So apparently the Flo 30 has an ERD of 577.5 (http://flocycling.blogspot.com/...-30-rim-is-here.html).

The chart seems to suggest about 286 mm spokes for the Powertab GS hub, though it also says "add/subtract for nipples and washers" (http://www.powertap.com/...le%20Hub%20Chart.pdf)

As for the front, DT Swiss has an insanely detailed calculator where I have no clue how to fill in half the boxes (https://spokes-calculator.dtswiss.com/en/calculator)

Seriously, it's like cycling companies go out of their way to make this stuff impenetrable to newbies. :(

If I enlarge the budget for something like the Flo 45s (interestingly, they left the weight field blank on the Flo page for the rims, maybe because they're still in development?), then it seems like other options come into play, too. Originally it seemed crazy to spend 1K+ on wheels, and for a not-exactly-aero road bike no less, but these are going to be what I ride a few times a week for the coming years, so I do want to make a choice with which I'll be really happy.

Remember that ERD is a calculation including the nipples and hub that YOU choose. The ERD listed is what our set up measures. If your local shop is building this wheel for you, they should be comfortable calculating the right value.

Take care,

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Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

We are getting final measurements soon. We haven't even seen the rims yet ourselves. Of course we've seen them in our wheels, but we are just starting to sell them as "rim only". We'll have a group of them here in the US for official measurements soon.

Take care,

---

Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

Thanks, Chris, that makes sense.

Flo 45s definitely look like an interesting option if I push the budget up (assuming I could snag them at the next sale!).

Another option at that pricepoint is the Powertap-branded AMP 35/50 carbon clincher, rim is apparently manufactured by Reynolds, available on sale for almost the same price. But there's limited info online about those, both on this forum and elsewhere.

Still kinda torn on wheels.

Recapping, I have a 2013 Specialized Roubaix Sport Compact with Redshift dual-position seatpost and aerobars that's my all-purpose road and tri bike since I started doing triathlons sporadically a year and a half ago. The OEM wheels are Axis 1.0, a combination of a DT Swiss rim with a generic hub. The wheels are fairly heavy, have a very modestly aero shape, and are quite narrow (exact specs aren't available online). I'm currently running a 23mm Conti GP4000 on the front, with a modest mushroom profile, and a 25mm in the back, serious mushrooming (good from a comfort perspective, probably not great from a handling perspective).

I'm at no risk of podiuming in the tris (so far two Olympics and a 70.3) I've done since I start this sport just over a year ago, so I care more about overall ride quality than raw speed. I ride along the Pacific with a ton of crosswinds, and don't care that much about squeezing out a little more speed, so deep aero wheels make little sense. I doubt I'll upgrade to a full tri bike in the foreseeable future. I want one set of wheels for training and sporadic racing.

With the current Powertap GS hub sale, I've been thinking of building up replacement wheels. I want a jack-of-all-trades training and occasional racing wheel. I've done a fair bit of research online. I'm mulling a few options:

- Flo 30: Really like the width (19.4mm internal) on which 25mm tires should fit well (though Flo recommends 23mm), some aero benefit, reasonable weight, get great reviews, like Flos engagement here, can build these up with Powertap GS and excellent front hub for $850.

- Powertap AMP 35/50 or 50/50: Full carbon wheel, a bit older design and have been on sale for a while, a bit less wide (17mm internal), obviously more aero, similar weight as Flo 30, can build these up for $1400.

Flo 45: Full carbon wheel, I'm guessing a bit more aero than the AMP 50s but similar, not as wide as Flo 30 (17mm internal), similar weight, could build these up for $1500.

There are obviously plenty of other options. I don't think I can justify spending more, $1500 is already more than I spent on the (lightly used) bike. And let's be frank, I don't care that much about squeezing out a little more speed, more interested in a reliable wheel that handles well. I'm leaning toward the Flo 30 option, but this is my chance to get something a bit nicer, too. Decisions, decisions...

Just buy this (Flo 30's with a Powertap already built in) and save the money since you'll be new to power and don't want to kill your band account.

Just to clarify this is not my posting, just a quick eBay search.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/291813380380

Flo 30 build is probably my top contender right now. Appreciate the Ebay link, but I'd probably buy it new, rather than save a few hundred bucks on an old Powertap that's likely going to need servicing and wheels that have a solid number of miles on them.

