voekler, he is effectively in the yellow jersey. He can take that time back in the TT easily, and he has more than enough time to hold off Contador in the TT. Andy and Frank will each lose at least 40-60 seconds in the TT, so he has no reason to attack. He just needs to defend his position to win.

Other than Voeckler, I'd think he wants to take a little more back before the TT. Cadel has shown a willingness to attack when it makes sense tactically.

Yeah, I think they even commented as such.

---

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit

Is there anyone beside AC he should worry about in the TT? From what I understand Voekler is 2 minutes and change slower and has enough cushion on Contador to sit back and just hang with whoever decided to attack.

Cadel WILL have a bad day in the next 2 days. Very much like Jalabert, he's always struggled when things got really high. The Pyrenees weren't very high this year.
The Alpes are REALLY high this year. Tomorrow, they'll go over Col Agnel at 2744m, then Col d'Isoard at 2360, then finally Serre-Chevalier at 2645m. The next day the Galibier
goes up to 2556m. Makes Alpe d'Huez at 1860 seem like sea level. There is really no hiding tomorrow. 3 hard climbs, and all of them going up to between 7700ft and 9000ft.

x2. Just beautiful to watch him ride a bike.

I agree. He really blew up last year. He seems different to me this year though so I'm not counting him out. I DO NOT want him to win. I've always thought he was a huge baby and just gives up when things go just a little bad. This year he has kinda proven me wrong, but we will know in about 48 hours.

I hope Contador drops his chain, the Schlecks attack, then Contador reels them in, and hammer away. Now THAT would be ultimate fun.

I know many don't like Contador, but he is a really fun rider to watch. He attacks. He makes the moves. He doesn't even need a team for that.

Been recording and watching in the evening. But tomorrow getting up early to watch live before work. fireworks tomorrow. Really exciting, as could go any which way. I am pulling for AC. Just love to watch him ride.

I use it the way a 12 year-old girl uses it, the way Andy and Frank use it.

Would you prefer 'uh-fwaid?'

If he doesn't, he wins the tour.

I like Elmer Fudd! LOL.

---

=====================================
"Yeah you point a finger back far enough and some germ gets blamed for splitting in two."

Colonel Saul Tigh from Battlestar Galactica

Two comments:

1) It's interesting that those who are saying the Schlecks had help are conveniently ignoring Sanchez helping Contador.

2) It seems odd to me that I have yet to see anyone questioning AC's sudden resurgence after the rest day. He looked like he was struggling in the Pyrenees yet nobody has said anything here or on cycling forums.

It's been discussed. He was obviously suffering after the crashes in the first week (and specifically, the crash where he tangled with Karpets and hit his knee). You figure unless he's seriously injured himself, eventually he has to get over that and get some form back.

If Cadel can follow AC on the first 4 switchbacks on Alpe d'Huez which are the steepest and power to weight is the biggest advantage for AC, he has a chance in this Tour. The top of Galibier is also 12%, but that is the north side and early in the ADH stage. I can't remember what the steepest part near the Galibier summit is on the stage when they do it from the south side out of Briancon, but I don't think it is so steep that Cadel should crack. But it's rare that there is a summit finish over 8000 feet and the air is more rare and the heavier guys just have feed more mass even if their power is higher. Traditionallly the smallest guys have done very well in the super high mountain finishes. Should be interesting

Except that he also has one of the hardest GT's ever in his legs already and nobody else who rode the Giro hard in the last two years has been able to be a top contender in the Tour.

You DO remember Cadel had a fractured elbow last year?

1. No one is ignoring Sanchez. He has helped Contador on a couple of occasions. This is just a circumstantial alliance, which often happens in cycling. His teammates did some good work yesterday though. But we've seen the
Trek-Leopard teammates doing a lot more work for Andy and Frank. Actually they did a lot of work, too early in the race.

2. You are questioning it. However, a few here actually follow cycling closely, and have argued that he was likely just hanging in the group in the Pyrenees to not lose too much time, simply because he
had crashed a lot in the first 10 days. After a few days that were crash free, he's back in shape. Hardly a surprise.

Sure, that's it.

