Kicked her in the vagina, of course. Gotta keep dem hoes in line.

The preferred nomenclature is cuntpunt

"What would you have done? "

I would have done nothing except to accept that nowadays triathlon is full off self centered all about me types. She's a perfect example. They've always been there, but I honestly believe not so much in the old days. Maybe that's why I don't do them any more.

You did the right thing to come to us. We just need the name of the event and her finishing time.

---

Find out what it is in life that you don't do well, then don't
do that thing.

A pump in her spokes obviously.

Exactly. Nothing like a good 'twitch hunt. (Sorta serious, why doesn't ST have a wall of shame?)

Although there is a lot of sarcasm in these replies, I think you did the right thing by calling her out. I have called people out as well. People are afraid to be assertive these days, and are often timid. Say something, it creates social pressure.

Called the cops and filed a restraining order....

Seriously, these roidsters are nuts. You are lucky she didn't bring her "trainer/handler" or a gun.

It takes a special kind of a$$hole to not only cheat, but when confronted about their cheating, to fight back and say that you are wrong for calling them on it.
You did the right thing, they did the wrong thing, twice. You can't do anything else, just hope she gets DQ'd frequently in the future.

I find it quite funny sometimes that people don't see getting drafting penalties as a bad thing. I read a race report from a guy in a local team, he said he was very happy to break 10h even after 2 drafting penalties. I read it as, 'I cheated on the bike to help me break 10h', but I guess there are different ways to see everything.

This.

Also maybe tell the officials.

I would have laughed at this.

---

http://www.jt10000.com/

You could have said ''if it's no big deal, let's go talk to the race director'' and see what she said.

What race was it? Was she the women's over all winner?

---

---------------------------
''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law

The officials were told and they talked to her though I'm not sure what was said. We didn't see her go up for an award so I'm guessing she was DQd or just declined to show up.

What got me was that had she just laid low hardly anyone would have known, but since she decided to argue loudly after the race she pretty much should have just grabbed the mike from the race director and declared her love of cheating to the whole event.

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

Should have gotten her race # found her name and posted it here of course. Public shaming is sometimes the only way.

However if she was DQ'd then I guess justice was served.

She's probably a big Lance Armstrong fan if she loves that move!

Are you asking whether or not you violated USAT rule 3.3? It's probably in the grey zone, but nobody will care.

Was this in eastern NC? Be hard to hide with that few people in the race even with the concurrent events.

I would have pulled out my phone and videoed the conversation and posted it on Youtube and linked it to here.

Well, that's interesting. I believe I was at the race with you. I hear the hubbub but didn't know exactly what had happened. I'm sorta curious now because I'm fairly sure I saw the same thing, but wasn't certain as I went by them pretty quick and was only half paying attention. My basic question is...did the guy in front know what was going on?

He didn't actually. He thought Carl was yelling at him for a moment there!

Funny.

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

and now that I've thought about it, I'd be interested in knowing where in the course it happened. Assuming you are who I think, you and I came out of the water at the same time but looks like I exited transition first so I'm not sure I would have seen exactly what you did. I'm almost certain I passed them (or her at least), and then you saw them a bit later.

The curious cat in me wants to know who it is (pm me if you feel like sharing). I do most of the races in this series and run into the same people frequently. If this is a common thing for her, it would be nice for folks to be on the lookout for this sort of behavior. I had on the black/grey camo with the orange race series logo. There was an incident at last year's race involving a woman in the top 5 with poor sportsmanship (cursing, confrontation, etc) and I guess I'm curious if it's the same one.

well dang there's more of us flatlanders here than I realized. Looked like you guys had a pretty good presence. I'll have to try to catch up with you guys next year. I'm an hour and a half to the west in the 'big city'

It was a small race. Less than 100. Apparently that's her justification for drafting.....that it was a small race and didn't matter. I'm gonna try to refrain from clues as to the wheres and whos though. :)

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

We should let this go because her intent was good. She was doing it for overweight kids. She is noble. We need a thread to positively track the progress of this cheater.


I would like to donate to her 50/50/50 fund (50 cheats in 50 days in 50 states - all from her own home, in one day... because she is a cheater).

understand 100%. Pretty sure I know who it was anyway. Definitely don't want to restir the pot and making that the focus of an otherwise good time. Mum's the word.

Sad, though, that some take it so dang seriously. That small race is one my faves just because of the setting.

the small races are where I do most of my cheating. The prizes are just so damn awesome...Free socks, t-shirts, hell sometimes even a BMX helmet or whatever the local bike shop has to get rid of.

I don't think you guys understand how big the *small race cheating scene* or SRCS underground really is. It's a pretty big network of us across the world, and we will win all the prizes...

Is Washington nice this time of year?

I see what you did there.

