Have you seen the Renn Kaiser? I know it's the same weight as the 5-7-5, not as light as the Madeira, but how cool does silver carbon look? That would look sweet on your Trek TT!

John3

Hey John3....yeah, I loooooove the silver Kaiser but as I have the 575 it wouldn't be much of an upgrade....

I have just ordered a Madeira from Frank at RENN in tubular version, at 980g it's like the 909 Zipp.....and have just sold the 575 disc to a buddy.....I sell to buy to keep the wife happy!!!!!

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Stephen Perera
Gibraltar, Europe
graphics@gibraltar.gi

Renn was already a winner with the 575, the madeira and kaiser are just to play a bit with those expensive brands ;-)

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=====================================
S�rgio Marques
When it hurts is when it feels good ;-)
Sergio-Marques.com

Will you be putting new graphics on it? Or will you stick with the basic Renn logo?

what y'all think...is it worth the extra $ for the madeira over the 575?

575 is 250 grams (8.8 oz) heavier

Good question.
Honestly, I have no idea.
The Madeira does have a really cool look to it.
Would I spend the extra money? Not right now. I don't need to save 250 grams to be faster than most of you guys.

The claimed weight of the Maderia is 980 g, and that of the Zipp disk is 965 g, a completely meaningless distinction (both are much lighter than HED light disk). So can anybody tell me why the Zipp is more than twice as expensive ($1350 vs. $650). Seriously. Are the bearings any different? What about the dimples? Is there any difference in construction? I had been planning on buying a zipp, but that was before I knew about the Renn. Is this 95% of the performance for 50% of the price, or is the zipp really a lot faster? I'm confused.

What are you using on the front with the renn disk?
-Colin

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Any run that doesn't include pooping in someone's front yard is a win.

Think of it this way; you can buy the Renn + a very nice front wheel for the same price of just the Zipp disc.

Dave in VA

Indeed, but that doesn't answer my question as to why the zipp is so much more.

-C

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Any run that doesn't include pooping in someone's front yard is a win.

"Indeed, but that doesn't answer my question as to why the zipp is so much more."
[EDIT] Bahh, gregk beat me to it and did a much better job. :-)
Well, Zipp is a large company--RENN is not. That's basically it, in a nutshell. So, there are a variety of factors that make the RENN disc much more affordable, most of them stemming from the fact that Zipp = large, RENN = small. I'm not a business major so I won't even try to explain.....but I doubt RENN spends as much in R&D, advertising, marketing, etc etc as Zipp does. These would be some reasons why Zipp is more expensive.

 I don't need to save 250 grams to be faster than most of you guys.
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Why don't you post some results so " most of us guys" can see for ourselves whether we should talk some smack right back atcha? ;-)

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Josef
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blog

Is the Madeira shipping yet? If not, anyone know when?

Hmmm, that is exactly the opposite of what I would think. When I think of a big company, I usually think of lots of resourses which lead to lower prices--think Trek. When I think of smaller, "boutique" companies, like Seven or Merlin, I think of higher cost and a higher "art factor" to the product.

So how does Frank Renn beat this paradigm?

-Colin

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Any run that doesn't include pooping in someone's front yard is a win.

"Indeed, but that doesn't answer my question as to why the zipp is so much more."

I haven't seen a Renn disc up close but to my eye there is a huge aesthetic difference between the zipp disc and the hed disc. I think the mavic and campy discs may also be similar quality and cost as the zipp, no? anyways, I look at the zipp and i see a finely crafted work of art - the hed disc is more like a box rim with 2 carbon panels stuck on - sort of like a permanent carbon CH aero cover. so the zipp appeals to bike lovers the same way a p3c does... price accordingly.

The weight reduction in the new Renn disc is in the hub only. The rotating weight is no different, so it will be a simular ride to the old discs. Remember rotating weight is where you want to loose it.

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"Your limits are self imposed"

I just got a 575 from Frank and took it into my LBS for set-up and cassette installation, etc. While we were at it we put the disc in the truing stand for a look.......

The results: The Renn was almost freaking perfect!! No movement at all! In fact the onwer of the shop (a Zipp Disc user) said that the Renn was the most true disc he had seen right out of the box! And in his opinion the hub was "the best, most solid thing" he'd seen as well.

I guess the small size of the company can leave some room for the owners to take pride in their work and workmanship. Based on my first impressions of my new 575, they have a bunch to be proud of!

My .02

Paul

Non-compensated Endorsement!

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Sponsored by RUDY PROJECT...check out http://www.e-rudy.com
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
"What does not destroy me, makes me stronger."
-Friedrich Nietzsche, Götzen-Dämmerung (1899)

>>>> The weight reduction in the new Renn disc is in the hub only.<<<<

This true??

no.....about 40 grams from the hub. the rest from the composite. the rims are the same. shipping some today. anything on order now will make it in march.

frank

why buy a Renn? There are so many reasons:

1. quality, as stated earlier, these wheels are very true, right out of the box with hubs that are very smooth.
2. price, great quality at a better price then the competition.
3. customer service that rivals Desoto, and we all know how great Emilio is with customer service, Frank took lessons from Emilio obviously.
4. Frank is one of us. He is an age group competitor that saw a need in the market and filled it. He's not some large corporate machine, just the little guy making a mark in a huge industry. To me this is just as important as any of the other selling points above. Frank is at the races, still racing as he was 15 years ago, albiet older and a bit slower as we all are.

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Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org

I think Frank keeps his prices relatively low by outsourcing most of the manufacturing. His hubs come from company XXX and the carbon/honeycomb comes from Company YYY. All Frank does is assemble them and ship them out. This seems to work well; I have a 5-7-5 and it’s pretty nice. I did have one problem with the hub but Frank corrected it fairly quickly.

