You can say that about anything that any slow twitch user has ever bought. ;)

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Developing aero, fit and other fun stuff at Red is Faster

you should ask dave koesel (felt) about this meter. he rides with this, and i believe it's spec'd oe on certain high end (probably FRD series) frames. maybe he'll post here about it.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I just purchased a Power2Max for my 2014 Felt B16... Was a little overwhelmed while researching, but this seemed like the best option based on reviews. Trying to figure out what would work with the frame, my Flo wheels, and my Speedplay pedals took some time, but I am looking forward to taking my indoor training to a new level during the "off season" in a month or two.

Tough for you to go wrong then! Good luck and have fun!

If I ran Shimano cranks, I'd probably look at the Pioneer power meter for my next bike. However the other problem I would run into is that there is no way for me to run Qrings without having to modify the rings to fit the Pioneer unit between the crank arms. When I chose Power2Max for both my road and TT bike, I did so because I was already running Rotor cranks, and all I needed to do was swap out the spider. With having zero issues with both Power2Max units over the past two years, and their current price drops again, I see no reason to switch away from Power2Max even if I decide not to run Rotor cranks on my next bike.

The tech is cool, but more crank options would be better.

yes, i think it would be worth the effort to write something like:

Crank-based, Shimano crank, round rings, then:

5-arm spider => Powertap chain ring
4-arm spider => Pioneer

but do it like a matrix, like a spreadsheet, because multiple meters will qualify for certain solutions.

i think we'll do that. any suggestions you all have, data fields, would be welcome.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Why does that surprise you? Have you spoken with any Pioneer product reps? Do you know what the buy in is to become a "dealer?"

It's built into spider and NDS crank arm. Really only a good option if you already run Shimano cranks. You also need to use their head unit to get all the data output by cranks if I am not mistaken (such as power vectors and such).

I would like to try one, but haven't been given enough incentive yet. They need to make it easier for people to get them (employees, ambassadors, etc) because their market share is so low that nobody in any given community has one and therefore word doesn't spread. Or something like that.

Forgive me but I know very little about bike parts/cranks/BB or anything else for that matter.

If I go with the P2M which one would I need for my Felt 2008 B12? The spec sheet I see on my bike says I have an FSA Mega Exo bottom bracket and FSA Gossamer Pro Mega Exo 39/53 crankset. I do not see any reference to that BB on the P2M website.

Current generation G3 hubs weigh less than an Ultegra hub so depending on what hub you're currently using you can actually save weight. They do weigh 75-80 g more than a Dura-Ace hub but if you use a Power Tap you don't need either a speed or cadence sensor, which weighs ~30g or so, so your net weight penalty is ~50g. Just as a comparison point, the Stages weighs also about 50g, without speed sensor.

I'm pretty sure the strain gauges/batteries are built into the crank arms.

I've had Powertaps for a bit now. Love them and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone. That said, my Powertap P1s just arrived yesterday. Assuming they work well they'll become my go-to as, IMO, it's much easier to swap pedals amongst bikes.

i have no idea what the value proposition is for a dealer. but tririg doesn't sell to dealers at all, and if somebody asked about a center pull brake there would instantly be 100 replies and 96 would recommend tririg. slowtwitchers don't have any problem figuring out what they want and getting it regardless whether their dealer has it. they also, as a group, are good at figuring out which products are the best-of-class. that's why i'm surprised pioneer doesn't get mentioned much. it's not a knock against the other power meters, it's just that when i talk to people who smart and spend a lot of time looking at this category, they always come away very impressed with the function and the value of this meter.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

It still amuses me when people think the average ST reader represents the average triathlon consumer.

Hey bud...

I was in the same position two weeks ago. I went with a Quarq Sram Red 22 I picked up off of the classifieds for 750!

I have a 2011 Felt B12 and needed to find a GXP crank. I was looking at the stages power meters but they only had some lame rival cranks and I already had sram red on mine so I didn't want to downgrade crank arms and rings just to put on a PM.

So I put out a WTB in the classifieds and someone replied, I made an offer, and a week later I have my PM. I just did my first FTP this morning with TrainerRoad!

It was an EASY swap. Maybe 15 minutes max... Then download TR, install, plug in your USB ANT stick, search for the quarq, pair, and BAM you're training with POWER!!!!

I would caution against the Power taps because you might want to switch wheels on race day/training days etc. The other option would be pedals but I am already hooked on my speed plays.

Quarq was the obvious choice for me given my situation. I wish you the best in your search!

if you have FSA Mega Exo BB, it should be an english BB / BSA68.

This one "should be" a direct drop in with your bike assuming you haven't changed anything like the bottom bracket or anything
http://www.power2max.com/...er-meter-and-cranks/


Alternative but is a bit more cost..
You can get the Type S with the Rotor 3D+ Crank and use Rotor's BSA BB to make it compatible.
http://www.power2max.com/northamerica/product/accessories/rotor-bsa30-bottom-bracket/

I bought a powertap hub and regret it. If I could do it over, would buy the Stages meter. It isnt perfect, but it is economical.

Training and racing the same wheel isnt a good idea... and you will want to measure power training and racing. A race wheel ideally has race tires which have thin rubber and good rolling resistance, and are too pricey for training... Train on slow wheels that are your bike's stock wheels, and race on light race wheels with delicate race tires (latex)...

The powertap drains its battery fast, the accuracy I find questionable too.

My 4 cents

I have heard rumors about a SRM price drop. can anyone confirm?

It better be a HUGE price drop, like something >= 50%....

I raced fairly successfully for two years on the same wheel I used for training.

Disc cover + race tires/tubes. Not very hard.

Basically everything you say isn't really true. One could argue that the PT hub is the MOST accurate/precise measurement of power on a bicycle. Maybe yours had issues, which is pretty rare.

I typically get more than half way through my season before needing to swap batteries.

I developed VE with the data I got from my Power Tap. VE demands much more accuracy than most things you use a power meter for.

Agreed, Dan. I feel it is easy to get caught up in the hardware. But for "dummies" like me, the Pioneer software looks quite intuitive. Pioneer: light as, good price point, R L pedal stroke analysis, and good software...

If/when it comes time to replace my Quarq I am certainly going the Pioneer route. I agree though, its very interesting that you just don't hear much about them from consumers when you hear nothing but praise about them from people in the industry.

I agree with many others that all you state here is incorrect. Funny you change to a stages, which has one of the worst reputations for accuracy.

This ^^^^

hmmm... "everything you say isnt true".... not sure how to respond to that, except to politely and respectfully disagree. Please define "fairly successfully" as well regarding your racing?

My intention is to provide helpful information. If understanding the rolling resistance properties of bike tires is of no interest, then there is not reason to read further... The issue with a powertap hub is it directs the decision about using the same wheel for both racing and training, a topic which should be unrelated to the quality of the meter. Powertap has a good reputation, and is a good value buy. (Hey, that is why I bought one!)

Before making a big purchase, the issue of what wheels the rider will both race and train on needs to be investigated and intelligently answered. Many of my friends race/train on the same wheels. Many of them have no idea the difference between tires. Many race/train on the same wheel only because they bought a powertap... they are stuck. And that is my point. If you buy a powertap hub, you are stuck with that decision.

Faster tires are made of thinner rubber. Even faster tires are made of latex tubes and not butyl tubes, making them faster, but they puncture easier. Not only are they less durable for regular training, they are more expensive. These are some of the issues which this thread hadnt yet addressed, which I wanted to bring up to be helpful.

Thank you