Yup. Those are super, super nice.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Why'd they set an Attack on the rear?

Agree that it looks cool and all, but without data it's a crap shoot.

And you're right, it REALLY should have the "Turbine" brake track...

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

I assume everyone will be clamoring for aero data (preferably independently confirmable), but yes, this leaps straight to the top 3 most desirable front wheels for me.

It will be interesting if there is data with different fork designs and power to spin.

Fantastic!

Brake surface not so much :O

Are you saying this because it isn't carbon?

And actually works in all conditions without fuss?

Now, hopefully the CdA is as good as the old H3 with wide wheel Crr.

Exactly.....inquiring about availability date and aero data release.

I already am looking for a hed 3, but depending on timeline may hold out for the plus

is this built in the new GT format?

oddly this is more expensive than the GT by quite a bit.

I was told a couple of months, so go from there :)

Are these front-wheel drive or is the drivetrain suddenly on the left?

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if you can read this
YOU'RE DRAFTING!

not quite as wide and a bit deeper

Boo. I'll try to bum my dad's Hed 3 for my last race then until I can get a clearer picture to make a choice between my 9/H3/ or an H3+

Yeah, all black more pretty;-)

and they can stand up on their own, even when leaning. great safety feature, can't lay 'em down.

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"Outwork your talent." Kevin McHale

From the video on their website, you can see that the valve extends cleanly from the rim, and not into one of the spokes. (yeah!). I have a set of H3s and this is the only criticism - it's a PITA/nearly impossible to pump with a CO2. But this new valve location is ideal.

how is 2700 more than 3100 by "quite a bit" ?

Has anybody seen the price for a front wheel only?

looks to be the same as normal h3, and that goes along with what I was told, ie 1300

This probably sounds nuts but, for... $1k... I'd buy one if it had the "turbine" brake track. They just look so cool. Looking cool is good for 5w, right?

I wonder if they made the hubs any better?
Could never understand why the hubs on the H3's always seemed like garbage, not smooth, wobbly freehub body, etc.

If they used Boyd's new Eternity hubs that would be pretty cool. Just dreaming here though.

Are those actually happening? I think the rear needed a redesign. Haven't heard anything about them since March.

Why'd they set an Attack on the rear?

Because they are smart? Pretty sure it's turned backwards also. What have I been telling you?

Clincher (tubeless compatibility unknown)

The video shows a tubeless compatible rim.

I'm really not sure why they bother with a rear at all?

Do Trackies run dual H3s?

No but hipsters do.

I corresponded with them via email two weeks ago and they were scrambling to get the redesigned hub ready for Interbike


Yay! Even though I'll likely just stick with a latex tube, it's always nice to have options.

I corresponded with them via email two weeks ago and they were scrambling to get the redesigned hub ready for Interbike

Cool. Glad they redid it. When they introduced it I was worried they'd end up like Alchemy.

Which HED disk is the best match for the H3 Plus front? Is it Jet Plus?

Probably. Something that fits in your frame and is wide, I'd guess.

With all the great, aero wheel sets you can get now for under $1300, the only reason I can see anyone buying these is bling.

my h3 hub feels great, granted it is a 2015 and way better than the 1997 model I once had(that thing felt like a garbage disposal)

This. Have to admit I'm dubious. I always thought that the narrowness of the H3 was better for a front wheel (for fast guys anyway), but I suppose I could be wrong.

If your frame can take it, I'd say yes. No penalty to being wide back there and you get a bit of additional cush for your tush.

I work in San Francisco and the proper hipster setup is a deep front wheel and H3 rear. That actually makes a bit of sense, as those things can't pop spokes and are supposedly indestructible, if not comfortable.

And don't forget to chop your bars down so narrow, your fists are touching the stem.

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/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/

With all the great, aero wheel sets you can get now for under $1300, the only reason I can see anyone buying these is bling.

Probably a more sensible allocation of funds than most high end bike parts.

I didn't really study the new wheel, but does this come off of the same DuPont mold that hed bought and used for the past however many years, or does this wheel come off of a brand new mold? In the past, wheels like the h3 deep used the original DuPont/specialized mold and then hed added the additional carbon for the depth. I'm thinking if it's the same mold this whole time, even for this wheel and the gt3, that mold would be very profitable for them, especially if they sell a lot if units at that price. If it's a brand new mold, then maybe the high price is needed to recoup the cost of the mold? That's quite a lot of money in either case for a wheel set imo.

