Same thing with IMMD. What they don't tell you is that you don't have to register for these events to be entered in the lottery. You can just send in a 3x5 card. You know, laws.

I get why nobody is registering for IMMD but what's the deal with Boulder?

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

There have been a few threads about the course: swim- challenging due to altitude, uninteresting bike = no climbs, no scenery, uninteresting run = concrete on a multi-use path with a bunch of civilians. Not the best of Boulder. WTC even advertised IM Boulder on their Kona broadcast.

Where does one get a 3x5 postcard for mailing?

No purchase necessary, detail inside :)

Isn't Boulder one the supposed epicenters of the tri world here in the USA? By virtue of that it should do fine, right? Look at the Austin 70.3. You can't find a shittier race than that, certainly not the best of Austin, and that f'n race keeps humming along with 2500+ racers each year.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

maybe that's the impression people have but none of it is true.
The swim is not made more difficult by altitude. It's only 5000ft - swimming at 9000ft is a big deal - 5000ft is not as long as you swim within your ability. Most people coming from sea level don't have a problem with it.

The bike course is great - and is about 100 times more scenic than Arizona (which sells out fast), plus it's a faster bike course.

The run is slow for whatever reason, but the Boulder Creek path is not that uninteresting. There is one out and back section which is boring but the rest is pretty cool. Comparing with Arizona again, the run is significantly more interesting, although maybe 10 mins slower.

So if people want a fast race, this is a good one to sign up for. The swim and bike are probably faster than IMAZ, the run is probably a little slower. But it's a much more scenic and more enjoyable race. I think most people are put off by the altitude but that aspect is not a big deal. The "dryness" is probably more of a legitimate concern than the reduced oxygen

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

But where can I get a 3x5 card?

This supports what I have been hearing, they are hurting because their races are not filling up

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Isn't Boulder one the supposed epicenters of the tri world here in the USA? By virtue of that it should do fine, right? Look at the Austin 70.3. You can't find a shitter race than that, certainly not the best of Austin, and that f'n race keeps humming along with 2500+ racers each year.

There complex reasons that make a race/event a success of the short to mid-term. Just because Boulder is one of those training-mecca's, it would seem intuitive, that this would be a race that would be VERY popular. But as I hinted at, what seems intuitive and logical, up-front, does not always work out well in the end.

Look at events like the Boston and NYC Marathons. If another race put participants through what you have to go through to get to the starting line of Boston or New York - they would call it poor customer service and participant abuse - but when you are Boston or New York you can get away with certain things.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

I guess they found some room on the pier.

Agree 100%. I have run both of these races and the logistics made these a one and done for me - especially NYC. Will never run it again - just not worth the hassle. I look for similar simplicity in IM races. I don't want multiple transition areas and being shuttled to and fro.

The Maryland giveaway was for the 70.3 World Championship in Chattanooga. That doesn't give me as much heartburn as free Kona slots just for registering.

Edit: not free in the sense that you don't have to pay for it, free in the sense that you didn't do anything except sign up for Boulder.

Oops. My bad. If it makes you sleep better, just think of it as a resurrection of the Kona lottery.

I agree, doing Boston once was all I needed. Do not need to do NYC, which after what they did to folks when it was cancelled, I would never do that race out of principal..

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

What part of the NYC cancellation procedures did you have a problem with? I was in the race that year and had actually flown all the way to NYC before they made the announcement. Seeing the city after the hurricane, I still didn't have a problem with the decision. I ran my marathon in Central Park that day and had a great time, then went back for the race the following year. It was fine.

No pro race!! Pink? Maybe? Maybe not.

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/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/

At the Ironman store. $4.95, plus standard shipping of $7.95.

No need for pink. There is a pro race at Boulder this year. Though I don't think that it means that much to many, I am starting to wonder if having a pro race at a WTC event draws a few more entries.

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------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New Training/Racing Log - http://www.earthdaykid.com/blog --- Old Training/Racing Log - http://colinlaughery.blogspot.com

Thanks. I just bought a pack.

Awesome...next thing you know all the IM Sheeple will feel compelled to laser off their M-Dot tatoos ;-)

I think the low attendance is very predictable based on the low population of the region. Anyone who doesn't live in the Denver metro (less than 3 million people) has to fly there. I'd bet that every other ironman has a much larger local population to draw from.

