I've passed on two CompuTrainers this week for less than $500 each, so they're definitely out there. You just have to use the search engines and a little persistence. I have 9 (6 in service and 3 as backup) and paid less than $600 for each of them. As far as road feel, I believe CompuTrainer has the algorithm that delivers the most realistic road feel. It's a given that their hardware is bulletproof, and you already know they hold their value. Only you know if it's worth the hassle to pull the rear wheel for the Kickr, deal with the greasy chain (if you keep your bike squeaky clean, not so much of a problem), or would rather just put the bike in the CompuTrainer stand. Each has it's benefits, and it's really a personal choice. Whether the Kickr will hold up over time or hold its value is yet to be proven, but it seems like it's pretty sturdily built.

Mostly, folks bang on CompuTrainer because of the older software and perceived shortcomings of RacerMate One, not their hardware. Kinda like the PC to Mac debate. I personally run PerfPRO Studio (in addition to an occasional session with RacerMate One and ErgVideo) and I can upload almost any course and be riding in minutes. TrainerRoad is good for a lot of folks, but I personally prefer to own the software. Again, personal preference.

As for rear tires blowing, once we learned that when riding a power (in erg mode) profile that speed and shifting did not matter, we haven't blown a tire since. That is, for power workouts we ride at 15-17 mph, and tires hold up very well. For riding courses where shifting and speed matter, you have a be a bit more cautious, and a dedicated trainer tire (or tire/wheel combo) is warranted.

Do the KICKR trainers also do the diagnostics on the pedal stroke as the computrainer does? This was one other potentially deal breaker I forgot to mention. Having a way to see how poorly or good my pedal stroke is and where the dead spots are seems like a good way to improve my overall performance.

I think the lack of available units on the used market is due to being located in Canada. I've found only a single used unit for $850 CDN before shipping from Vancouver to Toronto. God only knows what shipping will be for something that large and heavy. Seems as though people who purchase these things hold onto them with a death grip haha Another indicator that it may be the better way to go.

Thanks for all advice.

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"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"

As far as I know, SpinScan is proprietary to CompuTrainer. Last time I chatted with them about it, they were telling me the tremendous amount of data and sampling that it took to generate the graphic (or bar chart, depending on modality). That's why it only works using the wired cadence sensor, as ANT+ just can't move that much data fast enough.

Yep, shipping to/from Canada can be a problem, as you already know. Good luck, and keep looking!

I do not believe there are any studies that have shown that attempting to modify your pedal stroke outside of just cycling more have produced any measurable difference in efficiency and/or power. Based on this, I am not sure that pedalling analytics such as this should be a deal breaker. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, as I would be interested if this is not the case.

Thanks

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On the internet, you can be anything you want. It is a pity so many people choose to be stupid.

And if you find that your torque is not perfect what you're going to do? I really doubt real life torque shape is that much of a value except maybe when you're recovering from a trauma. I used to have nearly perfect left/right balance but it all went haywire after I hurt my leg. Took me about 2 months of cycling to get it back to what it was. But I was not doing anything special to correct the balance. It just slowly repaired itself as my power went back to what it used to be before the trauma. So the overall power is way more important I think.

For what it worth here is the pic of real time torque (not from Computrainer) that shows my torque starting from initial acceleration. You can clearly see that one leg is weak:



As for KICKR vs Computrainer, my vote goes for KICKR. Both units are very solidly built but KICKR has more inertia (feels more "real"). Also I am not a big fan of erg mode at all. I am riding "real course" or whatever you'd like to call them videos and when the road goes up Computrainer starts to eat tires like crazy. None of those feeld "realistic" if the road grade goes above 4% (that is subjective of course).
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I've had a CT for about 3 to 4 years now. Originally got so I could recover from an ACL repair and wanted to see power from each leg. My power is pretty equal now, generally running within a few percentage points. I don't know how much of that is due to me using spinscan and how much is just natural recovery.

However, one of the things you can do with it is to see how changes in pedaling can affect power output. While I haven't made changes to this point, after using a power meter on my bike outside, I think I can pick up some significant power by doing a few things with my pedal stroke. I now need to verify that on the trainer and see what doing that does to HR and fatigue levels.

I'm currently reading "Wheelmen" and in that book, Eddy B. talks about when he first started training Americans and how inefficient their pedal strike was (all push down, no pull back, no pull up, no early push over the top). So, I'm going to start focusing on those things and see what I can do. Plus, with the CT, if you do single leg drills, you can see what your power is pushing down versus pulling up.

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BC Don
Pain is temporary, not giving it your all lasts all Winter.

