I've taught and coached martial arts for over 15 years and at one time was ranked third in the country. I understand the need for a strong foundation and learning basics but I also believe there is more than one way to learn. I also think there is a lot of uneeded attitude.

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"your horse is too high" - tigerchik

Weren't you the one bragging about dropping the roadies ?

You must have missed the post one down where I said "I don't claim to be some great cyclist, but I do find the crap that people talk funny."

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"your horse is too high" - tigerchik

I don't claim to be a great reader either, sorry . . . I missed that post.

congrats on the martial arts thing....really......dr. laura is a blackbelt too.

one of the reasons roadies make fun of tri-geeks is for reasons like you.....going on a group ride with roadies doesn't mean you have to go balls out (28mph.) as you took off the front they probably chuckled to themselves.....and let you go. group rides will vary in speeds.....i've been on group rides with cat 1-2-3 cyclists and we cruised at 16-17 mph....and i also have been riding 32 mph and could bairly hang on, and i'm a pretty decent rider (by tri standards) road standards: average to low...whole other ball game.

you have some "uneeded" attitude......how about just relax and ride! enjoy yourself....thats why we do this sport...remember. FUN



luke

Hold on a minute ... I've seen this movie ...

This is where Hid threatens to kick your ass, just to prove to you "he ain't got no 'tude".

Then, I get my ass kicked for putting my nose where it don't belong. =)

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Geez, I turn nice, and the whole board turns into a war zone where everyone is better than somebody and everyone has onion skin [i.e., thin].

Everyone must be getting reved up for race season. It's like we're a football/basketball team and we're sick of scrimmaging against each other day-in and day-out.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

When I ride with the roadies I ride my road bike for the simple fact that it is much more stable than a tri bike on turns and descents. During these rides we have up to 50 people riding sometimes 3 abreast. You definitely learn how to cycle in close quarters and your reaction times become much more attuned. As a result you come away from the rides a much better cyclist. IMO you will never become a really good road cyclist until you learn to ride with the roadies. I know a ton of triathletes who put miles and mile on their tri-bikes, yet are not what I would consider good cyclist.



Every year though we have our share of crashes during these rides. In almost every case it is do a person not paying close enough attention to what’s going on. Sometimes when a crash occurs in front of you, there is not much you can do about it except pray that you can evade it. Usually when I do the roadie rides, they are broken down into A1, A2, B1, B2, C categories. With A being the fastest and usually most experienced riders (Ave 22-24mph with bursts up to 40mph) down to C (Ave 16-18mph) being the slowest and least experience. I usually ride the A1 rides, but sometimes I want to take it easy, so I opt for a slower group. I find the skill level in the slower groups almost always to be worse and in many way much more scary to ride with. You see people hesitate around turns, get jittery when the group gets tight, slowdown sooner prior to an intersection or traffic light and not be able to maintain a proper pace line.



When the group is in the zone, the pace goes from about 22mph to around 28-30mph. You look down at your cyclometer and your like damn we are really moving.



As far as being able to break away from the A1 rides. Yea it can be done, but the pack always will catch you, unless you leave them at a light. When they do catch you it takes almost all your energy just to get back in the pack. Usually were I try to make breaks is on the hills, where the weaker and heavier cyclists have a hard time keeping up. There is this one hill on the Tuesday rides that utterly destoys the pack and you see guys getting blow off left and right. On Thursdays there is a long hill that basically does the same thing. I have been dropped a few times on the long hill when a person in front of me would basically run out of gas and the pack in front of him would pull away before I could react. When your gapped like this during a ride, it takes a ton of enery to get back in if you can. Once in, your basically trying to stuff you lung back into your body. Sometimes during these rides situations arrise where I have to work so hard that I swear I can taste blood.

Luke you obviously didn't read my post because I wasn't on a group ride or riding with them. Of course it would be stupid for me to do that to a group I was riding with.

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"your horse is too high" - tigerchik

Maybe if it's good roadies and beginner triathletes. But good triathletes and cat 5 roadies. The triathletes would be better bike handlers

In our road rides the slower groups start 1st then the other groups chase with the best starting last it's fun to jump on as they pass, I can't hang long. I just don't bike enough with the running and swimming. I have noticed that if a roadie wrecks it's because he didn't pay attention but if a triathlete wrecks it's because he a triathlete. I like all the groups. Hey ever notice how many times the females get dissed non verbally by both groups. Should we take sometime to ride with people and help them? How about teaching a class at your YMCA etc. on biking Have levels : )

[reply]I am a triathlete so I don't need to be able to scream around corners in a crit surrounded by 150 other riders 4 or 5 cm from front and back wheels[/reply]

get into some of the bigger sprint/oly races and start in one of the old fart AG's - you'll find you do need these skills. Actually you need even better skills than this, because you have to be able to anticipate weird moves.

Fully agree with Francois et al, bike handling skill = free speed.

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"It is a good feeling for old men who have begun to fear failure, any sort of failure, to set a schedule for exercise and stick to it. If an aging man can run a distance of three miles, for instance, he knows that whatever his other failures may be, he is not completely wasted away." Romain Gary, SI interview

But Francois, if you're racing IM Florida you *do* need good bike handling skills, otherwise you might get wiped out by all the crappy-bike-handling-triathletes in the pack you're stuck in.

Seriously though, I love riding with a group. When I first started it was hugely intimidating, and I would end up picking up the pace too much at the front. Doesn't take long before the group shells you off the back and leaves you for dead. Riding with a group helps you identify your weakneses (like pacing), and shows you how much you have to learn about cycling. Whether you end up using the skills in a tri or not, you have to appreciate them.

There's nothing like riding in a bunch to let you know that the straight line you thought you were riding .... well it wasn't so straight was it?

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly