Agreed

No it was an Olympic. I think they're was no Moto as I didn't see one the whole race. Guess the official stood near transition and made calls. I just cannot see an RD ok with that. I would not be. I'd want more drafting penalties. Certainly not more penalties that do nothing to affect the race. I mean I still received the penalty so obviously I had a number on me....

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http://www.TriScottsdale.org

You just "nailed" my solution for how not to worry too much about drafting.

I work my butt off in the pool so I can get out of the water in <58. Result: T1, not a zoo. Road ahead pretty clear, and safer too.

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I saw this on a white board in a window box at my daughters middle school...
List of what life owes you:
1. __________
2. __________
3. __________

It was super drafty in Spain. The biggest problem was that the marshals were only blowing whistles and not handing out cards. After a while, the guys just settled into the routine of drafting and denying they were worse than anyone else. Very frustrating

I raced IM Barcelona - absolute back of the pack (14:42 finish) - the drafting was obscene by both pros and amateurs. After the first loop I got lapped by the pros and they were all together. Then I got passed by packs of 50 - 70 riders. Whistle blowing going on but nobody was carded or DQ'd.

The sad thing is that I even saw 3 to 4 riders drafting together, not even pretending not to.

Oh well, to each his own race...the course was beautiful, pavement smooth and I really enjoyed the day.

Here I have to give kuddos to IM Vichy. That race was perfect. The refs were very, very strict. Way to go !

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Fuck a duck and try to fly

Wave starts like Roth is def. the way to go. Doesn't fix everything but an improvement on mass starts.

At Roth they were super strict on drafting. Had loads of motorbike marshals handing out penalties. Plus the extra loop on the run course as an extra punishment.

Would it be possible to have a technological solution for drafting? Put a sensor on every bike that measures the proximity to other bikes and some sort of draft algo where nothing happens if you obey the drafting rules and for instance add penalty time for every second you're technically drafting? So for every second you're drafting you get for instance 5 seconds added to your total time?

I am aware that this is probably hard to realize both from a technological and cost standpoint. With the current number of athletes on course at Ironman events it's maybe harsh to expect everyone to fully comply to the rules, especially just after T1, so maybe the drafting rules need to be revised a bit as well. With a smart algo the rules can be more dynamic, so blatant drafting is punished harder than someone who takes a couple of seconds too long to finish an overtake action.

Yes in heavy climbing there should not be drafting rules, also naturally in tight corners or 180 degree turns rules can not apply even now

It seems like WTC racers are getting the best of both worlds now. Aero bars, disc wheels and drafting. Would times get faster or slower if WTC went draft legal but prohibited aero bars and disc wheels?

Umm, I for one get a little nervous when I hear Vichy is getting strict. Vichy has a bit of a history.

Faster.. Way fasfer especially on the run..

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Debating which race to do this year and this thread makes me sad. Feels like to get a real crack at an honest KQ you need to do a non-flat course...

Out curiosity, has any thought been put into a wave system that includes a KQ wave? E.g. if you want to qualify for Kona, go in a special wave near the front - might be easier to police if everyone is together. Not thought about it at length, just curious what the people thought

Drafting will ALWAYS happen on virtually EVERY course and has ALWAYS happened in the almost 40 years since IM began.
None of the solutions I've seen proposed will make much difference, there's just too little chance of being caught.

They may as well make it legal because 90% (at least) of drafters cannot be penalized whether it's intentional or not.
Might as well get used to it.

No disagreement, but the pictures above would be more telling if you knew at what point they were taking. For example, the one from IMCOZ appears to be right as you come out of T1 onto the main highway. Well, yeah, you can get a photo like that at mile 1 (or less) of every IM. More telling is what it looks like 20, 40, 60, and 80 miles down the road. And having done COZ in both 2012 and 2013, I saw rampant draft packs on the east side of the island on every loop (although I hear they are enforcing it better now).

Seeing this thread again, I remembered something else about that Barcelona course. The majority of the bike course road has roundabouts every couple of km. You can't *quite* ride through them at full speed. So it has a compression effect on riders, making it even harder for the strongest to ride off the front, and creating more packs.

Copenhagen had a sub 10hrs wave this year. It went off right behind the pros. Great idea.