Are you joking or can you really enter just by sending in a card? If so, can you share the link to the card?

^Nevermind, I found it.

See 5(b):

http://www.ironman.com/~/media/87268916f5c64007a977a9c4b9d5d2ca/official%20rules%20%20%202017%20ironman%20wc%20race%20entry%20drawing%20boulder.pdf


This makes it legal. No actual purchase necessary.

Yeah. I live in Boulder and love it here but that race looks awful to me.

couldn't agree more Rob. I PR'ed my swim at Boulder. Yes it is murky but so is Arizona and everyone raves about it. The bike is faster than AZ in my experience as well. The run is also more enjoyable as there seems to be fans cheering in a lot of places and near the finish that narrow path with fans cheering is pretty cool. Altittude was not a problem as I just backed off the bike a little and my numbers were still faster due to the thinner air. The paved roads for the bike are pretty darn smooth too. I dont really care about views except for the run because I dont have time to take a gander while riding, to busy keeping my eye out to be safe. Santa Cruz takes the cake on views during the run anyways :)

Have you been to Idaho?

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#swimmingmatters
Laugh hard. Run fast. Be kind.
The Doctor (#12)

Yeah both Cliff Drive and Natural Bridges would take a lot to beat scenery wise!

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

The decision could have, and should have been made much earlier so folks could not have had to fly there, to only find out because of the political pressure, they canceled.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I don't disagree but it was ultimately the right decision, and the compensation options they offered were fair. I've run the race twice since then and will go back.

I agree it should have been sooner. I was in the Orlando terminal about to board the plane. I was happy with the refund and Southwest even gave me a year to use the flight. They even sent me the race medal so I have a cool conversation piece for the only time in the history of the race it was canceled. Goes with my luck.

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http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com

I wonder if those poor folks we flew over from Australia got all the costs they had recovered? Lost wages, time, etc.

Again, we all get to elect where we spend our time and money. I just see they costed a lot of folks time and money just so many were forced to spend their
money in hotels. Just my opinion.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

As kny pointed out, this is simply bringing back the lottery. As far as I've noticed, they have done lotteries for 10 slots for 2016 and this new 10 slots for 2017 (for Kona) which is far short of the 100 they used to give away so we should see this as a good thing if they keep these limited to 10 here and there without going close to 100.

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

I'm not going to keep hijacking this thread, but tough shit, man. Me and a lot of other "poor folks" from all over had to spend a lot of vacation time and money when Tahoe was cancelled at the last minute too. That's life. There are worse places to spend vacation time and money with no race than NYC (and Tahoe). I'll just add that it was a beautiful weekend in NYC after that race was cancelled. I had a great time doing stuff other than the race.

So what is the deal? Can I send in 3x5 card. What would theoretically happen if I 'won' an entry.

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your discounted price above (from WTC or whatever they call themselves today) almost made me wanna send for them now, before they sell out of 3x5 cards :-|

I should just buy extra cards - kona? who cares about that? I want those cards.

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I saw this on a white board in a window box at my daughters middle school...
List of what life owes you:
1. __________
2. __________
3. __________

I instantly thought the same thing. But you do have all of say, Montana to draw from for CDA (no nasty comments about MT please), I love the place, really. But, not exactly a zillion tri-geeks there.

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I saw this on a white board in a window box at my daughters middle school...
List of what life owes you:
1. __________
2. __________
3. __________

All this really just makes me want to do IMAZ even less (if such a thing were possible) rather than to want to do Boulder more. The boulder course isn't awful, but it just seems like a missed opportunity to me. I'm semi-local and and there just are too many far prettier and less crowded places I can go and spend a day outside for free. For out of towners, I just don't think it highlights the best of what CO has to offer (though it might print a pretty accurate picture of what life is like in much of the front rage, i.e. congested and expensive).

While I think there are plenty of even more lackluster venues than Boulder they tend to be adjacent to larger population centers. You have 20+ million people in SoCal for whom IMAZ is driveable, 6 million+ in the Houston metro alone to put up with IMTX.

If we aren't going to be able to draw on locals to fill most of the slots, I think you could in theory put together a far more scenic and memorable venue in Colorado. I say 'in theory' of course because that would most likely involve heading up higher which means harder/slower. I think WTC has learned their lesson already on how their consumer base of super-duper-ironman athletes responds to a proper challenge.

yeah - the 106west tri is very much a CO experience race but at 9000+ ft, might be too diabolical for most people!

