ouch, payback is a b****, ain't it Astana?

Nibali will be lucky to fight for third step of podium. And with the hitters Astana has at the Giro, who do they have left for July? Other than Rogers who rode the Giro and Tour last year, looks like Saxo is saving their A team for the latter.

Hard to say how much energy he burned. One big effort and then steady-hard, without the concern of Aru and Landa trying to throw body (or low) blows all the way up. Once they were away, the climb probably wasn't much harder than what the group rode it, and he didn't have to make any further accelerations.

Nibali will be lucky to fight for third step of podium. And with the hitters Astana has at the Giro, who do they have left for July? Other than Rogers who rode the Giro and Tour last year, looks like Saxo is saving their A team for the latter.

Nothing is that bad. Except Northern Virginia at 5:30 pm.
There is a popular and very hard Wednesday night ride in my neck of the woods and I made the mistake last night of riding to the start- with a very talented young Cannondale rider and I honestly thought that one or both of us was going to get whacked. JV would have shit himself if he saw this. Not the way to end a promising career. (It's one thing for me to get whacked. I'm half dead already.) Over the past 3 years it has only gotten worse. The drivers are out of control and it's frankly, sad. I thought it might get better as cycling keeps working its way into the American fabric, but no dice. At least not here. It is really life threatening. I'll be driving to the start from here on out. Just not worth it.

i'd surmise Ben King or Dombro as they both have roots in MABRA land

i'd surmise Ben King or Dombro as they both have roots in MABRA land

'Twas young Joseph Llloyd. He "sits in" while we slaughter ourselves. Nice kid.

As for my purported xenophobia in an earlier post, some of my best friends are Kazakhstanian......I joke....

I don't know how it was construed from my post that I'm flag waving for 'Merica. My comments pertain not to nationalism but to economics and opportunities. I don't want anyone to become "more American" though admittedly, that can mean a lot of things so maybe in some ways I do.

Americans can out cheat anyone in the world it's true. But they've not led the way in world tour cycling. Lance and Co. ran into an EPO buzz saw in 95ish and decided to incorporate that well established industry standard into their approach. And they did it better than anyone. USA! USA!

I stand by my belief that kids coming up in Europe are more likely to succumb to the doping pressures than the Americans. It is and has been part of the fabric of pro racing over there for a long time. Pantini and Hinault and Indurain are folk heroes to this day, while Lance is reviled. Say what you want about the French, but they are probably the cleanest riders and most shamed by the doping when it occurs in their ranks- these days. The young Americans- Tejay, Joe D., Ben King, Phinney, Talansky, et al.....these guys have much more to lose than to gain by doping. Probably most relevant, is that a guy like Sagan or Boonen or Wiggo is an absolute rock star over there and they make a lot more in endorsements than in their racing contracts. American riders go completely unnoticed here (Lance excepted) and over there for the most part. So the money is not as big for American kids. The only people in this country who care about bike racing are bike racers. For Europeans it's more like baseball or football here. There's more at stake, ergo, there's more cheating. Similar to here in our big money pro sports.

They want to go to the show, make that money and get out and they are folk heroes back home. And I don't judge them. Walk a mile in their shoes....cleats, whatever. Just stating the facts as I see them. Zakarin, the Russian kid who just won Romandie lost 20 pounds from an already ripped frame. Does ANYONE think he did that naturally? He was popped at 19 for steroids. Porte, Froome...does this look like going to bed without dinner to you? Astana should not have a license. Their abuses are well documented. When Tiralongo and company can line up and lead up a climb like Postal back in the day, yeah, I'm skeptical.

I don't think they all come from mud huts on the hillside. But I do think the risk/reward of doping for them makes it more seductive.

God bless America.

Agreed re: Nibali. The tea leaves read the right way for him last year, but I don't think he'll have that shot again.

Lance and Co. ran into an EPO buzz saw in 95ish and decided to incorporate that well established industry standard into their approach

Is this true? Not to hijack the thread, but do we have any proof that Lance was clean before 95ish? Its a convenient story that makes him sound less bad. Kind of like how he raced 2008 clean.