Cars don't kill people. People kill people.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

No. 100% no. The basic purpose of more firearms is to hit a target for sporting purposes. Like a PSA handgun, PRS rifle, over/under shotgun, or most recreational firearms the basic purpose is to hit a target for sporting purposes and not to kill somebody. If you take umbrage with weapons meant for hunting then I suggest you state that fact clearly for all to see.

The fact that you think most firearms are meant to shoot people or animals shows your ignorance about the design and use of most firearms.

I suggest before you start opining on the use/misuse/regulation of firearms that you learn about their actual use/misuse. (edited to "of" firearms from "if" firearms

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My training

Agreed. People are dumb.

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My training

I completely disagree with this. You had a lot of good points in this thread, but you completely lost it on this one. There are many ways I could explain to you why this statement is completely wrong, but, I will use images instead to illustrate the biggest reason you are wrong.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

hahahaha

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

Lets add up the target firearms and the killing ones. Which pile is bigger? Based on sheer numbers of guns made.

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

You are absolutely, positively wrong. Most guns are designed for and used as range toys.

EDIT TO ADD: If this were not the case, places like Glockstore, RockYourGlock, CheaperThanDirt, Apex Arms, Rainier Arms, DSG Arms, Damage Industries, Zev, Lone Wolf, Blacklist Industries, Wheaton Arms, Advanced Armament, KKM, Pew Pew Tactical, Ghost Arms, Midwest Industries, etc., etc., etc., would be out of business rather than a multi-billion dollar business.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Each of these images portray firearms that are used by white supremacists and law enforcement officers to shoot POC, right? What did I win?

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My training

You're just plain incorrect. And your continuing inability to separate how something is used from what it was designed for doesn't speak well to your ability to tackle the subject matter at hand.

I have no problem with firearms for hunting, or for self defense, or for law enforcement or the military. I'm simply not naive enough to misunderstand the reason those weapons exist, and the purpose for which they were designed.

And I don't really feel like, after more than 20 years of military service, I really need you to tell me to learn about the use of firearms.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Dude, im pretty sure im right. Think about it, The highest produced guns in the world were designed for war. For example, The ak7 tops the list for the most produced gun of all time.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...st-produced_firearms

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

You are not right. You are talking about volume produced, not number designed.

Assume there were only 10 different gun designs in the world. Assume only 1 was the AK and the rest were range toys. Assume 1 million AKs were made and the other 9 designs only produced 100k combined. Using your logic, most guns were designed to kill. But that isn’t the case. Only 1 gun was designed to kill out of 10. This is the logical fallacy you are attempting to use. You said “designed,” not “manufactured.” That is false.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Really surprised by that given that I suspect almost everyone deals with vehicles regularly whereas most people don't have much of anything to do with guns. I figured vehicle death rates would have dwarfed firearm rates.

Here is what i said



Im specificically talking about VOLUME. most guns belong to the killing category. Youre talking about different types, im not, and i made that clear when i said to put them into 2 piles, pile all the guns in existence, into 2 piles, kiling, and target guns, which pile is larger?



Not 1 ak7 or 1 m16 ro represent all, i literally mean every fucking gun. Every ak7, every m16, every biathlon gun, every target pistol...etc. one of those two piles is larger. Which is it?

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

Sweet mental gymnastics.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

And here we go. This is the point of the debate were veganerd, being proven wrong, moves the goal posts. This is the primary reason no one can take seriously a discussion with you.

Here is what you said in Post 29: "Also, most cars are designed for transporation, most guns are designed to kill. Theres a clear reason why they are treated differently, even though both are dangerous."

You doubled down in Post 38:

"What i wrote is not a fallacy, but ironically, what you wrote is. Its a non-sequitur. Just because something isnt used for X, does not mean it wasnt designed to do X. By your logic, nuclear weapons arent designed to kill since most do not.

Nearly all of the guns in existence are designed to kill."


You used the word "designed" multiple times. You even distinguished between "used" and "designed." Now it appears you want to clarify your position. Ok. I will accept your clarification.

You and I can agree the AK47 is the most produced firearm in the world. But, then you and I have to agree (1) that is only one of thousands of designs of firearms, (2) there are very few actual AK47s in the hands of civilians, (3) there are hardly any AK47s (not variants, actual AKs) in the US, and (4) outside of war zones and military troops, the AK does not really exist.

So, now you want to claim the majority of guns currently or recently manufactured were done so "to kill." Well, I could split hairs, but, if we want to discuss that, ok. Given the sheer volume of military rifles produced each year, yes, in raw numbers, we can agree.

However, we have been talking about guns in US airports being carried in by civilians. The discussion then moved to responsible gun ownership by US citizens. The discussion then moved to firearm use by US civilians. Given that context and your repeated use of the word "designed," you are wrong.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Sorry, but on this one, it's you who is really squirming to try to avoid the conclusion veganerd was making. It was absolutely clear that veganerd wasn't talking about the majority of firearm variants, but rather the number of firearms total. And while yes, an AK-47 is just one type of gun, each one of them that is produced carries the same design.

We were talking about the sheer number of guns vs the sheer number of automobiles. We were talking about the designed purpose for the two categories of items. The vast majority of automobiles were designed with the purpose of transportation. Likewise, the vast majority of firearms were designed with the purpose of injuring or killing an animal or person. If you need someone to spell out that these statements include the caveat "were designed or share a common design" then I'd suggest you're just making things more difficult than they need to be.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

I moved no goalposts. I made a statement. Im tellibg you what i meant by that statement. I showed you my quote where my meaning was clear. You simply inserted a meaning into my argument that i didnt.

I said most gun, meaning adding up all the guns. Its quite a common way to speak and understand. People do it all the time with little issue.

Lets change the subject matter to illustrate...

"Most corn grown in the us is not grown to feed people"

Do you have a problem with this statement?

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

He's a lawyer. He's pouncing on one word to lawyer you. He can't help himself.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Cars arent made for transpotation, theyre made to turn wheels!

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

No, we are not. Words have meaning. Context has meaning. He tried to claim all guns were "designed" to kill. There are thousands of gun designs. The majority of those designs were not created with the intent of the firearm to kill. That is a fact. If that were the case, we would not have multiple calibers, compact designs, different grips, different sights, etc., etc.

You know military weapons, no doubt. You absolutely are not familiar with the civilian firearm market.

If you want claim the majority of guns manufactured are for military purposes, I would agree. That was not what he was saying, however. Several people on this thread understood that. You and veganerd were saying one thing and thinking another.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

No. I am responding to the claim he made. Words have meaning. The order of words have purpose. Context dictates the meaning.

It never ceases to amaze me the limitations on people's ability to express themselves via written word.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

"Grown" is akin to "manufactured." "Grown" is not akin to "designed." If you were to say most corn "designed" in this country is not "designed" to feed people, that would have a different meaning than most corn "grown" in this country is not "grown" to feed people.

I am dumbfounded by the inability of so many to articulate a point via the written word.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

They are just a tool to hurl tons of metal down long stretches of fake smooth rock. How you use them is up to you.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

Here's some Kleenex for when you're done stroking your statutory-interpretation-applied-to-the-LR-for-the-sake-of-winning-an-argument boner.

An Indy car is not made for transportation. A NASCAR car is not made for transportation. Rally car, drag racer, demolition derby, show car, restored classic car, etc. are not made for transportation. If one were to say "all cars are made for transportation," one would be wrong.

You are a lawyer. You know words have meaning. You also should be familiar with logical fallacies and poor articulation via the written word.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR