I love my Litespeed Saber, but, have found myself riding my Specialized Transition much more often b/c it fits me better.

To address your question:

- Too expensive and often times there is a shortage or delay in raw materials.
- Marketing. Everyone is trying to make the next slippery superbike and that mean aero. Ti (in general) cannot be shaped into a super aero design (real or perceived).
- Manufacturing. You can crank out plastic bikes. Ti actually requires time, effort, and skill.

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Hard to fabricate into aero shapes.

because carbon can be shaped in ways that titanium cannot be (without an insane amount of work) carbon is made in a mold and that doesnt take as much training as learning to weld effectively.

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who's smarter than you're? i'm!

I am cleaning up a titanium frame (that is also for sale) and wondering why no bike companies this year have a titanium offering. Litespeed is no longer Litespeed and Quintana Roo is made by the lowest bidder. For triathlon, there is no production company out there.

Details on the frame?

Lynskey?

I had the same question rolling around my head and seems to be as answered already.
Still ride my 2005 Litespeed Blade all the time !
You just know the frame will never be compromised and is always there ready to go...the components on th other hand have been changed three times.

Terry

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"You are never too old to set another goal or to dream a new dream" - Les Brown
"Discipline is the bridge between goals and accomplishment" - Jim Rohn

recently there was a custom Lynskey posted on here that was nice. but their current offering (T230?) is the same this year as it has been for the past couple years.

Litespeed almost came out with a new Blade, that if you search, you will find pictures of but the key here is "almost"

a Quintana Roo Ti-Phoon 2003 55cm. Currently on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/....l2649#ht_880wt_1325

Here are two off the top of my head:

http://www.evertibikes.com/eagle.html

http://www.bikesoul.com

I would love a Ti tri bike but my '04 Trek Team Time Trial just won't die.

trav

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____________________________________________________
"As for "xxxxxx"...what can I say? You sound like a dick. If you don't want to answer the question, just shut up." AllezPappa

...and one more...

www.roarkcycles.com

their machines are FINE!

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"The will to win means nothing without the will to prepare" - Juma Ikangaa

http://www.litespeed.com

I'm not certain you understand the manufacturing process for carbon.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

I am going to tell ABG on you, you had better watch your six.

The fact that ABG wants to warranty replace my custom Ultimate (polished) with a plastic bike really grates on me.

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

I'm quite certain I do. My comment was a bit over-broad, but, in the grand scheme of things, accurate. When was the last time you saw an "open mold," mass produced Ti bike?

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Gotcha.....I didn't realize that all the proprietary frame designs form Specialized, Trek, Cervelo, Giant, et al are now considered "open mold" frames. IOW, you are comparing apples and oranges. "open Mold" frames are a small segment of the market. Most companies don't use them.

Back in the world of reality, the reason you don't see an "open mold" ti frame is:

• alloyed titanium is not readily available in Asia, hence the frames coming from there are inferior in quality
• market demand for titanium is near zero.
• titanium is heavier, more expensive and harder to manipulate into shapes than carbon

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

LOL - yeah, I will call Bejing and make sure that they do not make "open" molds out of proprietary units. I suppose I can also ask them to not use the same for Nike shoes and what not. As for Ti being heavier than Carbon - stiffness unit for stiffness unit based on weight they are quite equal. Cost per ounce to purchase is very much on the side of carbon. Cost per ounce on the MFG side certainly goes to carbon once mould is created and finished. There is however very little if any reason to not have a Ti bike as aero as a carbon bike - Litespeed/ABG/Lyskey certainly dont seem to have too much of an issue making custom hydroform shapes out of flat stock sheet Ti.

Oh, and Ti is readily available - getting a six year old slave girl to unload it from a train and move it into the production area is another story.

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

I remember in 2002 doing Ironman Canada, seeing all the Light Speed bikes wiz past me up Yellow Lake near the Apex turn off and thinking that was the way to go. Then I remember some lawyer guy from California telling me Softride was the way to go and that Light Speed was all marketing.

