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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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"These extra people were there, cameras in tow, to see Lance."

see, i thought they bought their entry fees and traveled to the event with the expectation of racing. my bad for not understanding what their sport is really all about.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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From a "professional" stand point, anytime a pro pretty much disses something associated with the race, to me it kinda is in bad form. Granted, if it's an emergency or something, fair enough. But just from doing the "right" thing, I would think as a professional, you have to show up for the awards. But of course, I think Lance is so big that whether doing the right thing professional or not, wont really matter. I'm sure the RD was simply glad enough he chose that race and it may have even helped out with getting more people to race and/or atleast at min. more race exposure. I'm not going to argue whether we each are having double standards, I just would think it's in bad form. Which again, for Lance, does it really matter to him? Not in the least, because he's going to be loved/hated all that much more regardless. I just think it's one of those things, that as a professional, you would hope that your pro athletes stay for those, if only because it's just the right PR thing to do (it's kinda just part of the process of racing as a pro I would think).

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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At Xterra Worlds last year, he was no where to be seen the whole weekend as far as I could tell. Although he did line up right in front of me by chance at the swim start. Another cool thing about Xterra Worlds, EVERYONE starts at the same time. But, even at the bike rack, he was incognito until the last possible minute before the race. I think the guy has a totally different world to function within (right wrong or indifferent) that the rest of us have award time relating to. I would have liked to have gotten my Lance sightings at Florida too (had I been there), but have to check my own needs in this instance given the unique circumstances he carries no one has ever seen in our sport. Does that make it right or wrong, not sure, but the Ethics of this situation is really a judgement or opinion call. We will never be fully satisfied with our heroes but always drawn to them.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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I actually thought he was engaging and yes he was checking out his phone during much of the conference, but any time he was directly involved in a question, he was fully engaged. He also made of point of calling out by name the two general audience folks that asked direct questions. And if you happened to look behind the screen, he spent several minutes with the tri kids and others before going off to the pro meeting. I would not characterize his actions as not wanting to be there.

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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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>see, i thought they bought their entry fees and traveled to the event with the expectation of racing. my bad for not understanding what their sport is really all about.

That's me, for sure. But I recall several thoughtful threads over the past few years calling out triathlon pros for not being "professional" with respect to promoting triathlon and their sponsors. For, I think, some very similar behavior to what we see out of Lance. I don't care. But I bet WTC, Trek, et al, would certainly prefer that Lance work a little harder to promote "the brand." Certainly quite a few advertisers on this site are banking heavily on celebrity in promotion. Cannondale (it appears) did well with Chrissie. And Rappstar has his own more cult-like celebrity following here. (cult in the sense of a devoted minority, not as in creepy).
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Kscycler] [ In reply to ]
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What is coming across in your posts is that it comes down to what you personally got out of your encounter with each pro to determine their character and contribution to the sport? I was there in St.Croix and Lance was completely approachable everywhere he went - dinner out, swim practices, riding locally, etc.

Let's also be honest here, abandoning a race during the race to go be with family is not really a logical comparison to waiting 8 hrs after you finish a race to go to an awards ceremony when you have the option to go home anytime you want, and home is a 5 hour flight away.

As Dan so eloquently points out, it's your expectations he failed to meet (and Chrissie achieved). If you ARE going to judge an athlete's character this way (and I'm advocating here that we don't) then it's valid to factor in Chrissie's current book promotion tour into her motivation and interactions with the average athlete as well as the fact she is not currently training to defend her Ironman title. I hope and personally think she enjoys handing out medals post-race to athletes but if she does it to sell books I would not take that as an indication she didn't understand the average athlete or was not a generous person. I'd say she's being a professional athlete and it comes with a world of expectations, obligations and almost everyone you meet wanting some piece of you in some way....all on top of it being a job that accounts for your income.