Dave in VA

Roll on March!!!

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Stephen Perera
Gibraltar, Europe
graphics@gibraltar.gi

I have been racing on a Renn 650c clincher disc for 3 years. I have owned the wheels that begin with Z. The Renn and a Hed3 combo is the fastest out there, period. Wheels are not art. I could give a rats @#@ what color the stickers are. They have to go fast and hold up as well as be affordable. The new Renn disc is an improvement on what I have so it must be terrific. I just got back from the Evangeline Oak Du. I won 40-44 with a Renn, the overall winner also was on a Renn. There was also a Zipp 909 wheelset up at the front with us. My point, all the wheels are great, my wheelset cost $1000, the Zipps cost $1800 and the disc only comes in a tubular. If you need to spend $800 extra on stickers than you should go for it.

"Contest is over.....RENN wins...."

Wrong. At least from a performance perspective. The Renn is no faster than a $60 CH Aero cover or no slower than that $1500. brand xxxx disc.

A disc is a disc is a disc.

Bang for the buck - CH Aero cover. Best "real" disc- Renn for sure.

Frank,

I inquired about a track version and you mentioned that one was coming. Which disk, and will it be interchangeable between road and track? When might the track disk be available? This would be a great option, because I considered a Zipp for that particular reason. I didn't ride the track when I purchased my 575.

Also, can you explain the difference between the 575 and the Kaiser disks?

Thanks!

It's the dimples,,,,they are cute...Have you ever seen a golf ball fly??

we hope to have the track hub by april. it will be available in all models but it will not be a flip flop hub (work for road and track). it just can't work with our current tooling and fixtures. an adapter is possible but would be work to convert back and forth....just had an idea on that. back to the drawing board.....

5-7-5 versus kaiser....the only difference is the skin

frank

Hi all,

Maybe this is a dumb question, but I was wondering if the cardboard looking stuff (by the valve stem) inside my 575 disc will absorb water? Just paranoid about doing a race in the rain and ending up with a 25# sponge for a rear wheel! If it is absorbent, is a sticker or some electrical tape adequate to plug the hole around the valve stem?

I've raced mine in the rain with no problems. Though I do cover the valve hole with elec. tape.

I was worried about this aspect when I received my 575, but Frank assured me that it would not be a problem. I played the coward and sealed the area with some flexible sealent and have not experienced a problem since.

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"How bad can it be?" - SimpleS

I always cover the valve hole on both sides with black duct tape. Not for concern about water, but more about keeping the disk aero, and asthetically clean. You can pretty much leave one side on permanently, and pull the other side off to add air when necessary.

Thanks for the info Frank!

I figured that a replacement axle with different (narrower) spacers, and something that locked onto both axle and replaced the freehub body would do the trick. Having this option would be a big plus.

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Stephen Perera
Gibraltar, Europe
graphics@gibraltar.gi

Critique the position? Sure...

Seats a bit high, in fact the frame is probably one or two sizes too big.

For such a light rider that HED 3 up front might be a bear in crosswinds. You might consider a 303 or similar.

I also might recommend compact cranks for a rider like you who tends not to generate a lot of power.

By the way, is that your dad in the picture? Does he tri too?

Anyway, good luck on your races. It's nice to see the young'uns getting into the sport early. Don't forget to wear your helmet.

P.S. Nice RENN! :)

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Justin in Austin, get it? :)

Cool races:
- Redman
- Desoto American Triple T

heh heh heh...good one!

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Stephen Perera
Gibraltar, Europe
graphics@gibraltar.gi

I know that the disc shape of the wheel is the same for a Zipp, Hed or Renn, but isn't a major factor in speed, the quality of the hub? Also a hugh factor is the lateral stiffness of the wheel. Does anyone have any information on the lateral stiffnesses (?) of the three wheels?

thanks,

Mike

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http://www.MikeCaiazzo.com
http://www.USProTri.com

Is it okay to put duct tape on a disk?

Will it damage the carbon?

And, is it necessary aerodynamically?

I have a Renn and can confirm that the hub works VERY well!

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TheBikeRacer.com

Duct tape is safe. No issues to worry about. Black preferred :)

Taping the hole is not necessary, but why leave it exposed in a TT where every second could count.

Big Mac wrote: Is it okay to put duct tape on a disk?

Will it damage the carbon?

And, is it necessary aerodynamically?

1) Yes, but don't tape a disk to a duck, nor should one tape a duck to a disk.

2) No, as long as it doesn't peck on it.

3) No, a disk with a duck taped to it doesn't fly, but, it will float...so will very small rocks (insert apologies to Monty Python). Although, I do tape the valve cover hole on my Renn, simply because I do not want people to know I put air in my tires.

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Quid quid latine dictum sit altum videtur
(That which is said in Latin sounds profound)

Egad! Duct tape? That's belt-fed REDNECK!!!! And messy to boot!

Try a small piece of thinner, clear packing tape...or that stupid bumper sticker you got in your last race bag...

Black duct tape has a texture pretty close to the Renn disk itself. I cut it to match the existing hole, and apply it with some tension so it stays pretty tight. I wouldn't use the grey stuff just for cosmetic reasons. Here again, we're splitting hairs, but since there is basically no real cost, why not?

Clear tape just looks plain "tacky"... as in poor taste (not sticky as in tape). I'd say the same thing about a "stupid bumper sticker". At least use something black... unless of course you've got the Renn Kaiser Disk - then use silver :)

Anybody get their Madeira yet?