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Next time you run across a lawyer, hug them. Having put on drawings before, you have to provide a way for someone to enter without having to pay as that is considered a barrier for fairness. Yes, you only need to submit a 3x5 card and you could potentially be packing your bags. Two things instantly come to mind:

1. Will an entry that gets submitted by 3x5 card really carry the same "weight" as another person who entered by paying the IM entry fee? Legally they have to but I am a slight conspiracy theorist....

2. If someone actually got a Kona slot by entering a 3x5 card, would they actually admit it on this forum? (pink...but not really)

Yes! 100%. I tried for the lottery for 20 years including 18 straight. If my 3x5 card gets my a slot I will tell everyone!
I want to race in Kona before I die.
John

Ummm, I think all persons not in the active military or Reserves/Guard, or the retired Reserve/Guard, are considered "civilians". Just b/c you're doing an iron race does not put you in the military. You might say "non-racers" instead.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I grew up in Boulder = The Course really SUCKS ! my 2 Cents, Was there for the Inaugural Race as a Volunteer.

Really? Do you honestly think anyone didn't understand what he meant by civilians.

Damn, I was hoping there'd be tanks and shit.

I'm sure everyone understood what he meant but that is not the point. The point is that just cause you are an "Ironman" does not mean you're a military man. Too many people trying to pretend like they're in the service, or have been, when in reality they have not been in ever. That is all.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I spectated last year. I happened to be on vacation in Dillon. I will do it in 2017. Looks incredible.

The new date of June 11th can't be helping with registration, at least for anyone local. Last year it snowed well into May, and, consequently, access to open water swimming typically doesn't start until mid to late May. Seriously, who wants to train all winter only to peak for an Ironman just as summer is beginning?

I can't find it. Can you please share?

Any Ironman race or 70.3 has a 3 x 5 for sale in their merchandise tent with MDOT logo for $700 and your first newborn. <pink?>

Have you considered completing 12 x IM's to qualify for the IM Legacy Program?

I almost signed up for IMMD. Land on Canada thanksgiving which provides a long weekend. Problem is the venue is 1.5 -2 hrs from a major airport.

True story that won't make you feel better:
In 1996, my buddy The Spook got into Kona on the lottery. I was there in support role, and while at registration, I started scanning the start lists, which they had broken down into ages,country, state etc.

I spot patterns the way other guys spot phoney boobs. I noticed that every state had at least 1 person representing, except...North Dakota.
I tell The Spook, who got in from Mississippi, "I bet IM wants every state represented, but nobody from ND bothered to send in a lottery app."
The next year, he flys to Fargo, opens a P.O. Box, sends in a lottery app...boom. In.
Year after that, doesn't have time to go to ND, enters again from MS...boom. In.
Year after that, flys back to ND...boom. In.

Good times.

-bobo

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"What's good for me ain't necessarily good for the weak-minded."

i've done arizona 3x, and would describe that as a pretty flat course; even the outbound uphill grade is pretty mellow. i looked at the boulder profile, and not sure i'd say that it looks to be faster, can you describe why you would surmise that ? thanks.

I've done IMAZ twice and I live in Boulder. Boulder is definitely as fast or faster. I've ridden 4:36 at IMAZ, and for the same power my equivalent time in Boulder would be under 4:30. The reasons it's fast:
1) thin air means high speed. On the Neva Rd section at Boulder I can usually ride 36mph without riding very hard (and it's not a downhill). The only place on the IMAZ course where that's likely is down the Beeline, in fact my max speed in 2015 was around 36mph at IMAZ, 44mph in 2014 with a tailwind. At Boulder there are several places where I usually hit 44mph without even trying. Your speed is also sustained quite easily which I think also makes it fast.

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

I'm sure it's already been covered here somewhere, but Boulder is also only 109 miles and change.

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_________________________________
Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

did you pick up the pet rock as well from Nordstroms' with that?

Yes and a

Isn't this about every WTC event?

Challenging swim due to the shear number of people who go out at one time who can't swim very well.
Uninteresting bike because they keep it flat so it doesn't scare people away and they don't sell out.
Uninteresting run for the same reason the bike was boring.

So many threads on here want to know about easy "ironman" races. I can't imagine it being "boring" as the deterrent. Maybe people are just scared of the altitude being too hard..