I'd be willing to wager that this wheel is from a new mold.

Who knows. We don't know anything and they probably won't tell us.

It has to be new mold(s) because of the size difference between the designs. Couldn't make both wheels from the same molds and it wouldn't be reasonable to modify the H3 molds to make the H3wide (irreversible modification).

This brings up the question regarding what parts of the wheel geometry has changed and how that will affect the unique aerodynamic properties of the H3.

Also note that the H3 is made in Spain and finished in minnesota. The new H3wide is probably also made in Spain.
http://www.slowtwitch.com/...cling_base_4001.html

I am regrettably selling my 650C HED3 clinchers as I've got a 700C bike now. I will really miss those wheels. I was never as good as the wheels, but it's nice to have really cool nice things.

Knowing the HED3 is getting an update is perfect timing for me. I might actually have to get back on my bike rather than sitting on my ass messing around on Slowtwitch. THEN I could justify getting a new set.

IF only the rear had a deep option......

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TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

bumping this up... any data on the H3+ yet?

or any independent data on the GT3?

---

Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

Re-bump. Any new data out there?

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So two questions on this wheel:

(1) It's the latest and greatest version of the Hed H3. So why take a step backwards or not otherwise offer with the turbine brake track? Wouldn't it be just as easy to offer with the turbine track as with the silver aluminum track?

(2) Why not tubeless? I get that with a 100% carbon rim, you have to redesign the entire layup to get the tubeless compatible bead hook, but the H3 uses an aluminum rim. And Hed makes a number of tubeless compatible rims. So couldn't they just use the bead hook design from one of their tubeless compatible aluminum rims and use that rim shape for the H3 Plus?

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Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
https://vimeo.com/user11846099

The H3+ is tubeless ready.

So I bought an H3+. I can post pics later if wanted. It is tubeless compatible. It would probably be the easiest/best tubeless setup ever (no rim tape to worry about). That said, my recent forays into road tubeless have left me less than elated so I don't think I'll be going down that path.

I don't know why they didn't give it the turbine brake treatment though :/

Really? I looked on the website and didn't see anything and did some cursory searches and didn't see anything there either. Is there something I missed you can point me to?

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Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
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HED may not clearly state it on their website, but the H3+ sitting in my garage is definitely tubeless compatible. As greenplease mentioned, no tape is needed on the rim (not even using tape with latex tubes on it currently). I will do some tubeless testing with this wheel and a Jet+ disc later this year, or early next year when I start prepping what equipment I'll be running for next season's TTs.

I don't mean to belabor the point, but it sounds like the H3+ may indeed be "tubeless ready" in that you don't need to use a tubeless rim strip (since there are no spoke holes) but not truly "tubeless compatible" meaning the bead hook is not the special "squared off shape" that is designed to work with tubeless tires to lock the bead into place so that the tire can be used tubeless without sealant. Stan's has been selling tubeless conversion kits for years that work with normal clincher rims to convert them to tubeless - it sounds like maybe the H3+ is another wheel with a normal clincher rim that can be run tubeless, though perhaps not as securely as a true tubeless compatible rim.

---

Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
https://vimeo.com/user11846099

not sure how tubeless rims lock tires into place, but the entire + line from HED locks the tire at the rim. You have to physically push it away after you deflate to remove tire, from both sides

No, this is a tubeless ready/compatible rim. Tire beads pop and lock into place, just like any other tubeless ready/compatible rim I have laying around my garage.

OK thx. Now if only Hed would give us the turbine brake track...

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Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
https://vimeo.com/user11846099

The only hole in a H3 rim is for the inflation valve for the tube. So no special rim strip is needed ala tubeless rims with other holes in them.

Went tubeless with the Vittoria corsa speed and all went well mounting until I heard air leaking. Going around the rim its leaking at the brake track seam opposite the valve thru the brack track surface - where the pads would sqeeze - so the whole side wall. Its nice and locked in on the bead. I dont see how even tubeless tape could cover that as it wouldnt get up into the side wall.

Defective rim? Suggestions?