You also are forgettting that AC is one of the greatest GT riders per his age in the history of cycling. He's a special talent, so simply comparing what he has done to past guys who have failed at the GT double, is a bit unfair. Let's also not forget that so far the Tour really hasnt had anyone put the "hurt" on anyone else. For all we know, AC can still crack on the next few stages.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

1) I suggest you read through the thread as only one other person and none of the people claiming the Schlecks had help has mentioned it. As a matter of fact your excuse for Sanchez helping can be used for the Schlecks as well...but you don't do that.

2) I have been following cycling very closely for 30 years and every time someone bounces back like this they end up getting busted...except for Lemond and his "iron" injection. Once again your response simply bears out what I am talking about.

However, a few here actually follow cycling closely, and have argued that he was likely just hanging in the group in the Pyrenees to not lose too much time, simply because he had crashed a lot in the first 10 days. After a few days that were crash free, he's back in shape. Hardly a surprise.

I think the few here who actually follow cycling closely recognize your points and also are aware of what happens during rest days. Hardly a surprise.

there was a rest day before the earlier mountains too though

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Cadel said yesterday or the rest day that he is particularly looking forward to the Alpe on Friday. He noted in most previous tours it has come at the end of a long, hard, stage, favoring the light little guys with more finishing stamina. But this year the stage is relatively short, leaving the Alpe ascent the primary feature of the day. He said or suggested it opened the ascent up to more attacks and more interesting racing.

I do believe that's called telegraphing his intentions.

I don't see him losing 2 mins to Contador tomorrow unless disaster strikes; making Friday some likely damn good watching.

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De que depende?

there was a rest day before the earlier mountains too though

so?

I bow to your far superior knowledge of cycling...

well the cynical claim has been that contador has attacked the last two days NOT because of getting over the crashes or riding into form but because he doped on rest day #2

wouldn't he have doped on rest day #1 as well?

also you can dope whenever you want, a rest day is just easier.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Guys like Ned and Alan always like to fall back on trotting out the same tired lines. Yawn.

Dam it Mott, quit with the facts already.

to be fair, pro cyclists certainly earned that cynicism.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

You surely meant pro athletes.

I'm not saying AC isn't doped. But if he were doping, why wait so long to do it? Why wait until the 2nd rest day when he's got so much time to make up?

And do you think that the crashes shouldn't slow him down?

I'm pretty sure that whatever happens the CAS appeal isn't going to go Contador's way. The beef story is obviously BS. But you're talking like someone who doesn't understand doping and who's never crashed a bike.

no, I choose not to go down that tired apologist path of trying to excuse one group's moral failing because the others are just as bad.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Actually, Dr. de Mondenard, who is one of the experts on doping in France has argued that the CAS appeal will go with Contador.

Not apologist...cynical.

The more I think about it, the more AC keeps winning, the more I just cant see AC getting busted. Yeah, yeah CAS is this higher authority, etc., but I just cant see cycling allow them to bust the winner of 3 of it's biggest races in the last year.

Now that's not to say he actually did/didnt dope, I just cant see them busting him if he wins the Tour this year.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Today was crazy with that decent.. dry roads but "the most famous car park in the world" was seeing some action! And Voeckler with his bunny hop.. mountain biking it up in the TDF!

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_______________________________________________
Endurance House Ambassador of Triathlon 2012

“Time is limited, so I better wake up every morning fresh and know that I have just one chance to live this particular day right, and to string my days together into a life of action, and purpose.” --Lance Armstrong

You are forgetting that AC has a pretty shady past with teams, DS's and testing and that he has become one of the greats during a well known doping era. You aso forget that there were some pretty serious digs made in he Pyrenees and he was really hurt by them. Go back and watch the video. Now he looks like he is working but not even close to redlining.

Keep that "Too big to fail" argument out of the main forum.... that seems a topic more for the LR.

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Suffer Well.

so you think he forgot to cheat on the first rest day?

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Why is it that whenever someone brings some logic and facts that disagree with you you resort to acting like a little kid? How about trying to have a mature discussion instead of doing the message board version of pouting.

