V-doping or not, what you're experiencing is people cat'ing down which ironically is what you're doing. It's pretty common and continues to worsen. For example: in a recent race, the majority of D's were riding at B level. Think about how the true D racers feel when basically the entire group leaves them in the dust on the flats at the beginning of every race.

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Nanoo Nanoo

This is why I include my IRL race category and license number in my Strava profile. I "won" the Euro training A race last Thursday and didn't get too much static about it, but when I've had people ask about my performance I generally just point them in the direction of actual results or ride files that can back up what I do on the trainer. I also don't ride with a heart rate monitor so that makes people suspicious at times.

I think instead of trying to fix "cheating", Zwift should just give the community the ability to organize races or leagues that are self governed. I'd rather they focus on big picture functionality than micro managing training races.

Wonder what they assume is a proper power-to-CdA for everyone?

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AndyF
bike geek

Not a Zwift'er (live somewhere I can bike year-round), but this seems the most sensible. End goal is to have a good workout and proper drag race (motivation that is so hard to find on a trainer), so even if there's a bunch of folks gaming the system/miscalibrated/etc, who really cares? (Answer, a lot of people, honestly!) At some point, legit riders will still be legit riders and Zwift kings/queens will abruptly strike reality.

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The question of who is right and who is wrong has seemed to me always too small to be worth a moment's thought, while the question of what is right and what is wrong has seemed all-important.

-Albert J. Nock

I had looked at the results and avg speeds of some of the prior races and I did feel bad about putting myself in a lower group than is recommended. I didn't feel so bad after the race.

What is the best way to improve this? Maybe the top ten of cat D, C and B should all be moved up a group respectively. This may make the groups more honest than just bumping up the top rider.

My outdoor group rides often have power numbers equal or higher than my Zwift rides. In fact, for similar ride times, my outdoor ride Intensity scores on Strava are almost always higher. I assume because there are many more short jumps of speed/high wattage in real life.

Zwift rides/races on the other hand have much lower wattage spikes and are much closer to racing a flat or rolling TT than a crit or road race.

Don't feel bad. It sucks to get dropped early in a race and I'm guessing that is one of the reasons people cat down. It's pretty common to read a post where someone got dropped so they are downgrading. You just have to keep in mind that everyone except the winner gets dropped (and sometimes even the eventual winner gets dropped early on). Because there's no points/series/prizes behind any of this, it might be best to just do what works best for you until Zwift creates a race module.

If I were hosting a race series, I wouldn't have any Categories but I would award points. Although a little off-topic, I'd have 2 neutral rider leaders, one you should pace off of and ideally be behind (in-game name of LEADER-LEADER-LEADER or something really obvious) and one 5 or so seconds up the road that you are DQ'd if you are ahead of when the neutral first ends (in-game name of DQ-DQ-DQ-DQ-DQ-DQ). Races starts would be communicated through TeamSpeak.

My hopes are that when a race module is introduced that there'll be official Cat's or a rating similar to ftp associated with each rider's profile that can be upgraded based on performances. Organizers could then define their categories based on this rating and even allow for overlap to account for those that want the option of riding with a slower or faster group.

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Nanoo Nanoo

A little off topic, but there seems to be enough Slowtwitch folks on Zwift to have a group ride.

Kinda boring with all of us in the aerobars staying 4 bike lengths apart. ;)

Don't worry everyone, I am on almost every day slaying the V-dopers and taking the lap-jersey with real power numbers and a real weight. I can't touch those ridiculous KOMs and sprints some times but I can usually outlast the cheaters. I also have a clean record for the century on Richmond, so that's something.

Front door bragging aside, yeah the cheaters suck. Bothers me even more when they defend doing 450w for 2 hours on their Strava file and get indignant about it. Such is life.

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Professional Athlete: http://jordancheyne.wordpress.com/ http://www.strava.com/athletes/145340

Coaching Services:http://www.peakformcoaching.com/

LOL .... True. Then this ride would have to be draft legal .... And on, god forbid ..... road bikes.

I did two A races. I got dropped.

I did a B race. I got dropped.

Now I don't do Zwift at all. Youtube is much more enjoyable.

I'm a cat 1 in real life.

So I just have to set my mag trainer to 1, lie about my weight and kick some ass for a false sense of accomplishment.

So, where is the biological passport (equivalent) for Zwift? I'm on a TVS with legit weight and a recent FTP test at 3.1 w/kg. Most of the rides I've participated in seem ok, based on w/kg. But I can see the occasional wonky combo of HR and w/kg - perhaps zpower, perhaps honest errors, perhaps something else. Still, I'd rather be in a group that pushes me rather than a ramping down to slay other riders with fabricated data.

