I have bought all of my triathlon gear new. Bikes, Kickrs, treadmills, etc. Nothing used.

Yes, I could go used as well. But I found that it took far too much of my time to be worth the money savings. For something as pricey as a Velotron though, I'd def consider used.

I bet most of the people here don't buy anything used either, for similar or other reasons.

I have used used a Kickr, so obviously a little biased. I have a Computrainer. Got it on Ebay for $900 (free shipping). Check on ebay as there are always a few up there. Sometimes they are as cheap as $750, but watch as the shipping could jump up another $100. If someone selling you a CT says the software is included...it is not. They might send you the discs but you have to register the software before you can use it. And the previous owner already registered it, so you are going to have to pay $60 to Racermate for another copy. Or go with another software (also $$) or you can download the old versions of Racermate from their website.
Also think about if you have a computer or laptop that you can easily hook it up to. I am an IT geek, so I had a spare HTPC that I installed Racermate on and leave in the basement to run the CT. So that could be extra costs. With the Kickr, double check to make sure you ipad/iphone or whatever will work with it as that could be extra costs too.

I really enjoy my CT. I use it 4x week in the winter and 2x week in the summer. Never popped a tire or had mechanical issues yet (1yr old). You do have to calibrate it each time you want to train on it, but as mentioned by another poster, I use that as my warmup. If you just want to ride it like a trainer on an easy day, you can even skip the calibration.

I dont think you could go wrong with either option. Probably comes down to costs. Trainer + Software + computer/tablet/etc.

There is a new "videogame" coming out that both of these should be able to use. Zwift where you can race other people around the world. Thinking about it, Ill start a thread on it if one doesnt exist.

---

Jeff Abbott - @run1fast
jabbott@headsweats.com
Headsweats - Custom Team singlets $8 / Cycling Jerseys $25
Abbott Event Solutions - Brand Rep and Event Manager

They are both great systems and a significant step up from using a regular trainer. I'm partial to the CT but I know people who like the Kickr and get good use out of it. The only hesitation on the Kickr side may be that I've seen a variety of thread topics about trying to keep the calibration figures consistent over time or within a reasonable mark of another power meter. I'm sure there are some CT units that have drifted over time, but in general I get the impression that the CT is quite stable year over year in its power measurement. It's too early to pass judgment on the Kickr in this regard but its also too early to pronounce them as having the kind of long term reliability that the CT is known for.

I scored a Computrainer Pro model 8002


Includes the following:


All necessary cables and accessories
- cadence sensor
- Polar heart rate reciever
- power cord
- power supply
- handlebar controller mounting bracket
- Computer-To-Computrainer USB ComPort Cable
- manuals
- Front wheel Stand


Shipped to my door for $800.


My next question is is the software downloadable upon purchase or does RacerMate ship a disc? Would I be better off with RaceMateOne or ProPref Studio seeing as I'm a single person using this?

---

------
"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"

You get a CD with the Racermate One software on it, but then when the program runs it will download updates off the internet.

Racermate One software works pretty good if you have a decently fast computer. I usually run Sufferfest videos in a separate window and then run the Racermate One training software file for that specific Sufferfest video, so the wattage automatically changes to match the video. Works great. Then I download the workout files into Golden Cheetah.

Ergvideos are also very good, but they are pricey.

You know you can control the CT directly in GC.
In the GC training tab you click the CT, the Erg file and the video.
Press "Go" and it just works. At the end, the workout file is in GC.

So you have everything in one environment.

So to summarize buying a computrainer is only worth it if you buy a used one at a discount? Seems that most computrainer users (in this thread and others) would not purchase a brand new one due to cost. For those who are pro computrainer is that accurate?

I've been trying to decide what to buy (kickr, used computrainer, vs new computrainer). Buying a used one seems to be a bit of buyer beware, buying a new one seems roobish, and the kickr seems to be a good purchase but it may die out/have issues in the near future (similar to a used computrainer).

My logic :
If you buy used you will save how much ? $400-$500 ?
It will last you ten years. You saved $40-50 per year ?
New, peace of mind, knowing where it comes from. Is it worth $40-50 per year ?
The time you will spend on this thing...is peace of mind worth it ?

There is not a piece of equipment I own that I trust as much as my CT.

Zwift is the "Update on my ANT+ program (with pics)" thread.

Other CT options:

For simulated riding:
-Tour de Giro (I'm biased, I make it). It lets you race people online or offline, and is already out. Race any GPX course you want.
-Racermate One - Race any course profile offline.
-RealCourseVideo
-Veloreality

For computerized workouts:
-ErgVideo
-Trainerroad
-Golden Cheetah

That's all I can think of at the time.

---

STAC Zero Trainer - Zero noise, zero tire contact, zero moving parts. Suffer in Silence starting fall 2016

Yes, but I could never figure out how to get the video to play in GC nor how to setup all the windows the way I want to display thinks like TSS, normalized power, and w/kg, which is easy to show in Racermate One.

I probably just need to sit down with GC for about 20 minutes and try and figure it out. Would be nice to not have to import the ride file after each ride.

I bought mine new 4 years ago and consider it a wiser long term investment than my bikes.

Well for me, owning a Computrainer worked out well. I have a dedicated exercise room with a trainer bike, so things like wires and the cadence sensor are not an issue. I also have a dedicated PC computer and LCD projector.

I'd probably get a Kickr if I owned an ipad and planned to move my trainer around on a regular basis. I'd also think the Kickr is a better choice if you plan to use your race bike and don't want to wear out your good race tire.