People might not realize that will be 2 ironmans (or one and then one that is short 3 mi on the bike) in a span of 2 months and change....Ouch.

Interesting in the rules you have to validate by doing at least a half Ironman, did the old lottery require that? Also interesting it doesn't have to be WTC branded.

"In order to validate and use the prize, the winner must demonstrate, by August 27, 2017, such winner’s personal completion of a triathlon consisting of, at a minimum, a 1.2-mile swim, a 56-mile bike ride, and a 13.1-mile run, between October 8, 2016 and August 27, 2017, so as to ensure the health and safety of the winner and all other participants during the course of the IRONMAN® World Championship."

People complete two ironmans in less time than that on a pretty regular basis. They will be fine.

Edit: Also, Boulder is in June and Kona is in October, so I'm not really sure we're on the same page here.

I can only vouch for 2006, but I assume it was the same in most years prior to, and after that.
Yes, the old lottery required a 70.3 validation. Back then, it DID have to be a WTC-branded race.

It looks remote on a map, but I think people from the midwest don't realize how easy it is to drive to the Denver area. Once you're west of Topeka KS or Lincoln, NE, you can pretty much cruise at +/- 85 mph in light traffic. Compared to traveling in more densely popluated areas, you can really put some miles under you in a relatively short period of time. It's a fairly easy day's drive from Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Des Moines, Omaha,Wichita, or Kansas City. If you have any sort of driving stamina, Denver Metro is reachable in a long day's drive from Chicago, Milwaukee, St Louis, Minneapolis, Dallas, or even Indy. We live in East Central IL, only 2 hours west of Indy, and vacation some summers in the Dillon/Breckenridge area, about an hour and a half west of Denver. We leave at about 5 in the morning, and typically land at the condo well in time to enjoy watching the sun set over the mountains on the far side lake Dillon.

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"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"

Has anyone here actually been persuaded to register for Boulder because of this, whereas you otherwise would not have (or would not have registered until much later)?

Yep, in 2006, it had to be an official 70.3. Before WTC launched the 70.3 brand, I'm not sure if you had to validate, but I think so. In 2007, it went to being just any 70.3 distance, no longer needed to be IM brand.

I got in via lottery in 2006, and had to validate via Buffalo Springs 70.3 ( Lubbock, TX ) as that was one of the only ones still open! ( WTC had not yet bought out Spirit of Racine 1/2, which I was already signed up for ).

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I ride Felt.

Yep - you;re correct...the WTC's playing the shell game with races and dates....Boulder used to be in early August...now its June. IMCDA used to be in June, now its August....

They had the same rules for the entry into the 70.3 Worlds by registering for IM Maryland (no purchase necessary), but if you watch the FB videos of the live announcements, it's stated numerous times that you have to be registered for Ironman Maryland to be eligible for the free slot. Maybe they're just trying to pump the race and not give away the "fine print", but I get the impression that the winners are registered for the race. Is there any way to check? I didn't see an entrants list.

You ask if there is any way to check if the winners of the Kona slots registered for Boulder.

Yes, you can mail a self-addressed stamped envelope to WTC by Jan 31 to get a list of the winners of the slots. Then, when the competitors list for Boulder is published online, you can check to see who among the slot winners also registered for Boulder.

My great confusion about the no-fee entry for the Kona drawing was whether the Post Office would correctly handle a 3x5 card that is stamped and dropped in the mail. I put it in an envelope, hope that doesn't DQ my entry.

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Sharon McN
@IronCharo
#TeamZoot
Clif Bar Pace Team 2003-2018

No, I'm asking if there's a way to check to see if the winners of the 70.3 Worlds slots that have been announced on the IM Maryland Facebook page are registered for the race. I didn't see an entrants list posted yet for Maryland. If all 10 of the winners are registered for the race, then I would think there's a pretty good chance that they're not considering any entries that were mailed in "without purchase".

I think having an athlete hit and killed on the bike course is bad for business.

That took the race off my list, but I'm not sure what percentage of potential registrants outside the local area even heard about it.

Certainly took the 140.6 off my list, but also the 70.3. From LA and have a few friends doing it, decided not to due to bike course issues.

I never understood why they bothered hosting an IM with such a boring effink course. Make people work! Climb olde stage, run up the dirt path on boulder canyon road, somethin...