I am simply trying to discuss the white elephant in the room, how about attempting to discuss it using logic and facts rather then simply try to insult us.

Ah. That was funny. Especially the part about logic and facts.

Your right, AC is the only one with a shady background with past teams/doctors involvment.

Yes AC was hurt in the Pyrnees, but I also dont think there were serious enough digs to completely pop anyone. There was far more cat and mouse games than absolute brutal attacks to break guys.

If your trying to compare what he looked like riding Cat.1 and HC climbs in the Pyrenee's to the 2 past days when he has attacked on Cat. 2 climbs, he looked just like that in the early Tour stage when he and Evans attacked late in the stage. It's Cat. 2 climbs.


If your trying to claim logic and facts, I dont think it's very fair to completely discredit his crashes/injuries from early on in the Tour. To simply say he's on the juice and that's why he's back, well I dont think is fair to him nor the race itself.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I'm not saying AC isn't doped. But if he were doping, why wait so long to do it? Why wait until the 2nd rest day when he's got so much time to make up?

Who says he waited? I don't know his doping practices and schedules. I don't even know for sure that he's doping, although I'm extremely skeptical.

And do you think that the crashes shouldn't slow him down?

I suspect the crashes did impact him, significantly. It certainly seemed that way last week. Recovery helps, even the the recovery you get from riding 5 to 6 hours a day on a bike. A rest day helps even more. But it's not an either/or situation. His performance these last two days shows a remarkable recovery. And given his injuries, the fact that he hammered the Giro, the problem of doping in pro cycling, his own reputation and past (including the positive from last year's Tour), who he associates with, etc., I'm skeptical.

I'm pretty sure that whatever happens the CAS appeal isn't going to go Contador's way. The beef story is obviously BS. But you're talking like someone who doesn't understand doping and who's never crashed a bike.

I've crashed my bike plenty.

Now you are doing what Francois did...proving my point by making excuses for AC. Though I will admit that at least you are making an attempt at actual discussion unlike Francois who is acting like a little kid who did not get his way (as usual).

Unfortunately, the past several years have taught that any remarkable performance should be looked at with a degree of skepticism. I'm specifically ripping Contador because of all the blind love I'm seeing here. At least Andy and Frank are clean.

perhaps contador has found a doping product that improves descending skills

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

How am I making excuses? You talk about wanting to make "facts", yet your living off of simple assumptions, just as our side of the argument is.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I wonder if they use the same gyno to stay clean.

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Another IM in 2016 - hopefully..

I am basing what I say on the fact he was struggling and is now looking stronger then everyone. The fact that he has a shady past and, if the Spainish federation and the CAS folllowed the letter of the law he would be banned for a positive result. You are making claims of how hard you think people were going, claiming the mountains were smaller so you can't compare how he was going. Those are excuses.

"I hope Contador drops his chain, the Schlecks attack, then Contador reels them in, and hammer away. Now THAT would be ultimate fun."

You mean kinda sorta like when the unmentionable one went down with a fan's musette handle, climbed back aboard and stomped everyone into dust?

Or maybe you mean something like Hinault's 81 PR win... Now THERE was a racer! I'm really surprised he doesn't just bum rush the Schlecks from the podium out of shear disgust.

It hasn't all been descending.

But some of the most killer workouts I've ever done have been on descents. Find a 5+ mile descent where you can pedal through turns -- pedal as big a gear as you want, but the only two rules are that cadence must be above 120 (or some other number) and you must maintain chain tension the entire way down.

They just use Contador as their douche.

How do you know? If Contador is a doper, as you suspect, then wouldn't that also cast doubt on the only rider in the peleton who has been able to stay with him in the mountains for the last 2 years?

LOL

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Well played :)

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Another IM in 2016 - hopefully..

  
So I'm making excuses because I'm trying to be just as logical as you are, but only your viewpoint is logical/unexcusable?

So you only think that him doping on Monday is the reason for his good form now?

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

"I am basing what I say on the fact he was struggling and is now looking stronger then everyone"

I can assure you no one here is trying to argue that he probably isn't doping. The argument is simply being made that you are conveniently leaving out just as many other possibilities to why things are playing out this way as someone who would insist he isn't doping.

