I have tightened my headset several times, but it keeps coming loose. I am loosening the stem clamp bolt, tightening the cap bolt, and then retightening the clamp bolt. I suspect the problem is that the expansion nut inside the steerer tube is slipping. How tight can I crank that sucker down without damaging the carbon fiber steerer tube?
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Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
I won't even attempt this one. Hopefully some of the better mechanics will show up with an answer.
One place you could try and get an answer is on the newsgroup rec.bicycles.tech. There are a lot of good mechanic types hanging out over there.
One place you could try and get an answer is on the newsgroup rec.bicycles.tech. There are a lot of good mechanic types hanging out over there.
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
What make is the fork?
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [JohnA]
[ In reply to ]
Okay...fork brand is NOT an issue
What HS you have?
Integrated?
"Ahead" style?
Needle Bearing?
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
What HS you have?
Integrated?
"Ahead" style?
Needle Bearing?
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [Record10ti]
[ In reply to ]
It is a non-integrated FSA "Aheadset" type.
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
If you've done everything that you say you have then check a couple of things.
Make sure that there are a few millimeters of space between the top of the fork and the top of the stem. This will allow the top cap to 'pull' everything together. If there's no space, then you have essentiallly bottomed out the top cap, so it's not adjusting anything. Sort of difficult to explain.
Second, check to make sure that both the top and bottom headset cups are fully seated. If they are and move around, then a new headset is probably in order as the cups may have worn from being loose. I've seen that once on a moutain bike that had a loose headset for probably 6 months. He replaced the headset and the problems went away.
Or double check the star/expansion nut to make sure that it's tight enough.
Brandon Marsh - Website | @BrandonMarshTX | RokaSports | 1stEndurance | ATC Bikeshop |
Make sure that there are a few millimeters of space between the top of the fork and the top of the stem. This will allow the top cap to 'pull' everything together. If there's no space, then you have essentiallly bottomed out the top cap, so it's not adjusting anything. Sort of difficult to explain.
Second, check to make sure that both the top and bottom headset cups are fully seated. If they are and move around, then a new headset is probably in order as the cups may have worn from being loose. I've seen that once on a moutain bike that had a loose headset for probably 6 months. He replaced the headset and the problems went away.
Or double check the star/expansion nut to make sure that it's tight enough.
Brandon Marsh - Website | @BrandonMarshTX | RokaSports | 1stEndurance | ATC Bikeshop |
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
Not sure why R10Ti thinks that headset type is an issue? Hope he can enlighten me.
If the expansion plug is slipping, then tighten it. There are different types of expansion plugs, which are shipped with different forks. Eg Reynolds, just tighten that sucker hard in the steerer tube, and then use the top cap to tension the headset. Easton works a little differently, you just kind of press it in there, then tighten the plug and tension the headset at the same time. It takes a lot of winding as the spring between the cap and the plug compresses. The Reynolds is the better design IMO.
Make sure there isn't any grease between the plug and the steerer tube.
Swimming Workout of the Day:
Favourite Swim Sets:
2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
If the expansion plug is slipping, then tighten it. There are different types of expansion plugs, which are shipped with different forks. Eg Reynolds, just tighten that sucker hard in the steerer tube, and then use the top cap to tension the headset. Easton works a little differently, you just kind of press it in there, then tighten the plug and tension the headset at the same time. It takes a lot of winding as the spring between the cap and the plug compresses. The Reynolds is the better design IMO.
Make sure there isn't any grease between the plug and the steerer tube.
Swimming Workout of the Day:
Favourite Swim Sets:
2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [Record10ti]
[ In reply to ]
"Okay...fork brand is NOT an issue "
Whatever... Have you had this problem before? I have. I would tighten my HS, head out on a ride, and by the time I was home it was loose again. Turns out my lock nut was slipping on my reynolds fork. I needed to tighten the compression nut inside the steer tube to 80 in/lb - I was not getting it tight enough by "feel" and needed a torque wrench. Once I did this, the problem went away.
If the brand of fork is Reynolds or Easton, you can tighten this by yourself, at home, just make sure the compression nut is tightened the right amount - look at the install instructions for this. Other brands are different - I remember someone telling me about one that needed to be glued in place with epoxy or something... I would go to your best local LBS and have them sort that out.
Whatever... Have you had this problem before? I have. I would tighten my HS, head out on a ride, and by the time I was home it was loose again. Turns out my lock nut was slipping on my reynolds fork. I needed to tighten the compression nut inside the steer tube to 80 in/lb - I was not getting it tight enough by "feel" and needed a torque wrench. Once I did this, the problem went away.