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

If I didn't already have an IM on the schedule I would probably sign up.

Umm, permitting? Also I can promise you it's not like Dave, the RD, wants to make a "boring" bike course. We can sit here and yell about adding Flag, Sunshine, St. Vrain, blah blah blah but they aren't happening. You need OKs from an awfully lot of groups and people to make that happen, much less the kind of clientele that wants to do that kind of riding. And from what I have seen over the years, and has been exhausted on ST, most athletes don't want to have to work that hard.

"I don't want to work that hard in an IM"

-_-

And it's apparently struggling. Just saying..

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

yup and there is that!

Steve, your Boulder and IMAZ bike times were pretty close this year, was your power similar?

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____________________________________

Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Yes - power was quite similar...but setups/fit were entirely different for the two races.

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_________________________________
Steve Johnson
DARK HORSE TRIATHLON |

Can you share the link?

The run course is worse than the bike course. I think its interesting that rather than trying to fix what's wrong with the race (the course) they resort to a gimmick like raffling kona slots to try to bump registration.

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Dimond Bikes Superfan

Not that I am arguing with you, but I am curious as what you mean by the run course being "worse" than the bike course? If you mean much harder, then yes I will agree with you. For reference, look at all of the athletes that very literally run about 3:00 flat at races like AZ or even in Kona, yet barely break 3:18 or so at Boulder.

So my question to you would be what is your preferred and realistic run course?

I have personally raced IM Boulder all 3 years mainly just because I live here. That's enough for me and am moving on to other races, but I still don't really understand good alternatives that actually make legitimate sense for the run course. Taking over a path is a lot easier to sell to Boulder City Counsel than shutting down more roads.

First two winners announced:
https://www.facebook.com/IronmanBoulder/

WTC just published the participant list for Boulder (~950? not exact count but close enough to know the promotion didn't work that well...) and i found 9 of 10 slot winners on the list. The only name not on the list who was one of the surprise visits, Beth Hunt I think. Perhaps she registered with another surname but even if not, 9 of 10 doesn't sound right if they considered post cards as I would bet they received more cards than registrants. I know we aren't surprised but I wonder how this looks for their 'no lottery' ruling.

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

I'd bet they didn't get very many postcards. Other than here I never heard about the postcard option anywhere else - either online or in the triathlon community in my area.

I know they got at least 1

Calling the class action lawyers....

Make that 2

FWIW - 10 slots also on offer for registering for IM Australia.

Lighten up, Francis

Everyone who registered for Boulder got entered in the lottery whether they were interested in Kona or not. So, you've got 950 lottery entrants and 9/10 lottery winners from those 950. Statistically, one can assume there was in the ballpark of 100 postcard entrants then. And this sounds about right considering very few people likely knew of this option; probably only slowtwitch readers.

The real question is, has this lottery served any purpose to WTC? They've given away precious Kona slots that they could have given auctioned off or allocated to AGs. What did they get in return? Did this lottery drive up registration numbers? Hard to argue that it did.

Well, they didn't know until they tried. Going forward, I doubt you will see any more similar promotions.

KNY would you mind explaining how you came up with 100 for mailed in ballots, just curious.

Also I notice that Australia does not offer the 'no purchase necessary' option.

hadukla said there were 950 registrants and 9 of 10 lottery winners were registrants. So, if statistical odds held in the lottery (far from a guarantee, just ask the Orlando Magic), then one can deduce there were in the neighborhood of 100 non-registrant lottery entrants, ie postcard submissions.

Thanks (head down emoji as I shuffle back to basic reading and math skills class).

The cynical side of me thinks they threw away those postcards as they were received. No revenue=no chance :)

Follow-up that person he visited whose name I couldn't find, turns out he says innthe video that she was in fact registered making it 10 for 10. I could believe that most people didn't bother to read the bottom fine print for no purchase necessary and from this very thread, even many STers weren't too thrilled at the revival of the lottery so i could see 100ish.

Australia lottery is apparently being run by a different legal entity so that allows it to be a true lottery, it seems

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

Ok, if all 10 lottery winners came from the 950 registrant pool then odds are that there were 68 or fewer postcards in the lottery.

(950/(950+x))^10 = 0.5 resolves to x = 68.

Do you think, with your history of following Kona Slots, that this is a probable number? Seems low to me, but I've already demonstrated I know nothing.