You ask for maturity. Try looking at all sides and possibilties. It's amateur hour to choose an opinion and then arrange the facts to suit it.

At the very least, you show only a cynic's first-degree understanding of how doping works and is applied in professional cycling.

It's hard for me to align this statement:

no, I choose not to go down that tired apologist path of trying to excuse one group's moral failing because the others are just as bad.

with this statement:

so you think he forgot to cheat on the first rest day?

One is the ultimate example of a "holier-than-thou" attitude, and the other is giving the benefit of the doubt to a rider who tested positive during last year's Tour de France. Surely if it was someone else making those statements, you'd be calling out the double talk.

C'mon, do I think he forgot to cheat on the first rest day? No. Maybe he realizes there are risks to doping, so you only do it sporadically, and when it will help the most. Like on a Monday rest day with the three most decisive stages of the whole race later that week. Maybe that's a gamble worth taking. Maybe doping on the first rest day wasn't worth the risk due to the lack of decisive stages immediately afterwards.

Surely you don't need to be so coy and pretend like there are no good reasons a rider would have chosen rest day 2 and not rest day 1 to do something improper.

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Portside Athletics Blog

Apprently you didn't bother reading yesterday's thread... For sure it was mentioned at least a few times.

Reeeally? Could be they are, but you say that as if it's a given... how so?

Logic and facts? Ok, how about this:

Fact: Contador crashed numerous times early on and clearly had a tweaked knee clearly evident by his pedaling style. Logic would suggest that he would bide his time and try to recover.

Fact: the Tour will be decided this week based on the current/coming stages.

Fact: a cycling fan who follows the sport closely would know that some riders can be flat after a rest day (recent reference: VDV).

Fact: the Schleck's are not great descenders, and even worse in the rain. Contador is a great descender.

Applying logic to these fact that Contador is behind on GC, it's fairly easy to understand why he strategically chose yesterday's stage to attack.

Perhaps you'd like to present your case for the innuendo you suggested?

I do not know if AC dopes or not, I guess only himself and a few persons close to him would know. However, I think it is not fact-based to point to the last 2 days as indication of doping. What I see is:
1. He crashed quite a lot during week 1, obviously time will help him recover from that, especially a rest-day
2. He rode a pretty tough Giro de Italia - as time goes he will be more recovered I suppose
3. The gaps was created mostly on decents. I would assume doping would help you a lot more uphill. He has attacked but it is not like he has blown the group apart during +30 min explosions.

It will be interesting to see the next few days, I think we are seeing a stronger AC than in the first 2 weeks but the question is if it is enough when it really starts going uphill tomorrow and Friday???

The problem is that in THIS case, the evidence points more strongly to recovery after crashes than it does to miraculously effective (yet strangely ill-timed) doping.

I'm certainly on the 'cynic' side of the scale when it comes to doping in cycling (and most other sports). But you have to factor in crashes. Crashing slows you down a LOT. Eventually you're going to recover, dope or no dope.

I have Bruyneel's ability see into their eyes.

I am specifically addressing a claim that Contador must have doped, rather than recovered from falls, or ridden into form, because he got better after a rest day.

You cannot logically conclude that, as he looked bad after another rest day.

I am not giving him the benefit of the doubt. I am pointing out that we can't know if he was less impressive earlier because he wasn't doping yet, or because he was in pain, or because he wasn't fit yet, or some combination of the above.

my addressing of this specific claim should not be viewed as giving anyone the benefit of the doubt, or as having any philosophical meaning of any other kind.

/internet

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

I already have discussed all the reasons to question AC's sudden ascendency.

I was on the road, so I did miss it, but have not seen it on any cycling forums either.

"I already have discussed all the reasons..."



Closed-minded much?

And miraculously recovered so much in one day that he is easily the strongest rider.

____________

Except, this is factually incorrect, simply look at the stage results, especially after the Luz Ardiden (sp) stage. It's not some miraculous 1 day recovery. It's not as if he was dropped 5 mins and then turns around and laps the field in 1 day as you put it. Look at the last few Pyrenee stages and AC was right there with all the GC guys. But, if your complete belief is that he doped, sure it sounds better when he's made a miracle 1 day recovery!

Edit: And I'm not trying to make the case for or against AC doping. It's just interesting that only your view on him doping should be accepted as the reason for his "miraculous" recovery. That I dont buy into at all.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I am simply presenting the possibility that doping is involved. I do think that you,and others, are making excuses talking about size of mountains, ignoring AC's history, using insults against me, etc.

The problem here is that the people defending AC seem to be doing so at all costs and refuse to see anything else. Heck I even have people claiming that nobody is saying he didn't dope and people claiming that I actually said he is doping.

Wow, you edit my response and take it out of context in order to insult me.

You act like he was getting dropped repeatedly in the Pyrenees. He lost 30 seconds on one stage, and stayed with the lead group in all the others. We're talking a 1-2% difference between hanging with the lead pack and being the strongest rider. And it's also not like he's taking minutes out of the other contenders on the climbs (just Andy on the descents because his vag starts hurting him). I'm not saying he didn't dope, because we won't know that unless he test positive, but I'd be much more suspicious if he was suddenly taking back minutes on everyone. Cadel has had no problems staying with him, but you're not saying anything about Cadel doping... I just think you're exaggerating how much stronger he's been the last two days.

Once again I never said he did dope, simply presenting the possibility that has to be looked at, but has not and actually has people making excuses instead of contemplating it.

Perhaps you need to work on reading comprehension as I have mentioned multiple times how he went from looking like he was redlined to looking like he was easily the strongest rider. You are simply bearing out what I have said.

You all but said his performance should be questioned of doping, as you mention how in the last 30 years results like this resulted in drug busts. So now that your "facts" have been quesioned you come back with "oh I never really said it was doping". You just made the accusations/assumptions that it's highly likely. Which is fine to believe, what is odd is when others bring up valid counter arguements, you are quick to discredit them, and say we have "excuses".

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Let me get this straight, if I say his performance deserves to be questioned from my first post, then, after you claim I said he was doping, point out that I never said he was doping somehow it's an indictment against me? Are you tying to claim I changed my story? I ask because you even admit that I stayed on the same course in your post quoted above.

People like you and Frankie are doing a better job of proving my points then I could ever do in this thread. Thanks.

Agree.

Cadel, Paris, Yellow.

Everyone is whining about the Schleks lack of attacks while heaping praise on AC. Are you watching the same tour I am, because Cadel has attacked more than any other GC contender. The descent that everyone is praising AC for? Evans attacked and took time out of AC there, only 2 seconds, but he took more time out of Frandy than AC did.

I have to agree with you that other than Voeckler, Evans has been the most impressive so far... I hate that this is the case, but all that I try and find weakness i cannot find any reason as of now to not put him in yellow at the end. That being said, these next two stages are the toughest and we all know Evans hasn't been mentally tough enough to last (in previous year).

Oddguy to use for comparison, I agree Jalabert struggled on the big climbs, but he really wasn't a climber. He won the polka dot by attacking early and getting big points on the smaller climbs. He'd never have won the climbers jersey if he was a climber (I know that sounds asinine). The GC guys wouldn't have let him get so far ahead early if they thought he would make it up the big finale climbs in good shape.

Styrrell

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Styrrell

I think it may happen. The weirdest thing about this thread is how the 'it must be doping' people seem to be inflating AC's performances to some ridiculous extent - like he broke his leg on day 1 and is now riding away from the field and gaining time by the half hour.

The guy has been with the leaders. He's had one or two 'real' attacks, neither of which amounted to much and neither of which really improved his standing against the real contenders. This is an amazing turnaround that's only explainable by doping?

To me, he looks like a guy who was banged up and is now feeling a bit better and isn't obviously struggling as much, and is coming *close* to his normal form but still has a bit to get there.

At least can we all agree that Sanchez is dirty?

Obviously any rider could dope. As far as ACs performance, before the tour started people were debating wether AC should be the favorite, due to past performance, or wether he would be tired from the Giro. So in addition to the Giro, he crashed a few times, and now that he looks back to his normal self people are suspicious. I see where the dope allegations are coming from, but if dope didn't exist, the current scenario is still plausible.

