The only way anyone or (we) is/are going to get their point across to WTC is quit REGISTERING for WTC races. The end!

I would support a boycott.

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Oh yeah!

Bottom line, like anything one buys, is read the contract before purchasing. So, if you can show me in the registration process from WTC and active that WTC no complete their contract for what folks paid for,
then law suits should follow. BUT, if WTC, or any other product was purchased and before the purchase was made, the terms where written down, please help me understand how WTC did not up hold their part of the
contract? Things happen in our sport and races get changed, period. If one does not like this "business", then why are people buying the product, and then AFTERwards, bitching that somehow that the terms of the contract they signed and paid for were not followed?

As another poster just AGAIN posted, if you do not like the product, why are you buying? And the excuses that they are the only game in town is well, ... As long as they fill up their races, it is clear their business
model is a perfect one. Any Triathlon knows the FEW type A's that bitch with still sign up, so they are just ignored. That is what I did for the race I was an RD for. And if they did not sign up next year, great,
one less bitchy person to deal with. And I never had issues filling up my race.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

highly trained athletes! Lmfao

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Oh yeah!

I agree here. The only modification to the race should have been canceling the swim. The air temp was not the issue, but after thrashing in the water for 30 minutes I was toast. Just like you my bike did not reflect the effect (1:13 bike), but the best I could manage was 30 watts less than my HIM target at a HR that was 15 BPM higher than normal.

I live in Georgia where I have trained in the extreme heat for a while and have had pretty good races at some hot / humid location (70.3 Texas and Gulf Coast) earlier this year. I don't know how anyone could have preped for an 88 degree swim.

you didn't train in a hot tub to get ready?

Yep thanks for the second...I can't believe no one else is talking about this. If USA swimming cuts off OWS at 85 and heat is the issue, how the hell can they justify 90??? And while I'm in Chicagoland now I trained/raced in Austin the past 3 years, and the air temp was just like a Texas race in the summer (hot but doable). The race should have been a 56 mike/13 run.

Interesting to hear your numbers. I must confess I tore an ab muscle in Feb and hadn't swam basically at all since so I wasn't sure if it was just my lack of swim fitness, but I really put no effort into that swim and was still up around 175 BPM coming out of the water and I just couldn't get the number down either, so my power was much lower than planned and I was too heated up to run.

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__________________________

Oh yeah!

My pool's regular temp is 85-86º. Despite the fact that I have asked politely more than once to turn it down, it stays. They gotta keep it warm enough for the active older adults, who out number me in both manpower and trips to the facility. I train there regularly without much of an issue. Just like the advice for the other legs, you need to adjust your pace to match the conditions. This includes OW, regardless of what USA swimming allows or doesn't allow.

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

USA Swimming also considers the 5K to be the 'short' open water race, not the 1.2 miles or less you see at 95%+ of triathlons. Pretty much every sprint triathlon around here from June through mid-October happens in 85F+ temperatures, but even for the turtles, you aren't spending an insane amount of time in the water for a 600M sprint swim.

Oh dear! What do we do about Badwater?

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Shorten it and run it the other way.......Surely humans can't function in heat like that?


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I don't care what distance it is, it does not make any sense to swim in 90 degree water let alone trying to run in 100 degree temperatures on a though course.


Or, since most triathlons are raced in the summer and in hot locations, people can train accordingly. I don't understand why people have such a hard time with this concept. Surely someone out there knows what the summers can be like in the hot parts of the country but they agreed to set up the race there and people can easily assess the risk of hot temperatures. Why on earth would you go to all the trouble to set up a race and then cancel it just because it's hot, in a not part of the country?

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I know,I don't get it either,one would think that nobody has ever lived in hot areas let alone compete in triathlons in the heat.People have been doing this kind of stuff and more in hot conditons for decades but it seems only now that it is such an issue.Yes it can be dangerous but hey people could always try slowing down and actually adapt to the conditions of the day.

I know we are a tough bunch down here but seriously you Yanks make us look like super-heroes as here are a few events that we go to specifically because they are bloody hot...;-)

www.hellofthewest.com

www.dirtndust.com

www.crocodile-trophy.com
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Pathetic on so many fronts it is hard to fathom.

For the record; I have had nothing to do with this event since 2007 and I raced it 7 times with all my staff and training mates over 200 times or more. Plus volunteering for 12 years and the Rd for 4.

With that said; are you crazy, insanely self-centered or both? The statement that this is your first 1/2 says it all. Have you ever stood out at a volunteer aid station for 12 hours in this heat? No, probably not. To suggest the race should have just ran as advertized is nuts.

Do you really think it is fine to risk the lives of all those people; 1,200 volunteer alone, just so you can justify your $1,500? Wow. Guess a human life is not worth much. I rode back to my house after the race at 1pm and it was the hottest ride in my life after 40 years of biking. There must have been 500 walking still from 11:30-12:30. I can tell you for a fact it would have been tragic to ask anyone to be out there after 2pm. Period.

BTW, many of those volunteers started at 3am.

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STIndiana
America Multi-Sport, Inc.
America's Half June 10, 2017
USAT RD Century Club
http://www.americamultisport.com

Why would your volunteers need to stand at an aid station for 12hrs at a 70.3 race or for that matter at an Ironman race.Why would you require of your volunteers that they do a 12hr shift anyway.

People do full shifts working in the heat every day on construction sites and other outdoor jobs.

Just admit that the race was shortened due to fear of litigation and we will all go away quietly.
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How many triathlons have you produced and how many 70.3 distance events or event a sprint tri for that matter have you volunteered for?

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STIndiana
America Multi-Sport, Inc.
America's Half June 10, 2017
USAT RD Century Club
http://www.americamultisport.com

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Enough but you still haven't answered my question as to why a volunteer would need to stand at an aid station for a period of time that exceeds the leg cut-off by hours....Why would the bike course volunteers need to be out there for 12 hrs?Why would the run course volunteers need to be out there for 12 hrs in a 70.3 race..How about doing what is sensible and rotate shifts..

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Ultra-tri-guy wrote:

Just admit that the race was shortened due to fear of litigation and we will all go away quietly.

Okay. Done. Now just admit that litigation is only an increased fear because an increased number of people actually can get hurt in those conditions and we can all move along to a new topic finally :).

We are all just talking in circles about two pretty legitimate points of view IMO.

Do you really think it is fine to risk the lives of all those people; 1,200 volunteer alone


Now the volunteers lives are at risk? It's getting hotter all the time at Muncie. In a week it will have been the hottest place in the entire Universe on race day.

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Oh I have no doubt that some people can get hurt and have already admitted that someone I dropped dead on the highway during The Trans Australia Footrace..We have people die in Oz every year during events but you know what sometimes that happens.Hell we had one guy years ago who lost a leg because his quads liquified after he fell over at the finish of a hot run..Yes it is sad but it happens...............My issues with WTC is that they are cutting legs from races,shortening races and altering races at an ever increasing rate,so much so that it now becoming commonplace.Cold,hot,waves,blah,blah,blah...Where is it going to end?

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Sadly, this is exactly what we are talking about in our great sport. Those that have done little to nothing bitch to those of us who have done almost everything. Unless you have been on a race team and see how this all works; you would have no idea what happens behind the finish line.

Many volunteers show-up at 3am because they love this sport; some we even have to threaten, nicely, to not come out before then!

They start with set-up, then body mark, then ride a kayak till the swim is over, jump on a moto and take an official on the course till 2pm, then catch finishers and put them in the med tent, help with awards and then stay till clean up which requires 2 orders of pizza delivered and maybe get home at midnight.

Shifts of volunteers is a nice idea for those that have never organized an event. Sounds good on paper right? How do they first wave of volunteers get out mid-day when the roads are closed for 1,800 athletes? Oh, here is an idea. Let's stop the non-stop flow of athletes so we can switch volunteers out of a remote aid station.

Answer the question; have you ever done any of this? I have. And BTW; I raced all 7 events after volunteer 75 hours race week.

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STIndiana
America Multi-Sport, Inc.
America's Half June 10, 2017
USAT RD Century Club
http://www.americamultisport.com

Do not even try to ask a fair question. Most of these folks just bitch, and have never helped. I have put on races. I help at tons. Just getting enough help to put on a race is NOT easy!
And I have been out helping for 10 hour shifts in the heat and it is much harder than racing! The RD did the right thing to shorten the race. Maybe should have canceled the swim also.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I have no doubt that there are a few volunteers that do very long days on race day (as I have at many races ) but you,in your post for dramatic effect,made it sound like all of your 1,200 volunteers were out there standing by an aid station for 12 hrs,which of course,they weren't...I'll be putting in probrably 13 hrs at IMC this year and during that time I'll be sure to be a responsible adult and make sure I prepare for that long day,just like the athletes should.

Oh and yes,many big races actually have volunteer captains to look after their volunteer army..I am thinking that as that is the norm for WTC Ironmans perhaps the 70,3's should follow suit.


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Yes and of course none of us have any idea what it takes to put on a big triathlon but then again how the fuck would you know as you don't even know anything about what some of us have done?

But hey I will defer to you knowledge and just act like I have never worked at any race ever,Hell while I'm at it lets pretend I've never completed a triathlon either..What on earth would I know?


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Global warming will turn Triathlon into a winter sport.

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sometimes