---

Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

Ha. It is if you live in a 'big city' most of the time. And actually, yeah, Saturday morning it was 65 when I pulled up- definitely a nice change this time of year.

I generally pass them and smile... sarcastic comment maybe and then step on it when I pass "them". If you have to explain it to them, they're not going to get it any better than before you break it down for them... especially cheaters in our sport. My philosophy on that and other things. I once had another competitor ask me outright if I wanted to "work" with them on the bike... no, no I don't want to work with you.

I just don't get cheating in an amateur sport, but that's from my perspective.

Then the world is full of these types of a-holes...
See politics, religion, business, sports, love...

---

#swimmingmatters
Laugh hard. Run fast. Be kind.
The Doctor (#12)

I was at this race too and heard of the argument after the race. From my view when I passed the three of you, there was one guy riding to the right, she was slightly to the left one wheel back, then another guy on the inside of her less than two wheels back of the other guy and half wheeling her. The three were riding like that for a solid 30+ seconds as I came up behind and passed. I don't know who is who and don't really care. However from my view, the girl and the guy in the back were drafting.

Man I knew I should have raced on Saturday instead of trained as scheduled

Sounds like it was a pretty easy group ride, you did better on your own.

There we go. I was getting a bit worried that nobody had yet called out and attacked the OP.

I couldn't find a greyish-pink font. Can a question really be an "attack"?

Why are you attacking me now?

I'm not.

I had just assumed that, given you asked a question.

In my opinion, it's not a quality complaint thread unless the OP gets called out. Your comment was the closest. I'm really disappointed in how we're slipping.

Glad I could be of help!

Since you're asking, I don't think it's your job to confront her unless you are working in an official capacity for the race. Turn her in to race officials and leave it at that. She's not committing a crime so it's really none of your business beyond informing race officials. You shouldn't be telling other people what to do unless it's an emergency or dangerous situation.

It's got nothing to do with her being wrong; it's the question of the extent of your involvement in the matter.

I just wanted to say how much I enjoyed this thread so far.


just awesome.

---

@christopher_borden •
Spinning Spoke • Dimond Bikes • Flo Cycling • Castelli Cycling

I disagree. We need to police each other; otherwise, the cheaters will do what they want whenever they think they can get away with it. Hopefully, the cheater the OP was referring to will think twice about blatantly drafting in her next event.

So if you came by someone blatantly drafting in a race you wouldn't say anything? That's fine I guess but there's a few of us that are gonna feel otherwise. He said his piece and moved on. If anyone was confrontational it was the drafter who crossed the finish line, sought out Carl and went to yelling causing a scene that only further implicated herself. The point is that drafting is cheating and that's wrong. I see no reason not to call someone out for that.

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

I believe the right way to do it is to inform the race director. You have no business giving other people directives if you are not operating in an official capacity. And when you do confront, it will likely have the opposite effect that you desire. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise. At most, you could make a quick and short comment such as, you are cheating and I will be informing the officials. Yelling at someone and getting in their face rarely if ever gets positive results. Any adult should know this.

No I would not give another person a directive in the middle of a race. I would turn them in to the race director if it bothered me. Do you think positive results are achieved by telling other adults what to do in a heated and confrontational way? (and i'm not talking about dangerous or threatening situations)

If I were really concerned, and I understand the concern, I might say, "you are cheating and I'm turning you in, just so you know". That's very different that telling another person what to do. You're telling them what YOU are doing. That's a massive difference.

The OP yelled at her and told her to knock it off, and from what I can infer, moved on to his own race. So it's not like he stayed with her and continue to yell or harass her. I believe the situation got out of hands because the woman actually seeked him out later to confront him about it which is not doubly wrong of her.

On the role of fellow competitors wrt rules, I believe it's even more important for small races. There aren't enough officials for these smaller races to enforce the rules and athletes should take upon themselves to remind others to follow the rules. Fairness is essential to competitions.

I've actually witnessed a married couple racing same race and wifey saw husband in huge pack and yelled at them all.

Husband said chill everyone is doing it and unable to avoid blah blah blah.

Side note, of course none of the other athletes knew who she was and he said kind of sheepishly, "that's my wife."

When someone sees a blatant wrong, which affects fairness of race it is normal to call it out.

That's where I disagree. He was telling her what to do. That's not his role. You shouldn't be telling other adults what to do if you're not operating in an official capacity. He should have just turned her in and maybe let her know that he was turning her in. Small race or not, just let the race director know exactly what was happening. Observe and inform, sure, but your job is most certainly not to give directives.

I'm only talking about the OP's actions. And guess what, they only served to piss the woman off. If that's the goal, fine, but it's likely not going to have the intended effect of motivating her to stop cheating. I think most adults would know this basic aspect of human psychology.