Before blood doping of any kind, and steroids were used, lots of Grand Tours had guys with wide fluctuations in form.

Styrrell

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Styrrell

The weirdest thing about this thread is how the 'it must be doping' people . . .

Since I have yet to see anyone say "it must be doping," I'd say the weirdest thing is the number of people taking umbrage to expressions of skepticism and cynicism. I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! A rest day refill is just as legitimate an explanation for Contador's preformance these last two days as recovering from injury, riding into form, etc.

Hilarious!

From Velonews:

Delgado, who now works as analyst on Spanish television, was highly critical of the Schleck brothers. He said the Leopard-Trek climbers missed an opportunity to grab control of the race in the Pyrenees and have left Evans and Contador with opens to win.
“We’re seeing the Schleck brothers racing hand in hand, there isn’t a clear bet on which one will lead. They cannot break open the race. I think this is a mistake,” he said. “The ones that look strong — the Schlecks and their team — they haven’t been able to break open the race. They have lost two opportunities, at Luz-Ardiden and Plateau de Beille. They cannot make the same error. They have to select one of them, Andy or Frank. One hard attack as far as it goes and then see what happens. None of this attack, wait, attack, wait. This ‘brothers in arms’ tactic doesn’t work.”

I think he might know a thing or two about being a pro. I'm sure one of the experts will correct me on that.

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Suffer Well.

let provide my expert analysis for tomorrow. you will recall I was right about being wrong last time, so listen up:

contador first among the contenders tomorrow, voeckler still in yellow.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Jack, you are right more often when you predict Thor to win and then second guess yourself.

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Suffer Well.

Voeckler loses yellow tomorrow. Nothing against him. I just like seeing it change hands.

I'm a proud skeptic and cynic! But skepticism isn't free - with it comes responsibility! If you're going to put something out there and call it skepticism, you should be ready to defend your position against other skeptics. Primarily this means developing your hypothesis a little.

You and the other gentlemen seem to be implying that there is something that has HAPPENED in this tour that should be explained by doping. If you're going to say 'the only explanation for X (AC's sudden reversal of fortune) is Y (doping)' - it REALLY hurts your argument when it's not clear that X actually happened or is happening!

*WIN*

risk aversion is a possible explanation. A) he planned only to dope for the alps so he'd only need to pass a few checks while dirty or, b) he thought he didn't need it at all, but it became obvious he wasn't going to win without "assistance" in the pyrenees...

Plus contador talking like "yeah yeah my form will come around by the Alps" then it magically does....doesn't that seem suspicious? Almost like he has some sort of magical control over his fitness...I dunno. I'm highly cynical, but I think a guy like AC who's had SO much success while doping will lack confidence without it. So even if he planned to race au naturale this year, I bet his early misfortune led him back to his old ways.

all of the explanations thus far proffered in this thread are possible, or any combination thereof.

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Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Hardly an odd comparison. Cadel isn't really a climber either. When all the climbs are under 2000m, Jalabert does well. That's how he won the Vuelta where he got all 3 jerseys (overall leader, points, mountain)
He won 5 stages, and gave away a bunch of them (including one where he caught up to a solo breakaway, told the dude to get on his wheel and take turns, and then handed the victory to the rider).
Unfortunately for him, it never happens in the TdF that always has stages above 2000m.

So how does this mesh with his Giro performance?

that's a good point. Either he was mega dirty at the giro, or maybe he's clean this year. I don't really know, beyond a general inclination to be suspicious.

Its not thats its impossible for your scenario to be true, but thats a lot of speculation.

For one AC has only ever been caught doping once with a very minor amount of a drug thats not particularly effective, even in higher dosages. Sure he could be on massive amounts of stuff but they do test and for the most part massive amounts of dope during races seems like a thing of the past.

As to his magic powers over his fitness, he isn't new to this cycling thing. Most pro riders can tell you when they will peak and when they will be flat.

I can live with him planning to dope or not, but I can't see him dialing 1800 Cyclingdrugs during the tour. Avoiding positive tests pretty much means careful planning and protocals.

