now im more curious how these cheats work, such as the hair dryer and painted rollers? more so to know im not sabotaging myself... but I usually keep the same set up as always, that is what matters more

I think the bigger story is how scandalized the general public would feel upon learning that racing a bike on a stand indoors, competitively, is a thing that people do.

Maybe old people would think that, however, the younger gen would not blink an eye.

While I support the general aim and goal, this article is actually shoddily written.

To wit,



The current estimate for maximum 5-min power (according to Dr. Coggan) is 7.6 w/kg. Someone will have to run a regression for 4:16 (as opposed to 5:00), but my guess is that 8.5 for 4:16 would still be much higher than 7.6 w/kg for 5:00. The article could have used this but perhaps thought it was too much into the weeds.

Instead, it dragged in a 20-min/ (or perhaps 60-min) non-sequitor comparison to LA.

This graphic further muddies the water with this graph, again seemingly suggesting current pros have ~4 min max power of upwards of 6.3 w/kg.



The actual article quoted (from road.cc), had much more relevant analysis.



That said, those of us somewhat in the know already know of various ways people can get marginal gains and without having it detected, ranging from the duplicitous to the merely "this s*** won't fly on the road":
-Setting incorrect power meter slope, so the PM over-reports (multiplicative over-reporting, e.g. should be xyz W, instead reports xyz W * 1.05);
-Purposely messing with the off-set in certain conditions, so the PM over-report (additive over-reporting, e.g. should be xyz W, instead reports xyz W + 10 W);
-Adaptation for constantly standing and exertion at 60-70 rpm to extract maximal output, regardless of terrain type. This never works IRL, b/c 1) loss of stability and 2) aerodynamic penalties at higher speeds, but a lot of racers do this.

It's a game of liar's poker.

I learned a couple weeks ago that Miami Dolphins Coach, Mike McDaniel learned his football strategy skills by playing Madden with Dan Soder (Billions) when they were kids

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

I do this indoors and IRL 😥.. both cases get dropped lol

I don't really get the entire concept about worrying about what some guy sitting in his basement on a miscalibrated trainer or using weight from a miscalibrated weighing scale is doing. It's just not something worth getting twisted into a pretzel about. There is this thing called real life racing (and even then there are dopers, drafter, course cutters etc). I figure the only thing that matters is how I do relative to myself since I can't control who shows up and what they do.

Because some folks really care about cheaters I suppose. And when there is real life $$$ at stake, imo, that has criminal implications as well.

Is the table indicating W/kg over 5 min or 20 min? Either way, the data is wrong for current TDF riders indicating a 5.5-6.3 W/kg range. No top TDF is "only" pushing 5.5 W/kg for 5 or even 20 min.

It compares virtual doper's 4:16 effort to pro's 20/60 min effort (presumably 60 min). Alas why it's shoddily written.

devashish_paul wrote:

I figure the only thing that matters is how I do relative to myself since I can't control who shows up and what they do.

Dopers indoors and outdoors love that blasé "don't care how I finish as long as I feel good about myself" attitude. Which is a healthy attitude to have, but don't think it means we should just put on blinders over pretty blatant cheating and avoid online criticism of such behavior.

I fully "get" those who think no online racing should ever be taken seriously at all. I nearly have that attitude and raced online purely for fun, but even then it gets eye-rollingly annoying to see some dude come out of nowhere on a climb in the "B" category and throw down double digit W/kg for really long periods of time. I sympathize with those who think the online community and companies like Zwift should put a reasonable good-faith effort into policing things. At least to the point where people have to work at it.

OK I did not know there are $$$ at stake. Seems weird to even have $$$ at stake when the playing field is tough to level. In any case, I just ride by myself with virtual riders whose performance I already know and then I just compete with virtual people whose finish times are pre established. It is a function on rouvy that I find creates a semblance of pulling out my desire to compete without worrying about what I am competing against. I even put my old rides on the course and there is nothing worse than being beaten by your former self (even though eventually your former self is always more studly than your current self if you rewind enough years).

^^^^This.

4W/Kg (ex. 300W for a 75Kg rider) for an amateur racer is reasonable for FTP, but way too low for a 4-5min. effort.

4W/Kg is probably a good Cat IV to lo-Cat III.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

Pollastri could go race a bike IRL, lose some weight, not give a crap and get a life.

There are A LOT of double-letters being cited here, on BOTH sides

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

What is a double letter.

I'm dubious about the moaner and his 342 FTP

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...r_thing..._P6498129/

First isolated in 2015 with regards to course cutters [Litton, Rossi, Miller], in a thread about a bib-swapper

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=5755921#p5755921

It has since been used to ID course cutters, selfie-bandits, bib-swappers/mules/copiers

At first, dopers only occasionally fell into the protocol, but with increased comes increased discovery

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

What do you think of the content of his message?

Or are you going to dwell solely on matters tangential to the actual aim?

Most of us here, by virtue of the fact that we joined an interest-based forum on our own volition, are probably viewed by others as being too into our interest. And should we complain about certain things that are unfair (e.g. subpar officiating), at least some would deem us moaners caring too much about something trivial and tell us to get a life and get off the damn bike. Not so different from what you are expressing, is it?