Unless there is something really grossly wrong with your pedaling (should not be the case for any decent cyclist) your average power will stay the same. And if you believe that pedaling in some particular way will increase your AVERAGE power you are most likely making a mistake

If you can be patient and score a used Computrainer, the bulletproof hardware paired with TrainerRoad is a very potent combo tool. That is, you have the advantage of the best hardware paired with the best and constantly evolving training software.
You can default back to the Computrainer anytime for the advantages of spinscan or some other feature -there are lots.

Where do you guys find used computrainers, other than ebay? Not seeing anything in local craigslists.

There are tools for craigslists that allow you to search as much of the US as you want.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I purchased a KICKR because it's very good 2014 technology, whereas the computrainer is very good 1991 technology.

Don't get me wrong, computrainer is great, but you have to deal with wires everywhere and proprietary software. Wahoo is much more open and therefore easy to integrate with 3rd party products. For most kickr owners, they use TrainerRoad.com, but over time there will be tons of apps and tools that integrate with the KICKR, and the Computrainer will still be the same. Bet on the future, get the KICKR!

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Wires everywhere is definitely hardware. So is the Bluetooth and ANT+ transmitters in the kickr

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Swapping the cassette is the same difficulty on the KICKR as it on a wheel, very easy for anyone with the tools and with erg mode you could always use the 10spd bike with an 11spd cassette if you stayed in one gear. I've put thousands of miles on my KICKR and its still going strong, while not quieter than a computrainer the noise profile has less low frequency noise making it quieter a room or floor away.

Who ships on craigslist? That's pretty much step 1 in avoiding scams on craigslist as a seller.

Man, there are lots of ways to buy stuff.

I bought 2 velotrons way out of state from me. One I drove like 8 hours to meet him half way. The second I have it trucked to me. Depending on what you are buying.
some risks are worth taking.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I see what you're saying but that means the computrainer will still be getting results no? I mean it has been one of the most popular training tools for any serious cyclist for a while now. I see merits in each system and if what I am hearing is true the pedal stroke analysis isn't going to make any difference, the cassette in erg can stay 11sp with the 10sp bike, they both work with trainerroad.com ... Now it's a used vs new thing. If I can't find one in 4 weeks I will have to go forward with one or the other new.

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"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"

yeah I see people getting amazing results with the CT. In fact, today it may even have the edge because you've got things like the course simulations. Plus if you can get one second hand for a good deal, even better. The reason I chose Kickr though is because I saw evidence of faster innovation in a short space of time, so it was kind of a leap of faith, but for sure the CT guys may very well wake up and do something cool

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

How funny! I have 6 CompuTrainers in my basement and not a wire showing. ANT+ for speed, cadence, and HR. Running PerfPRO Studio (non-proprietary), ErgVideo (non-proprietary), in addition to 3CD, Real Course Video, and RacerMate One (proprietary). Hmmmm, I can run any course, any place, anything recorded on MapMyRun/MapMyRide, and still preview/ride a lot of IM courses with Real Course Video.

I'm not against Wahoo and their product, and I'd suggest it's a good fit for a lot of folks. If you've tried both, you'd know...

I have a Kickr and can't say anything bad about it, does what it's supposed to do.

I could be wrong, but I think perfpro software allows you to 'ride' .gpx files with a Kickr?

Agree on the wires.

"Wahoo is much more open and therefore easy to integrate with 3rd party products"

This is true. However another way of saying this is "Wahoo supply no software, to get any real functionality you need to shell out at least $12 dollars a month for a subscription based service.

When the software comes out, and is free, then I'd say "wow wahoo is a must" until then, not interested.

I own a KICKR but have ridden a CT a few times. Both are great choices. I like the open and current platform (for software choices) of the KICKR better. I also just keep a bike on it most of the time so I can get on and be going in less than a minute. No worrying about tire pressure or tire wear.

With the CT each time I've ridden one it had to be calibrated and it took 10 minutes or so and a few times to get it right. Some user error I'm sure, though I was just the rider and not the person setting them up. I know others will say it's not difficult and you can just be warming up while waiting. That is fine but it seems like a pain to deal with.

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Loud pawls save lives

Ive ridden the CT before and it took sometime to calibrate. The wires were a turn off for me. Changing tire in the off season is one more job and $$$. I went with the kickr. I just leave my bike on it and plug it in when I ride that day. I run the perfpro and works well with the kickr and sufferfest. It can also be controlled by your iphone or android. Lots of 3rd party tool and probably more coming up.
I also scored this kickr in Kijiji toronto for $700. The unit looks unused cause the cassette looks untouched. So if you just sit there and wait, itll come around. Good luck