The race is so small it is impossible to not run into each other. They were both drafting from what I saw, so no wonder there was a confrontation. They were both in the wrong and both of them should've just let it go. Like Jason80134 pointed out, don't expect someone to be nice to you when you bark orders at them mid-race. Especially if you are also cheating. I understand mentioning something if it is directly affecting your race. Just don't be surprised if they get mad at you when you call them a "cheater" and whine about it on ST.

Last year, I split a dad and son on the podium. I thought "cool, nice that they have that to share." Then, I looked at the results and they exited T1 within 10 seconds of each other and entered T2 within 10 seconds of each other, then the son took off on the run (and passed me.) Just last week, I saw exactly the same result at another tri: same dad and son, same bike start and finish times. Now I'm thinking "great, dad can help son cheat." In their defense, I never witnessed any drafting, so I suppose they could be riding legal the whole time.

Would it have been ok to yell "Way to cheat ya drafting cheating bitch!!" Because you know, it isn't like he was giving her any directives. He was just being observant with is outside voice.

Ok. But we're talking about someone cheating. On purpose. I don't see that as adult behavior so perhaps we have a case here where treating someone like an adult is out the window. I agree with you in general, but this is triathlon not real life. :)

And with aero helmets on, whirring of wheels and wind in the ears there does have to be some kind of raising of voices.

He confronted her at the time of the incident and caught her red handed. That's the time to bring it up. Any person with remorse would stop then. And if she did that probably would have been the end of it and the only thread of value today would have been about getting DQd for peeing during IMLP.

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

Wait, so who else did you see drafting? The OP or the guy in front of her or someone else?

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

Reporting the incident to the RD wouldn't have changed anything if they didn't see it themselves. The cheater was upset because she was called on it. Shame can be an effective motivator.

See my first post in the thread. Both were drafting however I don't know how long exactly b/c I passed them and moved along with my race.

But you said you dont know who was who but it sounds like you are calling out the OP for drafting. Are you sure you know who appeared to be drafting?

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

Reporting the incident to the RD wouldn't have changed anything if they didn't see it themselves. The cheater was upset because she was called on it. Shame can be an effective motivator.[/quote]
This is true. Some races are so small they cannot afford to have officials and the race staff is handling multiple duties on race date. It would always be a he said she said thing until she sought him out which created witnesses.

I know your question wasn't directed at me, but I passed 4 of them together sometime before the OP did fairly early in the bike segment. The only reason I really remember was because I was counting people I was passing to figure out my place and this was 4 all at once- in hindsight I guess I was like 7th/8th OA at that point, and that's how I figured out it's the same people. I followed them for quite a while (maybe a mile or two- long sight distances at times) and 3 of them stayed stuck to each other the whole time with one out front clearly legal. I don't recall where the woman was, but not in front. I went by them and didn't pay much attention. Can't say for sure they were illegal, but it was close.

If you want to call someone out, that's your choice. She earned it IMO. Cheating is cheating and it sucks. May as well as cut some corners somewhere too, right, I mean it's just a small race. Hell, let's dope it up a bit too, and let the air out of your competitions tires.

The part I think sucks the worst is the confrontation afterwards. If you cheated and got caught, have the good grace to be humble and move on. No need to turn it into something worse. Like being mad at the guy that caught you and displaying poor sportsmanship for everyone to get involved with.

All I can say is what I saw. The OP never mentioned her staying on his wheel and never mentioned anyone else drafting off of him, so I assumed that was him on the inside of her as I passed the three. If I'm wrong in my assumption, then sorry. I don't personally know the OP, but I know that was the group he was talking about 100%.

Aren't you telling an adult what to do right now??

---

-------------
Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

Shame dealt out in a confrontation manner is effective only in your imagination. No offense.
Well, it's effective in achieving the opposite of what you're intending.

+1

[/quote]
OP asked for advice and opinions. You may have missed that at the top. Do you think the cheater lady asked for his opinion?

Shame to correct behavioral problems is actually a good motivator, if done correctly. I agree using a confrontational manner is not the most effective approach, but in the heat of the race it would be difficult to be sensitive and polite about it if the person is being blatantly obvious about it.

"I'm gonna try to refrain from clues as to the wheres and whos though. :)"
-----------------------
Why?

---

David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

I should amend my earlier post where I said she didnt show up for awards since evidently she did take home hardware after all in her age group. That being said and at the risk of rendering this whole thread into further ridiculousness.....it turned out what we were all racing for and what was so precious that it deserved cheating on one person's part to achieve was, in fact, a selfie stick. Small tri awards are awesome! D:)

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

just didn't want to add flames to the twitch hunt. S'all.

Cheers,

---

thechromedome
http://www.favoritefinishlines.blogspot.com
http://www.cupcakecartel.org
My 20% off code for 2018 FS Series races: tricred18
"there are no drafters in heaven" - C Bonner

Maybe the appropriate response would admit to yelling at her and tell her you don't give a fuck...it's just a local race.