I agree...its just so...laughable? Other day I saw a dude blow up a climb at 18-somthing watts/kg. I mean, really?

I can attest to this. I often see Jordano's avatar out there and find it pretty funny when he has the 2nd best time to someone riding with zpower. Yeah right!

Regarding races, I've done a few and generally find it is a great workout and that at least the ones I've tried seem a bit self-regulating. The zpower guys get called out and the guys I ended up working in a group with have some legit looking strava profiles, so it all seemed pretty fair to me. I do think that if you think you are the baddest guy in town based on usually being at the front of your small town local group ride, you are going to find zwift a bit humbling. The talent pool out there is pretty deep.

Interesting feedback on w/kg you've seen for your buddies who did zwift races. I haven't done many, but last Tue I did ZTR-EB (the Euro time fits my schedule better) and finished toward the back of the A (top 10-ish), but well ahead of any of group B, with ~280 watts average for the race at 145 lbs, or around 4.25 w/kg, so I'd actually be at the low end of what you thought of as group B (maybe the US timezone races are harder?). I will say that I've zwifted a lot and worked on my drafting there (definitely a bit of an art to timing efforts to stay in the draft), so maybe I'm doing it more efficiently than average. Regardless of which group you end up in, as long as there is some group that pushes you a bit, I think it is a pretty awesome workout.

yeah people with zPower should have a dif board.

I like it cause I can see my own improvements over time but the leader board is a shit show.

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The entire event (IM) is like "death by 1000 cuts" and the best race is minimizing all those cuts and losing less blood than the other guy. - Dev

This happens alot, I like when local riders post there Zwift workouts on Strava and you know the wattage is total BS. Stava needs to add a new button beside Kudos..."Your kidding yourself"

i-sandbaggin? lol

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The entire event (IM) is like "death by 1000 cuts" and the best race is minimizing all those cuts and losing less blood than the other guy. - Dev

Not to anyone in particular...

While I haven't ridden with a group yet I seem to find someone that is riding my pace after about 20 minutes and then we seem to stick together until one of us is done.

I find it enjoyable to ride with someone like that and just ignore the few people flying by at 8 W/Kg. I may look up some C rides soon just to see what it's like.

jaretj

Not all of us zPower folk are bad. Some of us make a point of ensuring that our power accurately reflects what we can do on the road.

 
Inthinknse people on the training races are definitely lying about there weight or something is up with there power meter. I did the A race las thirsday and was putting out 32-360w in the group before the 1st climb and then up the climb I was hitting 500w breathing out of my ass and all I could do was watch the group ride off.

I'm 77KGs. It's all good Training but I think some of these guys need to race pro cycling. The other week I did watopia reverse and first time up the climb I did around 450 for 4 minutes and a few guys put about 15 seconds into me up the hill. It could be right I don't know but bearing in mind it's a mid week training race I'm surprised by how much power some of the people on there are putting out.

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Triathlete specializing in 70.3 Distance and Ironman.

joeskipper.co.uk

"lying" is a pretty strong accusation there. I do suspect that there may be some slightly "in my favor" fudging, where people have a tendency to enter their "racing weight" and not their current weight. Or maybe just the more simple error that every time they hit a new lowest weight they think to update the weight, but then dismiss higher weights as a one off "mistakes". You would expect a similar thing with power meters. Few people complain, recalibrate carefully, etc if their PM is reading a few watts high, but god forbid it reads a little low and suddenly a full on debug session is on order. But as I said in some other posts, when I look at the resume's of some of the big hitters in the race I did, I was impressed, so some of it is just that there are some beasts out there. From what I've seen of the Cat 1/2 guys I know, 6 w/kg for 4 minutes is not at all crazy and wouldn't be a sign of "lying". That is what they do every week at our local worlds ride.

 
I stand by what I say and think that a lot of them are lying. I'll still do it as it gives me a good workout.

The think is there not doing 6W/kg for 4 minutes I'm doing that after rising at tempo/threshold going Into the climb and I'm getting spat like there's no tomorrow. The tip guys are doing a lot more then that and then still riding at 5w/kg+ for the next 40-50 minutes.

I've raced as an elite on the road in road races in England at premier calandar level and a professional criterium series and i think the standard in them races is higher.

I take it like a pinch of salt and it's improving my cycling so I'll keep going back. Just find it sad how people would take a few kilos off there weight to win a virtual race! Surely the only thing that matters is 'real life' racing.

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Triathlete specializing in 70.3 Distance and Ironman.

joeskipper.co.uk