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What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP
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If all I do is 15 min or 20 min intervals and single's or multiples of them, do you continue to adapt and increase your FTP?

If I only did for example wu, 2*15min at 85% wd - 50 mins, or same with 20 mins at 95% - and I tested monthly and adjusted those figures (hopefully up) is this the most efficient way of raising your ftp?

I only want to improve my ability to ride a bike split, I do all the riding indoors, all on the TT bike and I am time constrained (an hour weekdays, 90-120 mins once at weekend, twice if lucky) - is this the most efficient way of improving your ftp?
Last edited by: Andrewmc: Oct 17, 15 11:52
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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"is this the most efficient way of improving your ftp?"

Yes, in my experience. 2 National titles, 4 regional and 8 state titles to my credit doing just this. But most everyone else will tell you no. Graeme Obree had great success with it also.

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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [J7] [ In reply to ]
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does the duration of the rest interval matter e.g. 5 mins to much or to little for 15 and 20 min intervals? and does holding a particular wattage for the RI matter as its the long interval that improves the FTP?
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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On the trainer, I usually do 2x20 min w/ 5 min rest between, both really hard. On the road training, I will do a 40 minute time trial while trying to set a power PR.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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This approach would work for a lot of athletes as long as they continue to increase their tss.

Is this the best approach? Depends.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Nick B] [ In reply to ]
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increase TSS by increasing FTP on a monthly or 6 weekly basis? e.g. increase FTP by 5%, so just repeat the same workouts at the consequently higher wattage that 85 or 95% of ftp would equate to
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Sweetspot training is basically what you talking about.




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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
increase TSS by increasing FTP on a monthly or 6 weekly basis? e.g. increase FTP by 5%, so just repeat the same workouts at the consequently higher wattage that 85 or 95% of ftp would equate to

Retest when you think your power has gone up. Use current fraction of ftp.

Increase TSS as needed. Workload has to go up at some point or you'll stagnate.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [callidus] [ In reply to ]
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I know, i'm just wondering if I can basically do the same workout 5 times a week for the next 44 weeks and thats the best use of my time - or no worse than any other method and given its all done indoors, all done on the trainer and its all boring
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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I think the challenge doing the same workout 5x a week is mostly a mental one after some time ;-)
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
I know, i'm just wondering if I can basically do the same workout 5 times a week for the next 44 weeks and thats the best use of my time - or no worse than any other method and given its all done indoors, all done on the trainer and its all boring

It will work. Is it optimum? Meh, dunno. But it will work.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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A.k.a. UniModal Training^TM? I did that during the fall/winter/spring of 2013-2014, just to prove a point and to get ready for a Peaks Coaching Group training camp to which I had been invited. The result was the highest FTP I'd achieved in quite a few years.

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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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FTP is measured by a one hour effort. So you are essentially asking "If I am training for a 1 hour event, am I better off training for 1 hour, every day, in that sport, mostly at high intensity, or doing something else?".

All exercise/training is very sport specific. So in the short run I cannot imagine answering anything other than "yes, your best training is to train specifically for that event". Especially since you prefaced the question with the fact that you are time limited. With that low of volume training, you necessarily have to have a lot of intensity to get any fitness.

Long term, and with more time allowed for training, you would probably benefit from some higher volume work to build aerobic capacity.

2015 USAT Long Course National Champion (M50-54)
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
If all I do is 15 min or 20 min intervals and single's or multiples of them, do you continue to adapt and increase your FTP?

If I only did for example wu, 2*15min at 85% wd - 50 mins, or same with 20 mins at 95% - and I tested monthly and adjusted those figures (hopefully up) is this the most efficient way of raising your ftp?

I only want to improve my ability to ride a bike split, I do all the riding indoors, all on the TT bike and I am time constrained (an hour weekdays, 90-120 mins once at weekend, twice if lucky) - is this the most efficient way of improving your ftp?


Bust your ass for a year and I am pretty sure you will be a lot better.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Dan Funk] [ In reply to ]
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Cody Beals did something similar to this a while back. He wrote a blog post about it.

http://www.codybeals.com/...s-my-tailwind-how-i/
Last edited by: Sanny87: Oct 17, 15 14:50
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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That's basically what I did training for IM South Africa....as of 8 days before the race, my longest ride was 100 minutes. Most rides 3-4x per week were 50-70 min. Sunday before the race, rode 120 min at ~92% FTP which was my longest ride. Race week rode 3 and 4 hours on Wed and Thu at 60% FTP just to get used to outdoor riding and wind and time in the saddle (stopped in the middle for lunch on both days)....had my best IM of the year and my best marathon. I did that IM off run volume (no long runs just frequency), intensity rides, intensity swims, a few longer/moderate XC ski sessions (like 3-4 hours at the equivalent of 80-85/% FTP). Weekly volume was 15-19 hours. Very intensity focused.

I say you do it. It really works in my view. Noodling around for hours on end, is a big time sink.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrew Coggan] [ In reply to ]
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I thought that I'd read you had done something similar - riding round in circles (a campus) at a given percent of FTP you'd found had been most effective at raising FTP

Does it really matter if an interval is undertaken at a specific wattage OR just that it takes place within the sweet spot range?

Either way this is the plan now - thanks
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Sanny87] [ In reply to ]
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thanks for that - useful
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Following much discussion with the wife - this is my best chance at maintain fitness - its all increments of 20-30 minutes and with 2 under 2 I have to be brutally efficient now - so we'll see how it goes - I've lots of TV to watch so I'll just get on and see how it goes and raise FTP every 4 weeks

Are you seriously thinking about Nice 16? It should be a little cooler next year - early June and it may be a little quieter - it will be nice
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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My n=1 for a year and i don't use power for FTP but HR. I did a 1-hour TT (actually 45 km and 1:20 TT) and used that as my something base. some alphabet soup label and then based my percentages off that. I do 4xweek on the road 1 hour at 85% of that number. i actually have a kind of bell curve for efforts. at first very hard then sustainable and lately it has been hell trying to get my HR up there for the full hour and rarely am i hitting an hour but more like 40-45 min. my times have come down substantially AND i'm a 55 yo women in menopause (both which should be making me slower, so results i think are even better than the numbers state).

so yeah, working for me. my last HIM was a 15 someodd min PR (both bike and overall) and it felt ridiculously easy (well suffered a bit on the run...). it was my "easiest" HIM to date. go figure.

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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Sanny87] [ In reply to ]
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I also remember reading that however I think he has changed his approach.

This April he wrote:
Thanks Ben. My bike training differed a lot from last winter. Still 100% on the CompuTrainer and still averaging ~7 hours and ~4 sessions per week, but the intensity distribution was different. Last winter I did a ton of sweet spot and virtually no work above threshold. This year, my training has been more polarized with lots of VO2 work. I haven't done a single 2x20min, which was a staple last year. I'm going to post a summary of my build soon.

http://codybeals.blogspot.ca/...orleans-4th.html?m=1
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [workinprogress] [ In reply to ]
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That's the key thing to observe is that periodically changing "approaches" and workload is needed in order to keep developing.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [workinprogress] [ In reply to ]
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I read that post with obvious interest and without preempting the next one will you do a retrospective analysis of both? What you'd do differently

I've decided to do the most boring training in the world for the next year. All indoors and a lot of vasa for pool work. It's going to be an exciting year
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, looking into Nice 2016....hopefully it does not sell out by the time I make up my mind.
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Re: What happens if every bike WO is done at 83-97% FTP [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe Cody himself will chime in.
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