Presumably if you subscribed to WTC marketing materials you would have gotten an email promoting this lottery option and been able to find the fine print describing the mail-in alternative? I'm just trying to think how many people would have actually known that this option existed outside of those following forum posts like this or perhaps FB pages.

Personally, I knew about the mail in option and simply couldn't be bothered to actually do it because my interest in WTC events has been so eroded over the past several years that what was once my singular dream, going to Kona, just seems more like a very expensive inconvenience to me.

With admitted confirmation bias, I'd like to speculate that at least part of a reason no one entered the mail-in is the same reason that they had to offer slots to registrants in the first place-- the Ironman ship has sailed.

Another reason no one may have been accepted from the post card entries could be a technicality.

They requested 3" x 5" post cards. Apparently, 3" x 5" is too small to be handled by the US Mail, so you have to send in a 4" x 6" or larger post card. I guess you could send in a 3" x 5" index card inside of a letter, but that could be rejected since it's not a post card.

My guess is they just rejected any submittal that wasn't a "3" x 5" post card" which would have most likely been all of them.

I haven't the foggiest idea. It's obvious the postcard option was there purely to meet legal requirements of a lottery and was not something WTC wanted hyped but rather were just hoping to drive registrations to an event. So, I wouldn't be surprised that next to no one utilized the unadvertised postcard avenue, as appears to be the case based on 10 of 10 slots won by registrants. On the other hand, you never know what information will spread like wildfire throughout social media, so I also wouldn't have been surprised if it had become common knowledge that the WTC Kona lottery was back in effect, but this time for free, and that they received tens of thousands of postcards as a result. Unless WTC cheated and threw away the postcards it is clear the former happened rather than the latter, but if you had asked me upfront how I thought it would go, I could have argued either way.

That would be devious. I'm going to remain an optimist and guess that they didn't do that because:

1. it's wrong and unethical
2. WTC doesn't really care who gets the 10 slots. Their ambition is to drive registrations to Boulder by giving the appearance that registering for Boulder exclusively gives you a chance at Kona. They hope the fine print postcard method remains secret so that people register for Boulder rather than send in a postcard, but if word did spread and they got thousands of postcard submissions, discarding those submissions does not change the fact that the primary goal of driving registrations to Boulder failed. So why risk it?

Considering the problems the last lottery ended up costing them I have to believe they are doing this on the up and up. It also makes me think/wonder if they are legally required to divulge or share how many people actually were entered, how many won by postcard etc..

Surely someone on a late Friday afternoon has nothing better to do than garner this info

Hawai'i 70.3 now on the lottery drawing block. Makes 3 races with 10 Kona slots each (+IMMD for the 70.3 WC)

So it appears they take away the 100 lottery slots and slowly replace it with race registration lotteries. Sure it lives up to the 'everyman' philosophy but it didn't seem to help Boulder much, doubt it will help Hawai'i 70.3. I do wish they drew it and rolled it down at the post-race celebration rather than announce and wait for claimants, would be more exciting.

Oh and legacy now gives 200 slots... so more crowding in the back of the pack too?

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

The new bike course for 2017 is great. Have rode twice recently. 3 loops with some long gradual climbs and fast downhills and flats. No technical sections with very smooth roads makes this a fast course. Have done 14 IM's, 6 different loactions and 25+ 70.3's and this is definitely one of he best bike course IM has in the US

That is awesome to hear! How is it compared to last year?

Sorry I couldn't disagree more. What is great about 3 loops of the same crap? How boring can you possibly make it? Wait, let's do 4 loops next time on the Boulder Peak course. I did the same last week as you did--I was holding my words on the 2nd loop. The problem is they released the new course after sign up/registration was opened, thereby having those like myself, assume they were still on the 2 loop course. At that point I was already all in with the 2017 schedule & that was that. IF they are going to change the course I wish they'd get that in stone before registration goes live. I like that it is earlier this year for heat reasons, but man, 3 loops is really going to suck.

Post edit: I may have been a little too honest above & in hindsight, should comment that at least those involved in putting on the race are putting it on for us & seem to be trying (although not succeeding IMO) at making this a more enjoyable race for all & spectators while keeping costs/impact to the community down from a transportation issue standpoint. While I may not like the new course since released, it's more than I did as far as putting a race of this magnitude on. At least I recognized my stance may be a bit lopsided...