Well I was about to go verify on my H3+ as I just pulled the tire and have a Schwalbe Pro One laying around, except I'm short a couple of tubeless ready valves at the moment.

Are you sure it's the actual brake track surface and not the tire bead interface to the rim at that point?

I unmounted and remounted - even rotating the tire just in case it was the tire bead. Same problem. I may stick it under water to confrim but sure feels like whole track and i can change the tune depending how much of the track i cover up.

Bought the wheel used so if I have to put a tube in it, I'll be very disappointed but not sure anything I can do... Didnt see anything officially from HED saying they were tubeless. Got anything? All Google could turn up was another used ine for sale stating tubeless.

Cant go back to seller if its just us experts on ghe internet saying its tubeless.

You could try Stan's sealant? (or whatever brand you like of the same kind of stuff.)
http://www.notubes.com/Sealant-C14.aspx

I might try that. The thought of that on the brake track. Don't know if it would hold.

Why not just throw some tubeless tape in there anyways? That and sealant should take care of any leaking even if the rim bed is tubeless ready, which yours specific rim isn't if it's leaking air like that.

Something pretty thin like Scotch 8896 would be a good choice. $8, 10 minutes and problem solved. You shouldn't need to do multiple layers (I do 3 for road pressure) since there are no spoke holes to worry about. Maybe two wraps without building up the rim bed too much. Road tubeless tires can be an extra pain to mount if the rim bed is built up too much.

Yeah. 1 layer of stans would probably work since I have that. And sealant but now I feel like I'm creating a fault situation. Just stick a latex tube in it at this point.

Just note - I wouldn't consider H3 Plus tubeless ready.

I've emailed HED and I'll let you know what they say.

How so? Tubeless setups require sealant in the tire.

Required? Granted I haven't used tubeless road wheels but on the MTB, I didn't need sealant for the rim. Sealant was there but not so the rim would seal.

Don't get me wrong. I'll probably still try it. Guess I really want to know if anyone else is running it tubeless and this is a defect in the rim or just not really tubeless ready wheel.

I put two layers stans around the rim and that did help with the leak (holding ~20psi vs 0 before) but not ridable. Havent added sealant yet. Did spray some soap and it is the whole brake track but maily at the base (carbon/al interface) and near the upper 1/3 of the track.

Tried to take a pic of the seam.

So is consensus that if sealant works, safe to ride? Go back to worrying about life's other problems? No heating it up while braking concerns or anything? Guess sealing rubber mentally is fine for me. Sealing aluminum not so much.

I'm eyeing the rim on mind and I'm completely baffled that what appears to be a solid rim wouldn't hold air.

And herein lies the differentiator to most true tubeless rims. A tubeless rim will not have this. After the rim is extruded and then bent into the curve this is the result. Some companies weld and then blend it back to final shape others leave it. This is predominant on Renn discs and h3 along with some other rims. For non tubeless situations, it doesn't matter. This is likely the reason it is not marketed as a tubeless ready wheel.

I'd so it is likely you can get it sealed, but definitely not an foolproof solution.

Eta: rims of this type are often referred to as "pinned" as there are little pins aligning the two sides. Other rims are welded instead. Both have merits but the welded idea is more prominent today.

Yeah. Thinking latex tube and be done with it. I'd trust that more. Really just thought going tubeless would be fun.

Going tubeless without sealant makes zero sense to me. Since you're so close, why not just throw in 30ml of sealant in each tire and give it a spin??

So I added sealant - specifically Flat Attack https://www.amazon.com/...ge?ie=UTF8&psc=1 - and it was fun trying to get the sealant to plug my seam on the rim. It basically has entailed 3 days and every position I could fathom but I think we're holding good pressure now.

A couple observations - sealing the rim is harder because you cannot just spin the wheel as that throws the sealant to the tire. I would pump it up to 120psi and then put the brake track seam to the bottom and let the sealant pool there then I laid the tired flat or flipped it so that the seam was at the top. Essentially I was trying to get the sealant to fall into the seam a little bit at a time.

Once that started to seal, it was really interesting to see where else the sealant showed up. Not gaping but at various points around the track I could see it slipping out between the tire and brake track.

But the most interesting, in my opinion, was the tire (Vittoria Corsa Speed) which had lot of air bubbles on the gray sidewall just from mounting it. This is a tubeless ready tire but still required sealant to seal it. Guess I just wasn't expecting that but the sealant did eventually work itself everywhere it needed to go.

