I am not fast, and I just kick. Getting my catch right seems to help me a lot more than worrying about my kick.

Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I do worry about my kick though.... and I had a swimmer tell me that my kick was out of sync, and that I should learn 2-beat cause it's more balanced. Right kick/left reach-left kick/right reach instead of left kick/right reach - left kick/left reach, comprende?

It makes some sence I think.

I only use 4, but I feel most balanced that way. That's just me.

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"Lemond is cycling's version of Rev Jessie Jackson." -johnnyperu 5/18/07
"Just because I suck doesn't mean my bike has to" -rickn 9/2/08

It's pretty common and pretty difficult to get used to doing it properly.

You can either give up on it and have an unbalanced kick the rest of your life or continue to plug away.

I think Emmett Hines wrote the best series of articles on rhythmic kicking, the best I've seen anyway.

http://www.h2oustonswims.org/...wimming_revised.html

No such thing as a 4 beat kick, it would put you on your back. Only a 2 or 6

I know when I was in college and trying to unlearn the 6-beat, I spent 6 weeks not kicking at all, only swimming with a pull buoy. And then when I finally put that away, I switched to a 2-beat. Haven't looked back since.

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

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How is there no such thing as a 4 beat kick?

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"Lemond is cycling's version of Rev Jessie Jackson." -johnnyperu 5/18/07
"Just because I suck doesn't mean my bike has to" -rickn 9/2/08

it is a rythme thing. Hard to explain, but I could show you. As I said, it would put you on your back. Have to use odd numbers of kicks to arm movement

Weird. Try Googling "4 beat swimming kick". I'm not alone in thinking I do a 4 beat swim kick.

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"Lemond is cycling's version of Rev Jessie Jackson." -johnnyperu 5/18/07
"Just because I suck doesn't mean my bike has to" -rickn 9/2/08

Maybe this is a bit closer to what I do:

Modified 4-beat kick—In the modified 4-beat kick, the
timing is the same as a 6-beat kick, but two of the six
kicks are left out. The swimmer essentially rests for two
kicks. This maintains the proper timing between the arms
and the legs, but does not require the energy outlay
required to maintain a 6-beat kick.

I know I kick 4 times though! ;-)

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"Lemond is cycling's version of Rev Jessie Jackson." -johnnyperu 5/18/07
"Just because I suck doesn't mean my bike has to" -rickn 9/2/08

that sounds more reasonable. You can do a 4 beat dolphin kick though. I will try a modified 4 beat next time I am at the pool. Do you feel like it throws your timing off? Try a 2 or 6 and see if you get more snap in your hips to initiate your roll. you may find more power.

Ut oh, more for less, hopefully Dave doesnt see this

That's what I prefer to use...

It is clear that a 2 beat kick and a 6 beat kick provide the proper balance. Oddly enough, most of the swimmers I know who trained for real (including myself) primarily in the '80s do a 4 beat kick. See Rowdy Gaines. It wasn't until the benefits of the catch/catch up stroke mastered by the Australians that everyone started switching to the 6 beat kick. That having been said, some distance swimmers have been doing 2 beat kicks for decades...

Okay, so now I'm seeing it. It goes: left-right, right-left, left-right, etc... I think if I tried that, though, I'd throw my back out.

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

http://www.swim-city.com/...?cat=media_freestyle

The bottom left video is a 4 beat. It's Left, Right, Left (for one arm stroke) and then Right, glide, glide (for the other arm stroke).

I tried this for a while but it got me too tired for long distance swimming. I do a two beat.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
-----------------------------RunTraining articles here:
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It's impossible to do a *symmetrical* 4 beat kick. But he's referring to a lopsided kick, 3 kicks on one arm entry, 1 on the other.

True, man that play havoc on a stroke and timing

I would think that would cause all kinds of back problems and upper body strength imbalances...

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

So it seems that noone thinks that what I do is really ok?

I can asure you that the 4-beat exists and it could be balanced, not symmetrical though. I've done it for three years and I don't end up on my back. It's as easy as doing two kicks for each entry, and the asymmetriacal part is that you end up kicking with the same leg for both arms entry.

When i started swimming I had a natural 6-beat going, but then I read some stuff on the internet and came to the conclusion that a 2-beat would be better for me, being a triahlete and all. The thing is that I thought that I was doing a 3-beat (three kicks per arm) so therefore I started practicing 2 kicks per arm instead, which felt really natural to me and seemed like the perfect balance between too many and too few.

A passable 4 beat kick is shown here, I consider Grant Hackett a "passable" swimmer. http://www.nyhoff.net/...0mGoldSydney2000.mpg

You can see he doesn't kick with the same foot on each arm entry. If you are in fact kicking with the same foot on each entry, then you're probably doing a 3 beat kick, which is something else I have seen, twice in fact. I'd suggest fixing it, if you kick down with the same foot on each entry, then you are using your hands for more rotation than necessary. The thinking is usually to use feet for rotation and use hands for propulsion. If you kick with the same foot as is entering the water, then your foot is working to STOP you rotating.

Whether or not you decide to work on it depends on what else your swim needs are, what kind of feedback you can get, what your kinesthetic awareness is like, are coaches available etc. So I'd put it on the list of things to fix, but whether it is tops on the list is a question that is for you to answer.

"The thinking is usually to use feet for rotation and use hands for propulsion. If you kick with the same foot as is entering the water, then your foot is working to STOP you rotating."

Thank you! that´s the kind of explanation that I want. Now i can see why.

I have an old vid showing how I kick but my stroke is terrible on it so it doesn't show how I swim, but the kick is the same now (when i'm not working on the 2-beat that is). I will try to upload it to youtube...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHjM5eLLfok

here's a video from a couple of years ago, nevermind the stroke though, I hope that's been taken care of...but the kick is the same. sorry about the lenghty video the underwater shots comes at the end.

Why don't you swim to the end of the pool?

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"Lemond is cycling's version of Rev Jessie Jackson." -johnnyperu 5/18/07
"Just because I suck doesn't mean my bike has to" -rickn 9/2/08

Cause you wouldn't be able to see me at the far end.