Chrissie hung my medal around my neck at IMTX Saturday and I was very appreciative as I missed that opportunity with her in ITU Long Course Worlds in 2008. Lance left St.Croix after the race because of a prior commitment with his family, so yes it is 'about choice and making arrangements for what's important'. I appreciate both athletes for both of these choices but I'm judging both but what I deem important to me.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
"These extra people were there, cameras in tow, to see Lance."

see, i thought they bought their entry fees and traveled to the event with the expectation of racing. my bad for not understanding what their sport is really all about.

Seriously, Dan? Would you say the same if the President were there? Or the pope? Or Madonna? Reality is that he is a celebrity and people want to see him. And, surely, many of these people were spectators rather than participants, and people who would not have been spectators otherwise.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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Right or wrong ......we will get over this, Lance attracts so much media maybe he just wants to get away from it....I am sure he does not have any bad intentions toward other athletes.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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When I read this I get worried that each race Lance enters turns into a freaking circus...
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [kny] [ In reply to ]
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Lance doesn't stay around for the awards ceremony.

My thoughts:

1) So Lance didn't collect his 1st place check (which would pay for the fee to park his private jet at the airport for 2 days)? Or was this just a ceremonial thing where they say here's first place?
2) Is Lance allowed to leave early? Yes. Would it have been nice to stay and give your fans a speech? Yes.
3) It's becoming clear that whatever relationship/contract Lance has with the Ironman organization is really interesting. Is it Lance feeling the retirement blues and knowing he would never win the Tour again so let him try something he can still win or is it more for the awareness campaign surrounding his charity?
4) I laugh every time picturing Lance and his 10-person entourage flying to these races on his private jet and staying at 5 star hotel suites dining on coconut water and filet mignon, while the other pros are taking rental cars and mules from the airport, staying at homesteads or hostels and eating ramen.

and what's with the flying to Kona to practice? I have a hard time driving to my near-by pool for practice. Lance flies to Hawaii for practice.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [kny] [ In reply to ]
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Would you say the same if the President were there? Or the pope? Or Madonna?

There is no way the pope makes the swim cut off time.

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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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When the overall winner cuts out, it says to the other participants, who may have just accomplished something monumental in their lives, this event is not important to me.

Whether or not Lance, or any overall winner for that matter, feels a race is unimportant to them bears no relevance on the accomplishment of every other participant of the race.

We're all aware that Lance is using these 70.3's in prep for the big show down in October. I wouldn't be surprised to find that some of these races are unimportant to him, he's just using them to fine tune his strategy, very succesfully to boot!
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Cervelo Apple] [ In reply to ]
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Cervelo Apple wrote:

and what's with the flying to Kona to practice? I have a hard time driving to my near-by pool for practice. Lance flies to Hawaii for practice.

Lance is racing Honu 70.3 on the Big Island in two weeks. I assume that is why he flew to Kona.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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Francois wrote:
When I read this I get worried that each race Lance enters turns into a freaking circus...

Which is probably why he bails right after every event. This is nothing new. The dude gets mobbed whenever he's out in public, whether is' at a triathlon or going to get the mail. I don't know what's going on in his head, but from my experience (being around Team Radio Shack), he treasures his alone time.. which is very, very rare. Take your pic: Flack from athletes on the Internet for not hanging around after an event, or flack at the event for hanging around after.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I like this.

Not to mention, Lance can't just come to these things like Wellington can. He gets mobbed up everyone. What is up with that?
If I ran into Lance, i would be like "hey, what's up dude" just like I would you or anyone else. Get a life people.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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I heard they even let him take his bike out of transition early...those WTC bastards.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Uncle Phil] [ In reply to ]
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haters gonna hate, lance lovers gonna love.... what else is new?
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
here's my counterpiont to that. how many raced at IM florida 70.3? how many showed up at the awards? a fifth? a tenth? most of the folks who showed up at the awards - you included, by your own admission - showed up because you were getting an award.

what you're upset about is that somebody you particularly wanted to see did not wait for the awards ceremony. but that is your private wish that didn't get fulfilled, rather than his responsibility that didn't get executed.

yes, it's a problem when pro athletes don't stick around for the awards, but only for that pro athlete when he or she wants to re-up with sponsors at the end of the year.

there are a LOT of awards ceremonies i don't stick around for, and there are obviously a lot you don't stick around for. there are a lot most of us don't stick around for. why should we hold lance to a standard we aren't willing to meet, only because he's faster than us?

if you look at jordan's award ceremony speech - for texas, just posted on the site, on the front page, or for last year's canada, also on the site - you'll see the flip side: someone who not only sticks around for the awards, but also crafts his speech with care. however, jordan is not like ANY other pro athlete i've ever seen in triathlon, or in any other sport. he's the bar against which pros are measured. however, i don't think it's appropriate to measure lance against a bar which almost none of us can clear.

now, one more thing: you obviously don't read what's written on this site. lance paid for his jet. your $1 bracelet went specifically and only for anti-cancer purposes. if you want to throw a tantrum, fine, but, it should be a fact-based tantrum.

Brilliant...
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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I once met Ted Dibiase "The Million Dollar Man" lifting weights at the Y in Clinton, MS with his little boy. He seemed like a nice guy even though I hated him when I saw him cheat the Junkyard Dog out of the Heavyweight Championship a few years before that.
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [gregf83] [ In reply to ]
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gregf83 wrote:
Kscycler wrote:
Lance was a no-show after the race at St. Croix, too. Just disappeared after the race. Contrast that with Chrissie winning Kansas 70.3 (many times) and then turning right around and handing out medals for 2+ hours to everyone that finished. Hmmmm, no wonder she is univerally loved and respected; she gets it. Lance, Lance, this is an opportunity....
Twitter followers:
Lance: 3,457,000
Chrissie - 40,000

Surely some of Lance's 3+M followers love and respect him...

Bump

Inside The Big Ring: Podcast & Coaching



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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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nhoya wrote:
To your point on my own selfish reasons for attending: I hope you are using that statement as more a blanket statement than a direct indictment on me. I attend pretty much any award ceremony I have ever raced. Regardless of whether or not I get an award. I usually stick around the post race party/festival/whatever until they're packing up. It's fun. It's part of the event. If I have a teammate or buddy that got an award, great, I'll clap louder.

The gentleman in front of me was probably mid to late 50's and pretty butthurt about the whole no-show. I just kind of laughed it off, thinking, "yikes, this guy was probably down to his last Honey Stinger Waffle wrapper for Lance to sign". But then I saw quite a few honestly dejected people leaving. Again, I don't feel like he owes me anything, and I think what Crissie does is far above the norm, so that is apples to oranges, but I do feel like he could put in a little more work to endear himself to the public.

He is being allowed to play by his own rules in this sport, when this sport doesn't owe him anything. He brings a ton of star-power to events, and that puts more butts on the course, sells more race slots, and gets more interest in the sport. However, when people start tiring of his disappearing acts, will they continue to come out and support him? I don't need him to present me with a medal, but I would like to see him honor the sport and its participants a bit better. Everyone is competing on the same course in the same conditions and it is a collective celebration at the end. When the overall winner cuts out, it says to the other participants, who may have just accomplished something monumental in their lives, this event is not important to me. If you have to get on a commercial airliner at 5:00pm, and the awards aren't until 4pm, I understand. But he has a little more control over the situation than the average joe.

Again, and for the nth time, I don't feel like I am owed a single thing by Lance Armstrong. It was a thrill that I never thought I would have just to see what I could do on a bike on the same course on the same day as him. That's all I was in it for. I don't personally care if he was there or not, but I am just echoing the sentiment of quite a few people around me at awards.


I think the problem here is that you are comparing Lance Armstrong with Chrissie Wellington or Craig Alexander.