Ten years later, its not about anything but training.

UM - you are so wrong. I can tell you at mile 112 when I am on a Softride or not. Any beam bike for that matter - it DOES make a difference, even in the way that you do not mash the pedals - ever. I got access to a 1996ish Klien Quantum II - I want to see you ride a hundred N. Illinois miles on it then tell me how great your legs and back feel....

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

Your poor reading comprehension is only surpassed by your lack of knowledge.

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Chicago Cubs - 2016 WORLD SERIES Champions!!!!

"If ever the time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams

Well, I am happy to read that you feel great riding a Softride. But I don't see Softride making any bikes and I don't see any pros riding them so maybe you can explain why. Also, can you explain why Titanium bikes are not popular?

I will gladly compare our collective resume's in the cycling and manufacture of bicycles....You could not be more incorrect about how hard it is to work Ti as compared to Carbon (or wood, or steel, or alu). Then again, what the fuck would I know - I have only been hanging out in MFG facilities and helping with RD/Test rides for twenty or so years - of course when I am not getting certified by United and Barnetts Bicycle institutes as well as more companies I can recall (from Shimano, Campagnolo, Mavic and on down the line) - I am riding bikes of every shape and sort.


You are wrong if you think that the Chineese are not copying "owned" molds at Martec or CarbonBike...I have seen them time and again. Not hard to find on the internet either. They are however hard to find in a retail establishment in the US / Canada as FTC and the Northern equal will rapidly put the cabash on things.

As for Ti....you are not too familiar with the way the downtubes and double swag seat stays are formed now are you? For Lynsky / ABG you will see a very light weld on the top of the tube (that used to be sheet metal). I have seen just about every air foil shape take place - on a bike. From there it is a matter of does the shape (vs- weight) fit into a frame that they can market and sell at a profit. I suppose however that you like knowing that you have less than $2.50 in raw material in your bike? Does riding plastic make you feel special? Is there some miracle to it (even though most of the TdF bikes by a large margin) are aluminum.

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

I think the number one reason, by far, is that the demand simply isn't there.

Then add the fact that Ti bikes are expensive to make and there is very little (read none whatsoever) ability to generate demand by being cost competitive. The shapes of the "aero" Ti frames are very simple compared to many of the top carbon offerings. Making something like a P3, P5, DA, Speed Concept, etc. out of Ti would result in a heavy and very expensive bike.

I have a Ti road bike which I love and am a huge fan of the 2005/2006 TiPhoon (minus the head tube). But I seriously doubt we will ever again see a production Ti TT/Tri bike that has any significant following. These are specialty bikes now.

whats wrong with the headtube?

I would be happy to explain. When Softride (Alsop) wanted to change up their bikes and move their facility (still in Washington however) they ran into a few hurdles. One was a family squabble of some sort - the other was the fact that UCI made the Softride (and Zipp and TitanFLex) frames not legal for competition. That was okay, Softide had the Tri area to go after. When they got finished with the "PowerV" (what a great bike) they decided they wanted to go lighter, and more affordable - that ment to to a metal. So, then the Rocket R1 and Rocket Classic came out. The R1 had two flavors, one carbon beam, one aluminum beam. The classic beam was always carbon with a "visco-elastomer" layer to provide the suspension by allowing the top and bottom to deviate from each other.

In the R1, now fighting even more with UCI and the scurge of being the bastard step child at now USCF and ABR Time Trials was fighting the "de'lamination" of the carbon beams (Rockett ones only). The Alu rockett beams never had any issues that I had ever heard of. Races were won all over the place on the bike - from Iron races to RAAM to 24 hour challenges (they are that comfortable).

Still with beam de-lamination issues there became an issues with the beams sleeve and attaching points cracking - this became yet another burden for the company at the worst possible time. When they claimed to have that fixd they came out with the FasTT7 - that bike was all of the features of th Rockett - only with out the bottom braket stiffness (shit). The market, us consumers and everythign with poor management lead to them to shut their doors.


Fastt7

Rockett R1

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?