So in the end, yes, I think you can make the H3 Plus tubeless and I plan to race it that way (at least a B/C level race at first) but its a process to get it right - not like my tubeless mountain bike setup which was pop and go.

Also, the 23mm Corsa Speed measured 27mm wide @ 100psi. the HED brake track is crazy wide (not just the width of the rim, like Zipp).

And in closing... It just hit me... the 27mm wide might not fit on my tri bike (test ride was on the roadie) as the 25mm Conti 4000S rubbed the downtube when it was mounted on some Zipp wheels (I think that was 27-28mm). All this might just have been a fun experiment...

Just some constructive notes:

Flat Attack isn't worth using.

"Tubeless Ready" means it NEEDS sealant to work.

Check out the Stans videos on sealing tires. They kind of shake the rim while rotating and then set the wheel on its side. Start at 1:30 and watch his sweet moves.

The sidewalls are really what you're sealing when setting up tubeless tires. It often takes a few days to fully seal. Simply spinning the rim doesn't do much to seal the system.

Road tubeless pressures often benefit from more particles in there. Stans or Orange Seal with a teaspoon of glitter or pepper for every oz of sealant is a good place to start.

Good video. The shakes would have been a good move.

Why not air attack? Doesn't dry out for years and tested very well.

So maybe I just don't remember or had a different setup but getting the mtb tubeless wasn't as involved. Either way, I ended at the same result. Just checked it again and holding pressure.

Thanks for the info!

Flat attack isn't intended to be used outside of inner tubes. It specifically says not for tubeless applications. The test where it 'tested very well' even mentioned that.

Anyone have a review/thoughts on these? Competitive Cyclist is running a special today, thinking about picking up the front for $900

It's fast and looks awesome. It also feels like it's built like a tank.

Let's talk H3+ tire options for a minute.

Many of us think that H3/GPSS20 has been the fastest front wheel option out there for a while. So what reason would there be for going H3+? Answer must be to be able to use wider tires without sacrificing aero.

OK, so what does that mean? GPSS23? Turbo Cotton 24? Are those really that much better rolling than GPSS20? I think you could get away with something measuring 25 or maybe even 26 on the H3+, but would have to test to be sure. Does anyone make a no compromises 25? Turbo Cotton 26 maybe?

Those of you lusting after this wheel: what tire were you thinking? Remember I want the holy grail tire, not something you're going to use in training on glass infested roads. I don't care about that.

I'm currently running a 23mm GP TT. Check out Josh@Silca's latest post regarding the "rule of 105%". I'm not going to measure it now but, iirc, my H3+ is 27mm at it's widest. That means I'd want to run a 25mm tire max (I'm not aware of any fast 26mm clincher tires in the market). Most modern tires balloon a bit on modern rims so a 24mm Turbo Cotton or a 24mm Continental Force seem like good choices (Force tested well in TomA's recent roller testing though there's some suspicion that was a "magic tire"... but the Force is still known to be fast).

IF they run truer than my old 650 H3's from about 10 years ago (the rear had a bad-ish wobble that HED said was within tolerance) (theirs maybe, but not mine!), then I might be in the running for a set. (and I don't even race anymore! LOL)

Aero is fine, but nothing beats the Uber cool look of a set of H3's!

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TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

The H3+ is 25.5mm wide, so if you use the 105% rule you get about 24.3mm. I guess the question becomes: is H3+/GPSS23mm better than H3/GPSS20mm? Tom A's spreadsheet gives the GPSS23mm a few watts advantage, but the extra width might come with a bit of an aero penalty (not sure).

I used a Turbo Cotton 24 on mine for a couple of races. That tire measures ~26mm on that rim. I plan on going down to a 23mm tire on that rim for next season.

Got a current model H3+ last night and stuck in a tubeless valve, popped on a Schwalbe Pro One tire, added some Orange Seal and tire seated perfectly the first try, not even a drop of sealant came out from the rim/tire interface. Checked this morning and tire seems to have lost almost no pressure.

BTW the 23mm Pro One on the super wide 25.5mm Hed H3+ rim measures a full 26.8mm across.

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Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
https://vimeo.com/user11846099