I think the Selfie stick is a very fitting award considering.

Exactly, so don't do it. That's my point. It won't work and you'll only end up pissing off the person, which is exactly what happened.

I don't think he needs her permission to share his opinion. He is free to say what he wants and in this case, I think it could have a positive effect. Clearly several people in that tri community now know that she was drafting, especially since she chose to escalate the confrontation after the finish. While she was defiant at that race, I bet in future races she will be more self concious about drafting and other people will have their eye on her.

---

-------------
Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

That's awesome! Given that it takes a certain kind of a-hole to use a selfie stick, we know this particular stick will get plenty of use by this particular individual.

Legally you can say pretty much whatever you want. Does that make it the right or most effective thing to do?

I'll take your bet and say that that woman will be more determined not to give in to that guy. Now she feels like it's an external thing. He can't tell me what to do. As opposed to it coming from a race director who has been informed of her cheating. It's not nearly as personal and therefore it might cause her to be more reflective. Do you not know human nature?

+1

Cheaters that are called out on it will be more reluctant to cheat in future races. That is human nature. I bet Mike Rossi will never try to cheat in a marathon now.

Sorry Jason, as an RD, I disagree. In fact, this is something we cover in the technical meeting for the marathon we produce. We expect fair play from our competitors, and reality is that our race officials are not able to be everywhere at all times. The way we phrase it to our athletes is that in order to protect the competition as a whole if you see something outside the rules say something (if you can get close enough to the person involved) and bring it to our attention afterwards. Why this came about...a few years ago well after the race (weeks) one of our top athletes told me about a small group of runners who had cut the course in an area that runners are supposed to stay on the right side of the street. I asked him why he didn't report it, and he said that it hadn't affected his race because he was in the process of going by those runners. I asked him how he would have felt if he was the guy who finished 7th (out of the money) and somebody had witnessed an infraction by one of the guys who got paid. When you turn it around that way it feels different.

An aggressive confrontation isn't called for, but saying something on the way by and then reporting the issue, to me that's the way this sort of thing will get cut down. The same way you want to give somebody a "way to go!" when they're having a good day and go blowing by you on the run, when you see somebody blatant cheating they should get called out for that.

Yelling to the drafter, "quit cheating!" = not how to behave like an adult.

Yelling to the drafter, "I'm telling!" = how to behave like an adult.

Do I have that right?

Shame is best served very publicly.

Telling other competitors about what you saw her do so that she can hear you - pointing her out to them and any one else in ear shot so she can see you spreading the word - making her feel the social condemnation and othering may impact her future behaviour.

Then again, she may very well be a sociopath, and not care one effing iota what other people think or feel.

Then you can point that out to everyone, cause nobody likes a sociopath. (Although many are unwittingly in love with one.) (And apologies to non-asshole sociopaths, you all aren't all bad).

---

Advocating for research & treatment for Myalgic Encephalomyelitis (ME).
http://www.meaction.net/about/what-is-me/

"Suck it up, Buttercup"
(me, to myself, every day)

Guy calls out a cheater...cheater gets pissed about it and confronts the guy who calls her out...

Guy is clearly the a-hole and should have kept his mouth shut...not the other way around...ok, got it...

I'm glad I don't live in your world.

Just as an anecdote to counteract all the BS about how cheaters shouldn't be called out because it doesn't affect them anyways....

I was in my first year of triathlon...coming down a hill with a left hand turn at the bottom (I have terrible bike handling at this point)...I descend faster than the guy in front of me and come up on him nearing the bottom of the hill...I am unable to go around due to the tight turn and didn't want to slam on my brakes...guy flys past me and yells at me to quit drafting and takes the tight turn like a pro...

Ever since that experience I have been so scared to even come close to drafting for fear of being called out. Maybe I am an exception to the rule...but I doubt it.

Cheater - yes.
Lady - not so much.

---

clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Hunt down her parents and punch them both in the face. When they ask what that was for, say "bad parenting", and walk away.

---

TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

Agreed. I would always call out a cheater.

1st IM on a 500M run to T1 a guy hands his wet suit to a family member shortly after the swim out. Abandoned equipment (way less of a "racing" issue than drafting). I called him on it and his response was "its not like I'm gonna win" (unfortunately we were both slow swimmers!). It's still a rules violation and he knew it. Cheaters at least need to know that we know they are cheating. How hard is it to carry a wetsuit over your shoulder for 2-3 minutes and stuff it in a bag.

Saw him later on the course. Crushed him on the run. :)

I've told others they were drafting and/or blocking, this guy stuck out because he essentially admitted he did care about the rules or felt they were for everyone else.

I think a good loud booing at the award ceremony would have been a good public shaming for her.