I too was dissappointed for ME when he did not show at the St. Croix Awards.

But Lance is in the category of Bono, or Wayne Gretzky, or Zuckerberg or Michael Jordan. He's not just an athlete, he is a celebrity and can't spend an entire day doing photo sessions and shaking hands with guys like us.

At the St. Croix practice swim, I locked my bike and guess who is standing next to me. Lance Armstrong. My instinct was to go and shake his hand but I thought, "That's what everyone on the planet wants to do with this guy. Everyone wants a piece of him, yet none of us give 2 shits about him".

Instead, I stepped away, and gave him some space. Maybe he wanted to take in coming back to St. Croix 24 years later and not be bothered by 200 fans". After the swim, he had pictures and signed autographs with over 30 fans. Then a couple of press interviews, then whisked away. People were whining and complaining. I said, "Did you guys ever think that he just wants some personal space and not want to make small talk with a bunch of people he does not know nor care about".

If you are Craig Alexander, or Chrissie, or Jordan Rapp, then you must do these duties. Your income is based on pleasing the age group triathlon fan.

Lance Armstrong has no time for this. The payback is fairly minimal. He already does enough. Lance can't go out to a restaurant and have dinner with his partner and kids without being bothered. Chrissie and Craig or Jordan can go anywhere they want and even hanging out in triathlon, a few years after they stop winning, none of us will care about them.....don't believe it....go hang out with Tinley, or Molina, or Luc Van Lierde or Thomas Hellriegel at Kona. You can have 60 minutes of their time and they'll give it to you because none of the press nor fans care about them anymore (sadly).

On the other hand if you are Eddy Merckx or Bernard Hinault of Lance, the press, and fans always care about you and you have zero personal space for the rest of your life.

Do I want Lance to show up at awards....Damn Right (but it is my selfish need) ! Do I blame him for not showing up ? Not for a second.
Last edited by: devashish_paul: May 21, 12 11:53
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [Cervelo Apple] [ In reply to ]
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Lance also lives in Kona and his next race is in Honu.

For a second compare this with any of us.


  1. You win your age group and awards are 4 hours later. You wife and kids are at home. You can hop into your car and drive the 5 hours to get home and have dinner with your family.
  2. Lance wins the race...he can wait around for awards 5 hours later. His wife and kids are at home. He can hop into his vehicle (an airplane), fly home and have dinner with family. He chooses to get his ass back to hang out with family who actually care about him rather than making small talk with strangers.
How is his decision making that much different than many of us? He just has a better vehicle and a better house and rather than using fuel from Exxon for his land based vehicle, he is using Jet A-1 fuel from the local airport refueling vehicle!!!

Dev
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [nhoya] [ In reply to ]
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I have done a number of IM 70.3 races and to be honest I didn't even know they had an awards presentation for 70.3s...

While I've never finished in the top 5 in my AG I also can't remember ever having more then some crapy food and a bottle of water post race before getting into my car and heading to somewhere better to eat...
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [cidewar] [ In reply to ]
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Oh, now you are too good to eat with us too?


I never got the whole award ceremony thing - but some folks strive on it. Just today there was a man who was out for a "loosening up" jog after he "raced" in a half marathon yesterday. He was in his race shirt - number pinned on and all....today (a full day later). And, it was a number from the half......I think that at IMLP I went once, in 1999. Never again, not in Madison - no real reason to go, even if I had placed in my AG.

----------------------------------------------------------

What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
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Re: Lance a no-show at FL 70.3 awards [R10C] [ In reply to ]
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Come on you skipped the awards ceremony in Madison? a lunch from Monona Terrace on a Monday when you should be back to work.. what a shocker?

I'm all for free food - I mean we did pay for it though the $400 no $500 no $600 no $700 entry fee at IM races - but for 70.3s they don't even have food at the awards, they food is in a tent as soon as you finish and it's not exactly a great spread usually.
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