Or buy a new KICKR for the same price as a used CT.

The KICKR technology is also of this century.

---

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

Century? Are photos on paper or books better than the stuff on those 8 inch discs you cannot read anymore?

There is nothing the KICKR can do that the CT cannot do, for what I need, and better.

But I guess this just comes down to what is the best diet? KICKR fad diet? Well, since I never have to diet, the CT just works and works and works. I will leave the fancy stuff to others, unless I see them all beating
me in races.

.

---

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

A lot of those guys beating you in races don't even use a CT and just ride a bike - gasp!

[/quote] A lot of those guys beating you in races don't even use a CT and just ride a bike - gasp![/quote]

There are many reasons to have a CT or KICKR or another trainer other than worrying about whether someone who beats you in a race trains on one or not.

A lot of those guys beating you in races don't even use a CT and just ride a bike - gasp![/quote]

There are many reasons to have a CT or KICKR or another trainer other than worrying about whether someone who beats you in a race trains on one or not.[/quote]
I use a Kickr myself - I was just responding tongue in cheek to the post directly above mine

If you receive discs for Coaching Software (CS), 3D, or MultiRider, there is no registration required and the software will run just fine. If you receive a Real Course Video, you will have to register it (and it really helps if the person you bought it from sends RacerMate an email saying they're no longer using it). If you receive a RacerMate One disc, you may have to re-register it (you'll have to email Roger at RacerMate and try) or buy another copy of RacerMate One ($59.95). There are no old versions of "RacerMate" on the website.

How many are beating me in my Age bracket let alone younger? Do a little age grading and give me results. Oh yep, all the ones with coaches also.

.

---

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

You're confusing update frequency with transmission rate. The ANT+ transmission rate is irrelevant if it only sends it's data 4 times per second. As I said, it's done this way to conserve battery life. They COULD send updates 400 or more times per second but choose not to.

The CT being 2400 baud or 1200 baud is irrelevant. It can send more than enough data (transmission rate) over 400 times per second (update frequency) even if it was 1200 baud. The relevant point is it's sending cadence data over 400 times per second so the CT can keep track of exactly where the cranks are.

Note: I'm not saying spinscan is useful, I don't use it. BUT, in order for it to work it requires significantly more updates per second than ANT+ (current standard) provides (despite it's capability). The CT folks have stated they can't ANT+ support for spinscan until ANT+ sends more frequent updates.

http://www.racermate.net/...ilit=spinscan#p22342


Just to back up the bus a bit and elaborate. Your original response was "you've been had". That is incorrect. Your explanation for why was also incorrect, as you responded about block size. ANT+ while capable of updating frequently enough and enough data, the current standard only allows for it to send 4 updates a second. The CT, using a serial connection, has no such limitations on frequency of updates. Again, feel free to consult the link I posted and contact the CT folks if you believe current ANT+ cadence sensors are sending more than 4 updates every second.

Lets do the math -- and remember the baud rate is from a USB/Serial adapter, the UART in the computrainer

8bits + 1stop bit = 9 bits per byte
1200 baud = 133 bytes per second
42 byte message (6x7 including all other telemetry*) = 3 updates per second.

And you raise a good point, it is effectively 1200 baud (not 2400) because there is downstream data sending 56 byte command messages. Although the NXP 8C501 they use is technically capable of much higher rates. It is probably limited to such a slow rate because it only has 256 bytes of addressable memory to store all that massive amount of data in. To be fair it was developed almost 35 years ago, when 1k ram was a lot.

Lets not pretend this is advanced technology collecting large amount of data and updating at high speed. My toaster would run rings around it.

As for ANT+ 4hz to save battery, I spy a mains power block so thats not much of an issue on an electronic trainer.
Thats why the Kickr does and can handle higher rates via ANT+ and BTLE.

Cheers
Mark

* I reverse engineered it, with a little help.

What does the CT do better? My impression was you just throw it in ergo mode, so I'm ignoring the differences in simulation or video software. I would likely do the same, since I'd rather watch netflix, so I'm just wondering what else the CT does better.

I would say not a lot and I have both.

Kickr has;
- bigger flywheel and better road feel
- no wires and crap on your bike
- works with idevices, PC, Mac and Linux
- has firmware updates all the time
- can attach any bike regardless of wheel size
- no setup hassles, just pop off back wheel and go
- open apis no secret code
- is being developed actively e.g set resistance via PM readings
- supports bluetooth and ant+

CT has;
- spinscam
- Ergvideo
- no open api *
- handlebar controller

Mark

* the support outside of ergvideo and rm1 is despite not because of Racermate.

The referenced link returns a '404 Not Found' error! Isn't the 4x per second rate set by the profile on the device that is receiving the data? I ask because I seem to recall reading about some guys re-verse engineering the Tacx Bushido's proprietary ANT+ signals and when they pared an SRM with an ANT+ simulator to compare power data, the dump had significantly more data for the sample period than would result from a refresh of only 4-times per second.

---

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Both are excellent choices.

CT's are more practical for a multirider studio. Time required to make bike changes, proven reliability, robustness and flexibility is money in a studio environment.

Much easier to fit and remove a rider's bike than on a Kickr (something that matters when you are doing frequent bike changes), can use a wider variety of bikes (not confined to the drivetrain on the Kickr), and TT bikes in particular with their horizontal drop outs are a PITA when having to do a fast change over.