If the brand of fork is Reynolds or Easton, you can tighten this by yourself, at home, just make sure the compression nut is tightened the right amount - look at the install instructions for this. Other brands are different - I remember someone telling me about one that needed to be glued in place with epoxy or something... I would go to your best local LBS and have them sort that out.
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
That is odd then.
What you may want to try is that if you have a carbon steerer tube.
1. Make sure that there is no grease on the steerer.
2. Make sure that there is no bladder in the steerer that is obstructing the pulling system.
3. Take some light emery cloth and rough up the steerer just a small bit.
4. Make sure you torque the stem bolts (they are tighter than you may think)
The top bolt, once the stem is on properly CAN BE REMOVED - that is not a bolt that needs to be under tension at all. Dont use that one to try and keep adjustment. It is common that if you have a bunch of spacers that you will get loose, try to have just one spacer - if you have 3+ smaller thin spacers in the stack. I would not think that this at all is due to the headset, that is unless the headset is being crushed (Stronglight). My guess would be that a new HS would not solve this issue - but a King is really really nice.
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
What you may want to try is that if you have a carbon steerer tube.
1. Make sure that there is no grease on the steerer.
2. Make sure that there is no bladder in the steerer that is obstructing the pulling system.
3. Take some light emery cloth and rough up the steerer just a small bit.
4. Make sure you torque the stem bolts (they are tighter than you may think)
The top bolt, once the stem is on properly CAN BE REMOVED - that is not a bolt that needs to be under tension at all. Dont use that one to try and keep adjustment. It is common that if you have a bunch of spacers that you will get loose, try to have just one spacer - if you have 3+ smaller thin spacers in the stack. I would not think that this at all is due to the headset, that is unless the headset is being crushed (Stronglight). My guess would be that a new HS would not solve this issue - but a King is really really nice.
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
From the Reynolds Site....
[ In reply to ]
http://www.reynoldscomposites.com/Manual.pdf
STEP 7: "With a 6mm hex key, turn top cap clockwise to a torque of 22in lbs
This step "preloads" the bearings only. Tightening the top cap does NOT keep the headset from becoming loose. Be sure to complete Step 8 before riding.
To me, there is no doubt that if you are using the top cap as tension on the bike, and for more than pre-tension during installation, your HS is adjusted wrong. Often times the pre-tension system is with the fork, and the HS will come with the ever popular star washer that ONLY goes into forks with metal steerer tubes.
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
STEP 7: "With a 6mm hex key, turn top cap clockwise to a torque of 22in lbs
This step "preloads" the bearings only. Tightening the top cap does NOT keep the headset from becoming loose. Be sure to complete Step 8 before riding.
To me, there is no doubt that if you are using the top cap as tension on the bike, and for more than pre-tension during installation, your HS is adjusted wrong. Often times the pre-tension system is with the fork, and the HS will come with the ever popular star washer that ONLY goes into forks with metal steerer tubes.
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Last edited by:
Record10ti: Mar 3, 04 8:56
Re: From the Reynolds Site.... [Record10ti]
[ In reply to ]
Yup, in my case I don't think I was getting the bearings pre-loaded properly because the compression nut was slipping before the top cap hit 22 in/lbs.
That's why I needed to tighten the compression nut to 80 (I think, maybe it was 70...) in/lbs. I believe that is step 6...
That's why I needed to tighten the compression nut to 80 (I think, maybe it was 70...) in/lbs. I believe that is step 6...
Re: From the Reynolds Site.... [JohnA]
[ In reply to ]
Thanks all. I really suspect it is the expansion nut slipping (it is a Reynolds fork), so I will try to find a torque wrench and tighten it. I am only using the top cap to preload the tension, but erhaps I am not tightening the clamp bolt tight enough. One problem I may also have is that particular stem (TTT Forgie) only has one clamp bolt--I prefer two for a better hold on the steerer tube. I will check out all the other suggestions as well.
And who says technical posts never get any responses on Slowtwitch?
And who says technical posts never get any responses on Slowtwitch?
Re: Chronic Loose Headset--Help Needed [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
Had this same problem on my carbon steering tube last year. I did what someone else already mentioned, roughed up the steering tube somewhat. Has not happened since.
Re: From the Reynolds Site.... [tri_bri2]
[ In reply to ]
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Re: From the Reynolds Site.... [Record10ti]
[ In reply to ]
The Reynolds top cap has 2 main parts, the lower expansion plug and the top cap. Do NOT remove the expansion plug, its there to prevent the stem from crushing the steerer tube. The top cap can be backed off after tightening the stem, but not --I repeat NOT-- the expansion plug.
Swimming Workout of the Day:
Favourite Swim Sets:
2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
Swimming Workout of the Day:
Favourite Swim Sets:
2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?