It's interesting that the different Flos have varying internal widths. 30s are 19.4mm, 45s are 17mm, 60s are 18mm, 90s are 17mm. I thought Flo designed them all to have the same brake track width, but that seems to vary a bit, too.

The width on Flo rims depends on depth and aerodynamics.

I only have one beef with the flo 30s: they're a huge pain in the ass to mount tires too.

Have someone do it who really knows how to build wheels. Most LBS do not. Seriously, most of them are pure hacks. A properly built wheel should never need truing and last until the rim wears out or you break something. Alternatively you can read up how to do it yourself and take your time.

The Pacenti SL23 mentioned earlier is one you should consider. About 100g lighter each vs Flo30. It isn't for speed but rather your mention of a "lively feel". The gyro effect is pretty significant.

EDIT: I'd forget carbon rims for your daily riders.

Forget that! Don't waste money on race wheels and training wheels. Think about it, you actually end up spending more money to ride crappier wheels most of the time. Besides, every day is race day ;-p

FWIW, my 404's have been the only wheelset I've owned the last 4 years, they've been bombproof, and they're not even the toughest wheels on the market. Carbon wheels are much more reliable these days than they used to be.

The OP barely races and is on a budget. Carbon clinchers won't save any weight, and do not brake as well as aluminum. Plus if you do long descents with lots of braking, they still have a tendency to self destruct.

I have no problem with mounting tires to my Flo 30's. Now my Flo disc.........I've decided if I flat that on a race then I'll simply dnf.

I'm on a budget in the sense that it seems a bit crazy to me to spend significantly more on wheels than I spent on my bike. But I have the funds if I decide it's warranted. So I'm undecided about whether I'd love carbon clinchers as an everyday wheel or be just as happy with something like the Flo 30. And I get the sense the forum is split on this, i.e. some love riding their carbons for training, others prefer dedicated training wheels. It's worth bearing in mind these are for a pretty unaero road bike often ridden as a road bike, rather than in a tri position.

Chris,

You've watched me debate/agonize on wheels. If I were choosing between your 30s and 45s for my road bike that occasionally does duty for tris, and I didn't care that much about marginal top speed gains, but I did care about acceleration, compliance over rough pavement, handling in feisty crosswinds, and durability, and I was flexible with the budget constraint, which would you pitch?

I would use 25mm wide tires for compliance over rough roads.

I also believe you are overestimating the effect of crosswinds.

Definitely want to run 25mm on the back, and perhaps also front. Do that on the back currently, but on narrow rims the tire mushrooms dramatically, not optimal for aero or, more importantly for me, handling.

Even if we discount the crosswind issue, what I'm fundamentally trying to suss out is given that I don't care that much about a marginal increase in top speed, is there still a strong argument for investing in a deeper carbon clincher as my regular training/riding wheel?

In a lot of my customers decision making process, they just ask themself...

What looks better?

I like nice aesthetics but they're not central here. Things like handling, acceleration, compliance, and robustness are, though. And I'm unsure whether carbon clinchers make sense, given my priorities.

Flo 30s. End of thread.

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Make Inside Out Sports your next online tri shop! http://www.insideoutsports.com/

I hear you. Some have argued that even if I don't care that much about a marginally higher top speed, carbon clinchers are going to better absorb the impact from road imperfections, and will be plenty robust. Do you think Flo 30s would be noticeably harsher than Flo 45s? I'd think tires would be far and away the crucial factor here, but people do seem to suggest wheels matter.

Most people can't tell the difference between two sets of wheels regarding handling, acceleration, and compliance.

A deeper wheel will accelerate better at speed.

A lighter wheel will accelerate better from a standing start, but how often would you care about that?

When I say I want a wheel to accelerate well, I suppose what I have in mind is rolling along at 15mph and kicking it up into the 20s. Basically, I want wheels I'm going to enjoy riding in a spirited way. And I do get that there are differing perspectives on what the right choice under those circumstances might be.

My .02

Get a regular box rim of your choice laced to a good hub, like a DT Swiss 240s front, or a dura ace. Get a power tap rear hub.

Every day wheel set that you can stack miles on worry free and you have power meter to boot. You can train and race with power and always add a wheel builder wheel cover to the rear power to wheel to race on in the future.

If you don't care about raw speed, forget the aero wheels then. Get what you really "need" and can use.

Performance bike had a power tap wheel set for like $599 for the pair. Watch for sales.