Styrrell

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Styrrell

I don't think we can look at them as two separate things. It's very clear over the history of the sport that you cannot race the Giro without it having some affect on your Tour performance. It's possible to do the double, but very very difficult.

If he were doping for the Giro he's likely doping for the TDF too. If he were trying to do the double, it just simply doesn't make much sense that you'd dope for the first one and not the second. The other way around? Makes more sense. Both? Makes the most sense, IMO.

If he were doping from day one of the season, would this doping prevent him from suffering the lack of form that other riders suffer when they're put on the deck repeatedly? Of course not. Even in the era of Armstrong and Ullrich, when a rider crashed multiple times, it would hurt them and put them off their form. It simply doesn't matter how much dope you inject - if you crash a lot, you'll be slowed in a race like the Tour.

The reason it doesn't make sense to pick out doping as the most likely reason for his *slight* return to form in recent days is because this is almost exactly the amount of time that it should take for someone to recover from minor injuries and find some form again. It becomes even less plausible when you realize that if he were doping, he would have been doping the whole time, not keeping something in his back pocket "just in case".

The biggest weakness with Evans is that he is pretty much always due for one "bad" day in every GT. He's had one hell of a Tour, as he really has been the best at reading the moves so far. He's been in the best position from the beginning and he's repeatedly known which moves to go with and then make counter moves. He has 2 mins on AC, so at this point in the game, all he needs to do is ride wheels (which will be an EPIC accomplishment considering the course over the next 2 stages), and he'll 99.9% be guranteed to win the Tour. I will absolutely be impressed if he can stay on wheels, and he'll be a champion if he can attack and stay away for sure.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

I would agree. To me it seems that there was a 'gentlemans' agreement this year, however, with the race being so close they are looking for any advantage they can get now. I heard (have not seen first hand) that AS had 3 controls on the rest day so it is obvious that the organizers are aware of this practice and that is why we have not seen big jumps in performance of the GC guys. The breakaway guys are putting out huge numbers after the rest day somehow (see files at www.trainingpeaks.com). I wouldn't be suprised if now that the rest day is over we don't start seeing a sudden improvement in AS. I think he thought these first 2 days would not be decided on the climb so no need to risk getting caught and wasting it on days that didn't require it. This is purely speculation of course.

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Ride Scoozy Electric Bicycles
http://www.RideScoozy.com

Lot's of theories, but I don't think it to far fetched to give Riis some credit for saying "Alberto, don't show your cards yet. Leopard trek and BMC have stronger teams, we lost time on the first few days, having Frank and Andy think they are stronger and taking responsiblity for the race is not a bad thing. You save your powder for the Alps and blow the doors of these bastards. They won't now what hit them."

I'll play.
GC 1,2,3 after:
Thursday: Evans, Contador, F Schleck.
Friday: Contador, Evans, Sanchez
Saturday: Evans, Contador, Basso

You heard it hear first.

I don't understand the risk aversion idea. If they think they can get away with doping, ie they have a plan for microdosing or similar, they will use it for the whole race. If they think the drugs they use will test positive they wouldn't use them when they can get tested.

Styrrell

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Styrrell

Well, AFAIK with the micro dosing you take it at 8pm and by 8am you are clear. If they start coming in at midnight you are in trouble. On the rest days they were probably doing more tests where it wouldn't have cleared in time. I don't know how they pick and choose who gets tested. It seems like a lot of work and risk to go through just to put in 1/5 of a bag and a small amount of epo so you don't violate the passport or test positive. Considering the climbing numbers have dropped 10% this year I think everybody is perplexed and doesn't know what to do. All those tattoos on their forearms might have been for nothing ;)

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Ride Scoozy Electric Bicycles
http://www.RideScoozy.com

This is how Jack. This is what's known as a "full-ass" attack.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiCIJ2JewPE

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Twenty-five years and my life is still
Trying to get up that great big hill
of hope
For a destination

A "proud skeptic and cynic," yet one with poor reading comprehension.

But if you can find one place where I said that it was the "only explanation," you might have a point.